"So many of our DREAMS at first seem impossible, then they seem improbable, and then, when we SUMMON THE WILL they soon become INEVITABLE "- Christopher Reeve
I have been saying it since the preseason - Jaret Wright is a disaster waiting to happen this year for NY. Even Pavano will be in for a rude awakening, but at least he is a bit better pitcher...Wright had a 13 run lead tonight, and was basically a human pitching machine against the feeble Tampa lineup at one point. I was flipping through the channels, and caught the 5 minutes where the D-Rays scored most of their runs. He finally got someone to ground into a double play to get out of a jam, and keep the score 15-6 (or so), and he pumped his fist in the air like he had just won the World Series! C'mon man - if you can't get these guys out, you can't get anyone out...
I don't know why Wells did not want to sign with his beloved Yankees--that still baffles me.
I know the Yankees have some holes in pitching, but they really tried to get good pitchers in some instances and totally messed up in others.
Even Pettite bailed on the Yankees.
David Cone would come back, but he can't because of an arthritic hip.
"So many of our DREAMS at first seem impossible, then they seem improbable, and then, when we SUMMON THE WILL they soon become INEVITABLE "- Christopher Reeve
I must have missed the news or something, but it was the Yankees who did not want Wells and not the other way around? I trust your statement and now it makes sense that he went to sign with another team. I guess when he refused the Yankees offer two years ago to sign with the Padres, some bad blood existed, otherwise it would have been a perfect match.
We knew it before the season started that the Yankees made questionable moves on their pitching staff....
I am hoping Kevin Brown can get healthy because him and Johnson would make the most crushing 1-2 punch in the post season. I am sure Mussina will fill in a third spot. They may not need a fourth pitcher, but let us see if Pavano makes the adjustment.
"So many of our DREAMS at first seem impossible, then they seem improbable, and then, when we SUMMON THE WILL they soon become INEVITABLE "- Christopher Reeve
I wouldn't judge Wright too harshly yet. It took him a couple of months to get going last year and he did miss alot of time this spring. I think he'll end up being a very servicable pitcher for the Yanks.
<< <i>I wouldn't judge Wright too harshly yet. It took him a couple of months to get going last year and he did miss alot of time this spring. I think he'll end up being a very servicable pitcher for the Yanks. >>
Nope - I am not buying it. He was a one year wonder, under the watchful eye of Leo Mazzone in Atlanta. He is a recipe for disaster back in the AL, and the season will bear that out.
<<I am hoping Kevin Brown can get healthy because him and Johnson would make the most crushing 1-2 punch in the post season. I am sure Mussina will fill in a third spot . They may not need a fourth pitcher, but let us see if Pavano makes the adjustment.>>
Brown over Mussina? Truly you jest?!?! Mike Mussina will be a Hall of Famer. Johnson-Mussina-Pavano...they only need 3 quality pitchers if they make the playoffs.
<< <i> Brown over Mussina? Truly you jest?!?! Mike Mussina will be a Hall of Famer. Johnson-Mussina-Pavano...they only need 3 quality pitchers if they make the playoffs. >>
Mussina will be a HoFer? Uhm, he's barely over 200 wins 14 years in, has an ERA of over 3.50, and will be very lucky to achieve 250 career wins.
According to baseball-reference.com, the most similar pitchers to Mussina:
Dwight Gooden (932) Curt Schilling (902) Kevin Brown (901) David Wells (901) Jimmy Key (899) Bob Welch (891) David Cone (883) Dazzy Vance (878) Lon Warneke (877) Orel Hershiser (874)
And NONE of those guys are going to hall.
Spammy, just because he plays for the yankees doesn't mean he gets a free pass to the hall! He's never won the Cy Young, finished second once, and best he did other than that was 4th.
I am just referring to the fact that K Brown has had more dominating seasons than Mussina. But if you judge this year alone, maybe Mussina will come out ahead of Brown, but let us see. Don't forget how unhittable he was in the post season when he played for the Marlins. If injury is kept under control, Brown will be better than Mussina.
As far as Mussina going to the Hall.... Yes, he is very reliable and consistent, but he never was the best. He is in the same borderline class of Cone, Gooden, Schilling, Wells and Brown just like baseball-reference alluded to. He is not a Maddux, Johnson, Glavine, Smoltz, Clemens calibur pitcher.
Of course, if he hangs around long enough, he will be a HOF. Cumulative stats always get a player in no matter if he ever won anything or not.
"So many of our DREAMS at first seem impossible, then they seem improbable, and then, when we SUMMON THE WILL they soon become INEVITABLE "- Christopher Reeve
Living in the Balto area since 1990, transplanted from NY, Mussina is the worst bad luck pitcher I have ever seen. His stats are OK, but I have never seen a guy leave a game with only 2 runs on the board after 6 or 7 innings who gets a no-no more than him. He's cursed. He never seems to get any run production up front.
"A man's got to know his limitations...." Dirty Harry
Mattingly and Munson have a shot at getting in, even if by the Alzheimers Committe.
Mussina still has some stat compiling to do. So, he is not HOF material yet. Cone and Gooden barely are, so Mussina must surpass them by a lot to move away from the pack.
"So many of our DREAMS at first seem impossible, then they seem improbable, and then, when we SUMMON THE WILL they soon become INEVITABLE "- Christopher Reeve
Mike Mussina is 36 years old. When all is said and done he might win 300 games or come very close. 4 or 5 more years at an average of 15 wins per season will put him on the cusp.
Spammy you're the one dreaming if you think Mussina is going to win another 88 games (or even close) in his career.
And in your argument, you are basically saying he doesn't have to dominate (he hasn't and at this stage in his career, he won't) a single year to be worthy of HoF? He's never even won 20 games in a season! I don't care how many wins the average HoFer has, I want to see a player on their own standing. The biggest tell-tell sign of someone who shouldn't be in the Hall? When those supporting him have to start using those already in the hall to justify his induction.
Sorry spammy....no 20 win seasons, no Cy Youngs, not a single year of domination = no hall for Moose (and no, being a yankee doesn't automatically get you in).
Gemmy10
Posts: 2,990 ✭
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Yeah, they should have never gotten Wright and let Lieber go. I have never been a big Jared fan.
BST: Tennessebanker, Downtown1974, LarkinCollector, nendee
JS
I don't know why Wells did not want to sign with his beloved Yankees--that still baffles me.
I know the Yankees have some holes in pitching, but they really tried to get good pitchers in some instances and totally messed up in others.
Even Pettite bailed on the Yankees.
David Cone would come back, but he can't because of an arthritic hip.
BST: Tennessebanker, Downtown1974, LarkinCollector, nendee
Wells wanted the Yankees. The Yankees did not want Wells.
I must have missed the news or something, but it was the Yankees who did not want Wells and not the other way around? I trust your statement and now it makes sense that he went to sign with another team. I guess when he refused the Yankees offer two years ago to sign with the Padres, some bad blood existed, otherwise it would have been a perfect match.
We knew it before the season started that the Yankees made questionable moves on their pitching staff....
I am hoping Kevin Brown can get healthy because him and Johnson would make the most crushing 1-2 punch in the post season. I am sure Mussina will fill in a third spot. They may not need a fourth pitcher, but let us see if Pavano makes the adjustment.
BST: Tennessebanker, Downtown1974, LarkinCollector, nendee
<< <i>I wouldn't judge Wright too harshly yet. It took him a couple of months to get going last year and he did miss alot of time this spring. I think he'll end up being a very servicable pitcher for the Yanks. >>
Nope - I am not buying it. He was a one year wonder, under the watchful eye of Leo Mazzone in Atlanta. He is a recipe for disaster back in the AL, and the season will bear that out.
Kevin Brown healthy?
Brown over Mussina? Truly you jest?!?! Mike Mussina will be a Hall of Famer. Johnson-Mussina-Pavano...they only need 3 quality pitchers if they make the playoffs.
<< <i>
Brown over Mussina? Truly you jest?!?! Mike Mussina will be a Hall of Famer. Johnson-Mussina-Pavano...they only need 3 quality pitchers if they make the playoffs. >>
Mussina will be a HoFer? Uhm, he's barely over 200 wins 14 years in, has an ERA of over 3.50, and will be very lucky to achieve 250 career wins.
According to baseball-reference.com, the most similar pitchers to Mussina:
Dwight Gooden (932)
Curt Schilling (902)
Kevin Brown (901)
David Wells (901)
Jimmy Key (899)
Bob Welch (891)
David Cone (883)
Dazzy Vance (878)
Lon Warneke (877)
Orel Hershiser (874)
And NONE of those guys are going to hall.
Spammy, just because he plays for the yankees doesn't mean he gets a free pass to the hall! He's never won the Cy Young, finished second once, and best he did other than that was 4th.
He's a good pitcher, but HoF worthy? Nope.
I am just referring to the fact that K Brown has had more dominating seasons than Mussina. But if you judge this year alone, maybe Mussina will come out ahead of Brown, but let us see. Don't forget how unhittable he was in the post season when he played for the Marlins. If injury is kept under control, Brown will be better than Mussina.
As far as Mussina going to the Hall.... Yes, he is very reliable and consistent, but he never was the best. He is in the same borderline class of Cone, Gooden, Schilling, Wells and Brown just like baseball-reference alluded to. He is not a Maddux, Johnson, Glavine, Smoltz, Clemens calibur pitcher.
Of course, if he hangs around long enough, he will be a HOF. Cumulative stats always get a player in no matter if he ever won anything or not.
BST: Tennessebanker, Downtown1974, LarkinCollector, nendee
Unfocused, impulsive collector of everything ...
<< <i> Mike Mussina will be a Hall of Famer. >>
What? Here we go again...just like Mattingly and Munson are Hall Of Famer's...it will never end, I suppose.
Mussina still has some stat compiling to do. So, he is not HOF material yet. Cone and Gooden barely are, so Mussina must surpass them by a lot to move away from the pack.
BST: Tennessebanker, Downtown1974, LarkinCollector, nendee
Black Ink: Pitching - 14 (146) (Average HOFer ~ 40)
Gray Ink: Pitching - 212 (31) (Average HOFer ~ 185)
HOF Standards: Pitching - 45.0 (50) (Average HOFer ~ 50)
HOF Monitor: Pitching - 101.0 (87) (Likely HOFer > 100)
Source:
http://www.baseball-reference.com/m/mussimi01.shtml
Mike Mussina is 36 years old. When all is said and done he might win 300 games or come very close. 4 or 5 more years at an average of 15 wins per season will put him on the cusp.
<<He's a good pitcher, but HoF worthy? Nope.>>
Axtell Rose, go back to sleep.
<< <i>Mike Mussina
Black Ink: Pitching - 14 (146) (Average HOFer ~ 40)
Gray Ink: Pitching - 212 (31) (Average HOFer ~ 185)
HOF Standards: Pitching - 45.0 (50) (Average HOFer ~ 50)
HOF Monitor: Pitching - 101.0 (87) (Likely HOFer > 100)
Axtell Rose, go back to sleep. >>
Spammy you're the one dreaming if you think Mussina is going to win another 88 games (or even close) in his career.
And in your argument, you are basically saying he doesn't have to dominate (he hasn't and at this stage in his career, he won't) a single year to be worthy of HoF? He's never even won 20 games in a season! I don't care how many wins the average HoFer has, I want to see a player on their own standing. The biggest tell-tell sign of someone who shouldn't be in the Hall? When those supporting him have to start using those already in the hall to justify his induction.
Sorry spammy....no 20 win seasons, no Cy Youngs, not a single year of domination = no hall for Moose (and no, being a yankee doesn't automatically get you in).