Questions for you Lincoln experts about an MS 1909-S Lincoln.

SanctionII

A couple of years ago I picked up a raw 1909-S MS Lincoln at a local shop for $100.00. The coin guy at the shop said that it came in a few days before as part of a collection that was sold to them by an elderly husband and wife.

I looked at the coin, liked what I saw and sprung for it. I have shown it to some dealers at small and regional shows. They have opined that it is authentic and in very nice condition. A rep for a Lincoln Cent dealer out of the Mountain time zone looked at it, asked me what I paid for it (I told him since I had no plans to sell it) and offered $250.00 for it. I said I was not interested in selling it and simply wanted to get his opinion on the piece. I expect that he would have sold it for a lot more than $250.00 if he had the coin.
I also suspect that I may have a "gem" (65 or better) on my hands.

I am not familiar with the grading of MS Lincolns (wheat or memorial). I see that the value of an MS 65 1909-S is over $1,000.00 in the published price guides.

For you Lincoln experts out in forum land, I ask for your assistance. For a 1909-S MS Lincoln, what should I look for in determining its grade? What varieties, if any (besides the S/S) are there? What are the diagnostics of any varieties? What is the current value of such a coin in MS-63, 64, 65, 66, 67 & 68? Further, what are the pops of this coin in these grades? Thanks in advance. SanctionII.

LincolnCentMan

In 64RD, you're looking at about $400-$550 depending on PQ/PU-ness. 65RD would bring $1000+ depending on quality. If the dealer thought the coin was 64RB, it's an ok offer concidering he has to make a little. If it's a solid 64RD+ or 65RD, he was taking a shot.

David

clackamas

To grade it first determine if it is RD, RB, or BN. What color is the coin? Next looks for strike, obvious nicks or hits. Finger prints, etc. It would help us if you had a picture?

kieferscoins

<< <i>They have opined that it is authentic and in very nice condition. >>



Thats all they said? They didn't give it a grade?

Cameron Kiefer

coynclecter

With a coin like that you need to have it graded, then you won't waste a lot of time or undersell it.

SanctionII

The RD, RB, BN designation is tough for me to call on this coin. It is clearly not bright fiery red. The planchet has a streaky look to it, which I understand is common for early MS Lincolns. The color of the coin is tied up with the colors of the streaky planchet. There is a rainbow of colors to the coin if you look closely at it with a loupe (gold, blue, purple, orange, etc.). If I had to put a label on it I would say RB. Whether a TPG would give it a designation other than RB, I simply do not know given my lack of experience with these coins. It has no marks that are visable to the eye and even under a loupe it is hard to see marks (a few light ticks). No finger prints. Strike looks strong to me (but again I do not know these coins). The coin does have positive eye appeal when looked at through a loupe. Looking at it with your eyes only it appears multicolored due to the planchet streaks, though on the darker side. Luster jumps off the coin in good lighting.

Sorry, can't post a pic. Do not have a digital camera. However, my birthday is later this month and maybe I will get one then.

As far as opinions of dealers who have looked at it, one said 65-66. Others did not give a number grade. Thanks for your input. If I ever choose to sell, I will have it graded first.

D

I must be the only one curious about this, is it a VDB?

-Daniel

SanctionII

Unfortunately it is not a VDB. If it was I never could have purchased it for $100.00.

sumdunce

I would get it graded now.

Too many time I have had a very nice coin get scratched or get a few more ticks because I wanted to keep it original and some unforseen "event" happened.

coppercoins

There is a nice 1909S/S to the northeast that's a rather uncommon coin, especially in MS. The 1909S/horiz. S is quite common in all grades, relatively speaking. To date there are no known doubled dies for the 1909S Lincoln.

Grading: Like Clackamas said, first determine the color. 95% red is red, 95% brown is brown, everything in between is RB. Then take the same five points of grading that must be accounted for in any other coin series, strike, luster, surface preservation, marks, then finally eye appeal.

Strike: Check the top of the cheek and the top of the ear on the obverse. Check the O of ONE on the reverse. If everything is well outlined and shows full relief (as would usually be the case on 1909 cents) then you have a full strike. Anything else, to some extent is an incomplete strike. If it happens to be really soft in the areas mentioned, MS64 is the highest grade to assign to the coin - end of story.

Luster: Look for the cartwheel - if it has a nice cartwheel, you have good luster. Anything less, to varying degrees, will affect luster. Bright shiny luster can go all the way up on the scale, average luster will grade at best 66, and dull coins without luster can grade up to 65.

Surface: Look for spotting, color problems, planchet defects. These affect surface. 1909 is one of the years that is typical for showing some minor surface texture problems, usually stripes. I'd grade a coin no higher than 66 with this. If it's severe (vastly differing colors making a wood grain textured look) I'd grade it no higher than 64.

Marks: Pretty simple. Any large marks, or heavy concentration of small marks - 63, no higher. A few small marks here and there, 65, no higher. A mark here or there - 66. If you have to look hard or with magnification to see any marks on the coin, possible 67.

Eye appeal: Evenness of texture, nice color, and even a little toning can greatly affect the grade in a positive way. Eye appeal can add or subtract up to two points on a grade, and it's purely subjective. It's a gut feeling you get when you look at the coin, no science about it.

Like with the others, if I could see the coin, I could tell you what its grade is in a hurry. I hope these pointers help though.

SanctionII

Coppercoins, many thanks for your comments. I will look at the coin tonite and follow your step by step evaluation of the coin and theen give an update.