<< <i> I understand the point but I disagree with perception that one should attempt this hobby as a visitor to Las Vegas - spending money knowing that you will lose it all but it's worth the fun. I really don't think that very many people approach this hobby in that same manner. >>
Not many at all Steve. What we get is many guys who are visitors to "Vegas" who collect with a lottery mentality and spend money they can't afford. When the purchase so often backfires and money is lost in the case of modern cards, these guys attack and ridicule the modern collector. All because they were dumb enough to spend money they should not have and got burned. You can call yourself a purist because of what you collect all you want. That is fine. I could call myself a "purist" because I collect cards the way they were originally intended to be collected. With zero worry about monetary value from after the purchase to forever. Steve, I bet you are a very smart hobbiest. But is that a result of getting burned years ago spending money you should not have on 80's cards? Why spend thousands on 80's cards? Were you buying up lots of exspensive rookies at shows with future possible dollars signs dancing in your mind? I collected alot in the 80's. No way I spent thousands of dollars. All I tried was to complete sets and collect like I do now minus the graded cards. In the 80's, that did not cost you much.
In the end I have NO PROBLEM with the way anyone chooses to collect. What I can not stand is the over riding sense from the majority that they are somehow smarter, more knowlegable, etc because they collect vintage cards. And by golly, one day if I really really had to I could sell for a profit. I'm not saying you Steve, but alot of guys spend money they can't afford with the excuse of "I can just sell them and get my money back". Then look at the modern guy and turn the ol nose up at them. "You can't sell those crap cards for a 10th of what you paid!"
boopotts, thank you for your very kind words. I think I have come a long ways but still have a ways to go.
softy, didn't you and I agree that you are a vintage collector as well? Just for clarification, I didn't mean to associate the term 'purist' with 'vintage'. I think the point I was getting at was really taking a look at the card and getting the best card for the value. I used my 1957 PSA 6 as an example because that's what I am focusing on now but it definitely applies to any set in any year.
Regarding what I did in the 1980s that has so influenced my thinking now, I wasn't hording "rookie" cards, I was building many, many sets from vending, wax, racks and dealer inventories. These would include (5) 83, (7) 87 and at least a couple of each of other issues in that period. (And we don't talk about the many unopened boxes and sets of Topps Bigs and Bowmans. ) It was all money that I could have easily spent on something fun so that was not the issue. I have inventoried nearly every transaction I have made since 1983 and I am dismayed at the thousands I spent on something that not only did not retain their value, but it was more getting caught up in the NEW and IMPROVED hype of the Topps/Fleer/Donruss issues of those years. I went to many shows and worked at card shops in the 1980s and what I had passed up or passed by were cards (vintage and recent issies) that would have given me more pleasure, then and now - if I had only knew or listened better. I have always fantasized about going back in time to visit me in those years and believe it or not, I would tell myself nothing about which "rookies" or sets would be hot but instead, mention only one word...CONDITION (okay, in addition to two more words...PRE-WAR). Just rambling...
Around the early 90's, I was collecting with an 8 yr old son - can you imagine all the crap that is laying in the closet? Anyone in need of 91 and 92UD?
I guess in the end we all collect for fun and anything beyond that is OK too.
“Most people assume, due to the money involved, that collectors like Sergio are pure investors but that couldn’t be further from the truth. Sergio, like many advanced collectors, approaches collecting with sound business mind but what drives him is the love of the cards. While there will always be the financial aspect of collecting, Sergio shares the passion that so many collectors have, regardless of spending power.” (SMR, August 2005, p.25)
Steve, you know eventually I will be diving into a vintage issue of some kind. I already have in a non sport issue. I will buy those cards when the time comes very carefully as you do and will not look to overspend. I see your point about how you approach your purchases. I think the big difference between us is that I can't see myself ever selling these cards. So once my purchases have been made and the money is gone the amount the cards are worth from that day on does not matter to me good or bad. Great debate Steve and I am glad I am getting to know a fellow collector better!
oh, and about those pesky 78's being considered vintage. WATCH YOUR MOUTH SIR!
Comments
<< <i> I understand the point but I disagree with perception that one should attempt this hobby as a visitor to Las Vegas - spending money knowing that you will lose it all but it's worth the fun. I really don't think that very many people approach this hobby in that same manner. >>
Not many at all Steve. What we get is many guys who are visitors to "Vegas" who collect with a lottery mentality and spend money they can't afford. When the purchase so often backfires and money is lost in the case of modern cards, these guys attack and ridicule the modern collector. All because they were dumb enough to spend money they should not have and got burned. You can call yourself a purist because of what you collect all you want. That is fine. I could call myself a "purist" because I collect cards the way they were originally intended to be collected. With zero worry about monetary value from after the purchase to forever. Steve, I bet you are a very smart hobbiest. But is that a result of getting burned years ago spending money you should not have on 80's cards? Why spend thousands on 80's cards? Were you buying up lots of exspensive rookies at shows with future possible dollars signs dancing in your mind? I collected alot in the 80's. No way I spent thousands of dollars. All I tried was to complete sets and collect like I do now minus the graded cards. In the 80's, that did not cost you much.
In the end I have NO PROBLEM with the way anyone chooses to collect. What I can not stand is the over riding sense from the majority that they are somehow smarter, more knowlegable, etc because they collect vintage cards. And by golly, one day if I really really had to I could sell for a profit. I'm not saying you Steve, but alot of guys spend money they can't afford with the excuse of "I can just sell them and get my money back". Then look at the modern guy and turn the ol nose up at them. "You can't sell those crap cards for a 10th of what you paid!"
Take care Steve
ISO 1978 Topps Baseball in NM-MT High Grade Raw 3, 100, 103, 302, 347, 376, 416, 466, 481, 487, 509, 534, 540, 554, 579, 580, 622, 642, 673, 724__________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ISO 1978 O-Pee-Chee in NM-MT High Grade Raw12, 21, 29, 38, 49, 65, 69, 73, 74, 81, 95, 100, 104, 110, 115, 122, 132, 133, 135, 140, 142, 151, 153, 155, 160, 161, 167, 168, 172, 179, 181, 196, 200, 204, 210, 224, 231, 240
softy, didn't you and I agree that you are a vintage collector as well?
Regarding what I did in the 1980s that has so influenced my thinking now, I wasn't hording "rookie" cards, I was building many, many sets from vending, wax, racks and dealer inventories. These would include (5) 83, (7) 87 and at least a couple of each of other issues in that period. (And we don't talk about the many unopened boxes and sets of Topps Bigs and Bowmans.
I guess in the end we all collect for fun and anything beyond that is OK too.
mike
“Most people assume, due to the money involved, that collectors like Sergio are pure investors but that couldn’t be further from the truth. Sergio, like many advanced collectors, approaches collecting with sound business mind but what drives him is the love of the cards. While there will always be the financial aspect of collecting, Sergio shares the passion that so many collectors have, regardless of spending power.” (SMR, August 2005, p.25)
cards when the time comes very carefully as you do and will not look to overspend. I see your point about how you approach your purchases. I think the big difference between us is that I can't see myself ever selling these cards. So once my purchases have been made and the money is gone the amount the cards are worth from that day on does not matter to me good or bad. Great debate Steve and I am glad I am getting to know a fellow collector better!
oh, and about those pesky 78's being considered vintage. WATCH YOUR MOUTH SIR!
Take care
Dan
ISO 1978 Topps Baseball in NM-MT High Grade Raw 3, 100, 103, 302, 347, 376, 416, 466, 481, 487, 509, 534, 540, 554, 579, 580, 622, 642, 673, 724__________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ISO 1978 O-Pee-Chee in NM-MT High Grade Raw12, 21, 29, 38, 49, 65, 69, 73, 74, 81, 95, 100, 104, 110, 115, 122, 132, 133, 135, 140, 142, 151, 153, 155, 160, 161, 167, 168, 172, 179, 181, 196, 200, 204, 210, 224, 231, 240