1990 Donruss Aqueous

Twinsthreepeat

Does any one have any of these? Anyone have a good source for these? How rare are they? I looking to find Puckett's

Thanks,
Jason

metsfan

Jason:
I bought a Jeffries on ebay. It was over 6 months ago. Don't recall the seller.

bobsbbcards

I've got 229 different. Going under the assumption that there are 283 regular cards + 9 additional MVP cards (BC1-BC9), you get 292 in the "set". I've been collecting this for years and I've never seen either of the Puckett's (#269 or BC-8).

There were primarily two sources for these cards: Chandy Greenholt (chandyg6p81 on eBay) was one and I can't remember the other. There's an auction right now for 10 different:

Lot of 10 different 1990 Donruss aqueous test cards

They are quite rare. Some groups of cards are rarer than others (Diamond Kings and Rated Rookies are extra tough). Current Standard Catalog pricing for these is pretty accurate. Just like any thinly collected issue, you get cards come and go on eBay with no bidders and then a few weeks later you might get aggressive bidding. Prices for star cards don't reflect the rarity (yet). SCD states that between 2,000 and 2,500 cards in total are known (not 2,000 of each card...2,000 total). Doing the math, you get less than 10 of each. Makes that Wagner card look like a common.

Highest priced stars: Juan Gonzalez Rated Rookie, Ripken Jr., Bonds, Ryan, followed by a slew of popular players (Puckett, Clemens, McGwire, Maddux, Gwynn, Murphy, etc.)

Two differences between 1990 Donruss Aqueous cards and regular issue 1990 Donruss cards:

1) On the Aqueous test cards, the word "INC." in DONRUSS INC. on the back of the card is missing the period.

2) Slightly less subtle, the words AQUEOUS TEST are emblazoned diagonally across the back in big black letters.

Here's a scan of the back of one:

ajw

bobsbbcards, you seem quite informed on this issue. Do you know if there's a Will Clark. If so, what would it cost to acquire one?

bobsbbcards

ajw,
Yes, there's a Will Clark (#260). Unlike the Topps Blackless cards mentioned in the other thread, the Donruss Aqueous cards aren't skip numbered. Cards 1-283 and BC1-BC9 are possible although there are some cards in these ranges that haven't been found yet.

On pricing, Standard Catalog says that Clark is $7.50. I'd pay a lot more than that for one. Maybe two will come up at the same time and we won't have to do battle.
Bob

Twinsthreepeat

Bobsbbcards,
Do you know if PSA will grade these? I've been looking for the puckett cards for awhile now but no luck. Thanks for the info.

bobsbbcards

<< <i>Bobsbbcards,
Do you know if PSA will grade these? I've been looking for the puckett cards for awhile now but no luck. Thanks for the info. >>


They will not. SGC will.

larryallen73

Stupid question, what are they? Just some random test set?

bobsbbcards

Not stupid question at all. Donruss was trying out different types of printing technology in 1990. From what I've heard, "aqueous" has something to do with that. Maybe CON40 will come along and answer this question again (Keith?).

It was definitely not supposed to be a test set. Some uncut sheets were probably "borrowed" from the printing plant and cut up at some later point for distribution/sale. Quite scarce, but of very little interest to anybody but the most dedicated (sick) collectors.

There've been other types of 1990 Donruss test cards for sale on eBay (mostly from the same source). You'll see them listed as "blue and white test cards." Basically the card has two fronts--one with blue ink for a background color (instead of red like regular 1990 Donruss cards) and the flip side has white instead of red. Although the SCD Standard Catalog now mentions the blue/white test cards, they've not tried to set a price for them yet (since the market hasn't established one).

Hope that answers your not-so-stupid question.
Bob

Jeremy1901

Are they glossy on the front? or same as a normal 90 donruss

bobsbbcards

Same as normal Donruss. You can't tell from the front.

slantycouch

Fast forward a couple years....

What's the consensus on these... still pretty rare? Any "finds" of them since this was last discussed? I'd like to pick one up for the collection but I haven't seen any on eBay lately.

Boopotts

<< <i>Fast forward a couple years....

What's the consensus on these... still pretty rare? Any "finds" of them since this was last discussed? I'd like to pick one up for the collection but I haven't seen any on eBay lately. >>




Chandy seems to run a few auctions for them every couple of months, which makes me wonder how rare they really are. It seems like this guy might be sitting on a bona-fide horde of them, and is slowly leaking them into the market.

bobsbbcards

<< <i>Fast forward a couple years....

What's the consensus on these... still pretty rare? Any "finds" of them since this was last discussed? I'd like to pick one up for the collection but I haven't seen any on eBay lately. >>


I've purchased a grand total of one since this thread originally aired (Carlton Fisk), and I check eBay all the time for them.

At some point fairly early on, I bought one of each that Chandy Greenholt had, so nothing that they list helps me out anymore. I'm pretty patient, but I'm also beginning to think that this is one set I'll never finish.

mtcards

Was there not a bunch of these that turned up "fake" not too long ago?

MeteoriteGuy

<< <i>Was there not a bunch of these that turned up "fake" not too long ago? >>



Yes. Don't remember the seller, but I remember he created a website just for them. The fakes had the wrong font.

bobsbbcards

<< <i>Was there not a bunch of these that turned up "fake" not too long ago? >>


Yes, there was. He was claiming that the entire set was available in "Aqueous" form (numbers higher than 283), and was pawning himself off as an expert on this issue. Others on these boards might chime in with their experiences--I did not buy anything from him.

slantycouch

Interesting. So in your opinion did most of them originate from that one dealer, or does he just have a lot of them in addition to what was already in the market? Does that make sense?

bobsbbcards

<< <i>Interesting. So in your opinion did most of them originate from that one dealer, or does he just have a lot of them in addition to what was already in the market? Does that make sense? >>


I think most (if not all) of the cards came from two dealers. They seemed to have different groups of cards too--Chandy had cards that were numbered mostly from 48-167 (or thereabouts), the other dealer had cards that were numbered above 167 and a few of the Diamond Kings.

richtree

I would like a george brett aqueous


anyone have one for me!!!!!!

ill buy / trade

tunahead08

I had emailed Chandy a couple years ago... I'm terrible at cleaning out my mail... so here was his story on the 1990 Donruss test issues

"Hi---thanks for your note.....yes, I was one of the original purchaser of these cards....I think there was one other purchaser on the aqueous test cards somewhere in the Milwaukee area; while there may be another source for the blue/white cards, I haven't found it yet.....peculiar story how I came across this group; I sent this e-mail out several years ago and saved a copy....have copied it on here for you.....best wishes, Chandy

I bought them with ABSOLUTELY no idea what I was getting.......had a phone call one Saturday morning from a gentleman who explained that he was an ex-employee at Donruss (actually, packaging director). He told me that he had been given a few wax boxes when he left the company and wondered if we were buying....he explained that they were 1988-1992 product, and that there were 20 boxes, mostly 1990-1992 Donruss and Leaf along with a few 1988 Donruss........really exciting stuff......well, maybe not......

He mentioned one 1990 Leaf box, and I made him an offer on the group equal to the value of that one box, since everything else he listed was what I would call junk wax which I figured to be my profit on the deal.

At any rate, he arrived at my store just as I was leaving for my daughter's soccer game (I was team coach and had to be there).....we had agreed on a price, so my assistant paid him and he left (without any conversation with me at all).

When I returned to the store later that afternoon, my assistant had moved the boxes back to the back room. I took a quick look and noted that there were 3 boxes which were not regular Donruss boxes, but rather plain white cardboard boxes with a memo, something to the effect of "Donruss Canada", on the side.....at this point, I opened one of the boxes (in regular 1990 Donruss wrappers) and encountered a pack full of the "blue-white" cards from this ad......having been a collector of and fascinated by proofs, errors, and variations all my collecting career, I about went through the ceiling......but had no way to contact the person I bought them from for any information.

After looking at those, I started perusing all of the other boxes and discovered that the boxes of 1990 Donruss cellos I had purchased all had the "Aqueous Test" overprint on the backs of the cards inside (see some of my other ads).

As you can see, all of these cards came from packs....they weren't cut from sheets, although I'm sure that with these as with any card product, there was an uncut sheet at one time........my guess is that they were different ink tests, one for color, the other for water solubility, but I don't know anything more than you do in that area......"

BunchOBull

Awesome post! Very interesting about the blue/whites too!

tunahead08

For those that haven't seen the Blue/White test cards, here's the Jose DeLeon/Cal Ripken A.S.



Does anyone know if PSA grades either of these test issues yet? I was thinking of sending this one in on my first sub.

prscott933

I've been looking for the Ozzie Smith for about 5 years now... I have yet to see one. Chandy doesn't have one, I asked years ago

tunahead08

<< <i>I've been looking for the Ozzie Smith for about 5 years now... I have yet to see one. Chandy doesn't have one, I asked years ago >>



Yeah, same with me and the Ripken. Had an opportunity to get one off ebay a few years ago, but forgot to put my snipe in

richtree

yeah, I haven't seen the brett's anywhere....


ps pm me if any of the brett's roll around guys.,


thx again .

rich tree

BunchOBull

I've always wished Frank Thomas had a rookie in '90 Donruss, but man these variations would be pricey.

bobsbbcards

I've never seen that information before. Thanks for posting!!! Very interesting.

I have a Donruss Aqueous test card of George Brett (#144), but unfortunately, I have only one. Sorry.

Morgoth

I have a Drabek and Smiley for my Pirates collection, thanks Russ!

slantycouch

Thank you for posting! That's incredible.

brumbach

Thanks for the post, I've never seen that information before either. I have a Tim Raines Aqueous around somewhere that I picked up many years ago on eBay but I forget if it was from Chandy or someone else.

richtree

<< <i>I've never seen that information before. Thanks for posting!!! Very interesting.

I have a Donruss Aqueous test card of George Brett (#144), but unfortunately, I have only one. Sorry. >>





damm you bobsbbcards !!!!!!!!!!!!


LOL, Ill have to get another...

TNP777

here's a Brett!

slantycouch

Anyone have just a sample one they'd be willing to sell? Player doesn't matter - I'd just like one for my collection.

ajw

<< <i>

<< <i>Bobsbbcards,
Do you know if PSA will grade these? I've been looking for the puckett cards for awhile now but no luck. Thanks for the info. >>


They will not. SGC will. >>



Is this still the case? I see one listed on an Alan Trammell master collection registry set.

Trammell Master Set Registry

There's a note that the card was submitted in July 2007, so perhaps they changed their mind on this one.

Anyone know for sure?

jackstraw

Bob
Is there a Griffey DK or regular card? I have never seen one or heard of it.

ajw

<< <i>

<< <i>

<< <i>Bobsbbcards,
Do you know if PSA will grade these? I've been looking for the puckett cards for awhile now but no luck. Thanks for the info. >>


They will not. SGC will. >>



Is this still the case? I see one listed on an Alan Trammell master collection registry set.

Trammell Master Set Registry

There's a note that the card was submitted in July 2007, so perhaps they changed their mind on this one.

Anyone know for sure? >>



I just called PSA and they no longer grade them. There are apparently five examples that made their way into PSA holders.

onefasttalon

I know BGS will grade/slab them still.... I found a Chris Sabo (I believe there are 2 in existence) and got a BGS 8.0 on it.
Didn't care about what grade it got, just wanted it slabbed for protection. It took me FOREVER to finally find it...

tunahead08

What is PSA's reasoning for not grading these?

jackstraw

I am guessing but it sounds to me they think they were issued in sheet form (ie 84 Topps Nestle) and were cut down ?

tunahead08

<< <i>I am guessing but it sounds to me they think they were issued in sheet form (ie 84 Topps Nestle) and were cut down ? >>



Yeah it kind of seems like that is their thinking. I have some doubt these were cut down though as the condition of the cards I've seen usually isn't that great. Plus, from the information Chandy had about them being in packs when he first got them. I wonder if there is anyway to convince PSA to start grading these again.

I still think they should grade the Nestle's too as the only way they were issued was in sheet form. It's not like they were also issued in packs, so cut from a sheet is the only way to get them in singles. Ah well, what can ya do?

ajw

It might be as simple as they're not comfortable authenticating the cards. The unknown origins and potential for fakes seem to make their decision reasonable. Unfortunate, but reasonable.

Can someone with access to the Pop Report check to see which cards were graded? I'm assuming Alan Trammell is one...

bobsbbcards

John,

There is a Griffey DK in the set, but not the regular issue card. I've never seen it though.

Drew,

Just checked the Pop report, and I can't find any record of the Trammel Aqueous card (or any other Aqueous card for that matter). I guess they're just mixed in with the regular 1990 Donruss cards and no longer listed as variations. There is one PSA 7 for the regular issue Trammell.

I wish they would grade them. There's no reason that they shouldn't.

tunahead08

<< <i>I wish they would grade them. There's no reason that they shouldn't. >>



Maybe someone that is in with Joe O. can recommend they grade them again

SeattleRaines

WOW! Look at what this auction ended at!

1990 Donruss Aqueous Test Will Clark

BunchOBull

I'm sure he made more than he has in it.

tunahead08

Holy crap! Makes me even more sick that I didn't buy the Ripken for $85 when I had the chance!

slantycouch

Holy hell that's nuts.

jackstraw

<< <i>Holy crap! Makes me even more sick that I didn't buy the Ripken for $85 when I had the chance! >>



I am sick sometimes when I don't pull the trigger on stuff I know/knew I should have! The Cooperstown Dufex Promo being one.
I am still sick about it and it was 3 years ago.

Kid4hof03

Hey John, it's been a long time since I have seen you out here. I hope you are doing well. I just checked out your Griffey photobucket, great stuff!

Abe

jackstraw

Hi Abe
It's been about two years since I collected. I am doing OK, we are thinking about moving to Atlanta.
I hope all is well with you also.