Just did a quick search on ebay for 1970 Topps Willie Mays cards and came up with 8 currently being offered. All but 1 show a white line. The one that does not have the line looks like it has had a razor blade job done on it. Just looking at the several examples, it looks to me that you will not find a Mays card that is centered 50/50 up and down that does NOT contain the white line. It's just part of the card.
I don't know all the grading standards, but can a Gem Mint 10 card have anything but almost perfect centering?
Football collector 1948-1995, Rams oddball cards & memorabilia, Diamond match. Cataloging all those pesky, unlisted 1963 Topps football color variationsUpdated 2/13/05
there are many cards that have the white line on top. interestingly i have only seen one with it on the bottom. just because one copy of a card has the line doesn't mean that all of the copys have it to. you can put together a great set without the line on any cards. here is a Mays without the line. They are out there.
Good morning guys, I started reading this thread last night and I was really bothered by it. Not by the way the card was graded and not how the seller represented the card, but how so many of the collectors on this board buy cards. I have sold about 6 or 7 items to collectors from this board over the past 3 years. Guys that I have never met in person at the National, but just random people who have emailed me with regards to interest in some of my cards. The experience has been dreadful. All of these guys have been the cheapest (*^*%* in the world. Not to mention picky on every little thing on the card. They want a scan because they don't want any "sliders." Then you tell them a price and they say, "I am not interested in it." Most of these guys on this board complain that XYZ dealer is trying to sell this 1970 Topps Willie Mays for 155% of SMR. Then they start a post about it ragging the dealer that he is an idiot. I believe what we have here on the boards is a bunch of geniuses. PSA is all wrong, the SMR is wrong and dealers are crazy.
1. Either you have a nice card and you sell it for what it is worth and get blasted for it. 2. You have a crap card and sell it under SMR to the uneducated and he blasts you and demands a refund. 3. A veteran collector of 5 months complains that PSA screwed up on the grade of a card he bought on Ebay for 68% of SMR and complains on PSA's message boards.
Absolutely priceless.
Later, Shane Leonard
Looking for high grade rookie cards and unopened boxes/cases
<< <i>I believe what we have here on the boards is a bunch of geniuses. PSA is all wrong, the SMR is wrong and dealers are crazy. >>
See 1954, I knew if you stayed around here long enough you'd figure this out.
There are 2 ways to deal with this particular Mays card: 1) a) crack out. b) using a straight edge and a fine, white tipped pen, draw a line mirroring the original one. c) allow ink to dry. d) send to PSA for grading with a note that you got screwed the first time and will go to GEM grading if not resolved.
2) a) crack out. b) using a straight edge, cut the line from the card. c) allow cut to dry. d) send to PRO for grading with a note that if you don't get a 10 on this card, you will send it to IMADIK grading company.
<< <i>there are many cards that have the white line on top. interestingly i have only seen one with it on the bottom. just because one copy of a card has the line doesn't mean that all of the copys have it to. you can put together a great set without the line on any cards. here is a Mays without the line. They are out there. >>
Actually, I do see the white line. It looks like the top edge of the card is right on it. But you will also notice that the card is centered high, which is the only way, IMO, you will probably find one of these without, or nbearly without, the white line. If the card were centered 50/50 T/B, the line would be more apparent.
Football collector 1948-1995, Rams oddball cards & memorabilia, Diamond match. Cataloging all those pesky, unlisted 1963 Topps football color variationsUpdated 2/13/05
so many interesting responses. I'd like to take a poll. Which camp are you in :
1. On the condition of the card A. If PSA says its an 8, its an 8. B. Its my personal opinion that the card is an 8. C. The card is technically an 8, but aesthetically I don't think it matches up with other 8s. D. The card should be a 8pd E. The card should be a 7. F. The card should be lower than a 7.
2. On the actions of the buyer (me) A. He's an idiot for buying the card without realizing there was a line on it. B. He's an idiot for discussing and complaining about this on PSA's message board. C. He's an idiot for other reasons. D. It looks like he learned a lesson, caveat emptor.
3. On the emotions of the buyer (me) A. He should be happy, he got a good price, 70% SMR! B. He should be happy, he got a fair price given the card. C. He should be sad, he got an ugly card. D. Who am I to tell him whether he should be happy or sad?
4. On PSA A. PSA did a fine job, you should never complain about PSA on their message board, especially if you don't know about grading. B. PSA did a fine job, its ok to complain here as long as you are willing to be open and learn from others C. PSA did an ok job, they followed the technical terms of grading, what else do you want from an independent third party grader? D. PSA did a bad job, they simply messed up on this card.
a) Have psa delete this thread. b) Revoke your forum ID. c) Buy only raw in the future. d) Hopefully other things in your life aren't as complicated as this has been. e) Write a book about the ordeal.
a) Have psa delete this thread. wow. i never thought anyone would think that would be a possible best course of action. has this thread not been educational for anyone here? it has for me. b) Revoke your forum ID. why? what is it specifically that you don't like about what i did or what i posted? c) Buy only raw in the future. i have nothing against PSA. d) Hopefully other things in your life aren't as complicated as this has been. this hasn't been complicated at all to me. has it been for you? e) Write a book about the ordeal. it hasn't been an ordeal either. has it been for you?
kl, I'm just teasing, but think about it. You purchased a card, and in the end, aren't thrilled about. Everybody on these boards has done the same thing at one time or another. 99.9% of the time, these folks chalk it up to a lesson-learned and move on.
Simply put, take what you've read here and if you're still not happy with the card, just sell it. It's just not that big of a deal. The seller did no wrong and neither has PSA.
if you have read my posts you would have learned that :
A. from the start, i never blamed the seller. B. at the beginning, i was pissed at PSA (thus the title of this thread). but i have now learned that i was not knowledgable enough about the 70s cards, and it is probably my own lack of knowledge that was the problem.
my questions were because i sensed there was a huge variety of thoughts on many issues regarding the card, the seller, PSA, and buyers. so wide and varied, its interesting. the bottomline is i found the information and posts in this thread fascinating.
Almost pissed myself reading your post BOTR! Good one Kenny-I stand behind my statement 100% and the issue exists beyond just you. So don't feel that I am calling just you out. Like BOTR said, "we have all purchased a low end card." It will happen through the course of our lives many times. The only way to prevent this from occuring in the future is buy the card in person or stop buying slabbed cards. Either you trust a Professional grading service or you trust a guy on Ebay with 31 feedback selling raw cards. I will take PSA all day long.
Shane
Looking for high grade rookie cards and unopened boxes/cases
Comments
I don't know all the grading standards, but can a Gem Mint 10 card have anything but almost perfect centering?
Cataloging all those pesky, unlisted 1963 Topps football color variations Updated 2/13/05
Chris
I started reading this thread last night and I was really bothered by it. Not by the way the card was graded and not how the seller represented the card, but how so many of the collectors on this board buy cards. I have sold about 6 or 7 items to collectors from this board over the past 3 years. Guys that I have never met in person at the National, but just random people who have emailed me with regards to interest in some of my cards. The experience has been dreadful. All of these guys have been the cheapest (*^*%* in the world. Not to mention picky on every little thing on the card. They want a scan because they don't want any "sliders." Then you tell them a price and they say, "I am not interested in it." Most of these guys on this board complain that XYZ dealer is trying to sell this 1970 Topps Willie Mays for 155% of SMR. Then they start a post about it ragging the dealer that he is an idiot.
I believe what we have here on the boards is a bunch of geniuses. PSA is all wrong, the SMR is wrong and dealers are crazy.
1. Either you have a nice card and you sell it for what it is worth and get blasted for it.
2. You have a crap card and sell it under SMR to the uneducated and he blasts you and demands a refund.
3. A veteran collector of 5 months complains that PSA screwed up on the grade of a card he bought on Ebay for 68% of SMR and complains on PSA's message boards.
Absolutely priceless.
Later,
Shane Leonard
Hey, I resemble that remark.
.
.
.
.
..........awesome post Leonardo
ROTFLMAOPMP
<< <i>I believe what we have here on the boards is a bunch of geniuses. PSA is all wrong, the SMR is wrong and dealers are crazy. >>
See 1954, I knew if you stayed around here long enough you'd figure this out.
There are 2 ways to deal with this particular Mays card:
1)
a) crack out.
b) using a straight edge and a fine, white tipped pen, draw a line mirroring the original one.
c) allow ink to dry.
d) send to PSA for grading with a note that you got screwed the first time and will go to GEM grading if not resolved.
2)
a) crack out.
b) using a straight edge, cut the line from the card.
c) allow cut to dry.
d) send to PRO for grading with a note that if you don't get a 10 on this card, you will send it to IMADIK grading company.
BOTR
<< <i>there are many cards that have the white line on top. interestingly i have only seen one with it on the bottom. just because one copy of a card has the line doesn't mean that all of the copys have it to. you can put together a great set without the line on any cards. here is a Mays without the line. They are out there. >>
Actually, I do see the white line. It looks like the top edge of the card is right on it. But you will also notice that the card is centered high, which is the only way, IMO, you will probably find one of these without, or nbearly without, the white line. If the card were centered 50/50 T/B, the line would be more apparent.
Cataloging all those pesky, unlisted 1963 Topps football color variations Updated 2/13/05
I'd like to take a poll. Which camp are you in :
1. On the condition of the card
A. If PSA says its an 8, its an 8.
B. Its my personal opinion that the card is an 8.
C. The card is technically an 8, but aesthetically I don't think it matches up with other 8s.
D. The card should be a 8pd
E. The card should be a 7.
F. The card should be lower than a 7.
2. On the actions of the buyer (me)
A. He's an idiot for buying the card without realizing there was a line on it.
B. He's an idiot for discussing and complaining about this on PSA's message board.
C. He's an idiot for other reasons.
D. It looks like he learned a lesson, caveat emptor.
3. On the emotions of the buyer (me)
A. He should be happy, he got a good price, 70% SMR!
B. He should be happy, he got a fair price given the card.
C. He should be sad, he got an ugly card.
D. Who am I to tell him whether he should be happy or sad?
4. On PSA
A. PSA did a fine job, you should never complain about PSA on their message board, especially if you don't know about grading.
B. PSA did a fine job, its ok to complain here as long as you are willing to be open and learn from others
C. PSA did an ok job, they followed the technical terms of grading, what else do you want from an independent third party grader?
D. PSA did a bad job, they simply messed up on this card.
Great post!
Groucho Marx
sell the card and buy a new one without the line.
Groucho Marx
a) Have psa delete this thread.
b) Revoke your forum ID.
c) Buy only raw in the future.
d) Hopefully other things in your life aren't as complicated as this has been.
e) Write a book about the ordeal.
BOTR
a) Have psa delete this thread.
wow. i never thought anyone would think that would be a possible best course of action. has this thread not been educational for anyone here? it has for me.
b) Revoke your forum ID.
why? what is it specifically that you don't like about what i did or what i posted?
c) Buy only raw in the future.
i have nothing against PSA.
d) Hopefully other things in your life aren't as complicated as this has been.
this hasn't been complicated at all to me. has it been for you?
e) Write a book about the ordeal.
it hasn't been an ordeal either. has it been for you?
I'm just teasing, but think about it. You purchased a card, and in the end, aren't thrilled about. Everybody on these boards has done the same thing at one time or another. 99.9% of the time, these folks chalk it up to a lesson-learned and move on.
Simply put, take what you've read here and if you're still not happy with the card, just sell it. It's just not that big of a deal. The seller did no wrong and neither has PSA.
Time to move on.
BOTR
A. from the start, i never blamed the seller.
B. at the beginning, i was pissed at PSA (thus the title of this thread). but i have now learned that i was not knowledgable enough about the 70s cards, and it is probably my own lack of knowledge that was the problem.
my questions were because i sensed there was a huge variety of thoughts on many issues regarding the card, the seller, PSA, and buyers. so wide and varied, its interesting. the bottomline is i found the information and posts in this thread fascinating.
Kenny-I stand behind my statement 100% and the issue exists beyond just you. So don't feel that I am calling just you out. Like BOTR said, "we have all purchased a low end card." It will happen through the course of our lives many times. The only way to prevent this from occuring in the future is buy the card in person or stop buying slabbed cards. Either you trust a Professional grading service or you trust a guy on Ebay with 31 feedback selling raw cards. I will take PSA all day long.
Shane