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The odyssey of the PCGS/NGC/PCGS 1965 SMS Kennedy, aka they ain't all scores!

RussRuss Posts: 48,514 ✭✭✭
So, I pick off this 1965 PCGS MS66CAM in a Heritage auction.

Looking at the images I thought it seemed pretty strong and potentially a DCAM candidate, so I ponied up pretty strong money. When I got the coin in, it was abundantly clear that I blew the image analysis and the coin didn't have a chance at DCAM. It was a strong cameo, though, so I cracked it out and sent it to NCS and on to NGC. It had a large glue spotted area at the upper obverse periphery, and I figured if that could be corrected, it'd go MS67CAM in an NGC holder and I could recover most, (though not all), of my cost.

When I got it back from NGC, what did it grade? MS66 NO CAM. The coin is a cameo by any standard, and the only way I'd get anything back out of it at all was if it was graded as such. So, out came the hammer and it went back to PCGS where it graded cameo again.

Here's the coin now:

image

The point of all this? Well, there are two.

Point one: If you're going to be hunting for the hits, you'll get some misses along the way. It is the nature of things. You just need to improve the odds that the hits will outweigh the misses by seriously boning up on the coins you're chasing. Oh, and don't let the screwups get you down. It happens to everyone!

Point two: It is dangerous to make assumptions about the differences in grading standards between NGC and PCGS; particularly unilateral statements such as the oft repeated assertion that it's easier to get the cameo designation at NGC. I find that these statements usually come from those who haven't submitted to both services recently.

Here's another example that illustrates point two:

image

That coin is graded MS68 by NGC, but did not receive the cameo designation. I will guarantee you that if it were cracked out and sent to PCGS it would come back as a cameo. It would likely grade a point lower, but it would receive the designation.

Russ, NCNE

Comments

  • Nice to know im not the only one being robbed at gun point !
    image
  • RussRuss Posts: 48,514 ✭✭✭


    << <i>Nice to know im not the only one being robbed at gun point ! >>



    Yeah, but you're getting robbed at PCGS. I'm getting robbed at NGC. image

    Russ, NCNE
  • DHeathDHeath Posts: 8,472 ✭✭✭
    I just cracked a PCGS green holder 65 in 5 cam, thinking it would reholder with a bump. A good look in the raw tells me it won't. It's a PCGS as we speak. It is a $50 loser, and you're right, they ain't all winners. image
    Developing theory is what we are meant to do as academic researchers
    and it sets us apart from practitioners and consultants. Gregor
  • John Dillinger,Baby Face Nelson,whats the diff ?
    image
  • CameonutCameonut Posts: 7,293 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Well - this is a great time for the TPG's to decide to be tight. I have 7 orders in the system at this point.

    Looks like I will get robbed....the good news is that I still own the coins and I can let the coins speak for themselves.

    “In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson

    My digital cameo album 1950-64 Cameos - take a look!

  • image
  • RYKRYK Posts: 35,797 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Great lesson, Russ. You are still my coin-making hero. (seriously)
  • MadMartyMadMarty Posts: 16,697 ✭✭✭
    Hey TLHoy, why does NGC suck?
    It is not exactly cheating, I prefer to consider it creative problem solving!!!



  • << <i>Hey TLHoy, why does NGC suck? >>



    yes, please explain whyimage

    Cameron Kiefer


  • << <i>Hey TLHoy, why does NGC suck? >>



    Because they took the Cam away from Russ.
    I meant SUCKS in a bad way.

    Edit to add: Come on, give the Grand Nagus a break. He's getting old. Sometimes he forgets Sucks is a good thing.

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