eBay Situation, What would you do?--UPDATED (See First Post)

Rampage · January 30, 2005 8:12PM

A coin I had listed last night sold for an unreasonable amount-way too high in my opinion. I state in the auction that the coin appears to have been cleaned sometime in the past. The high bidder comes in at the end and wins the coin. He then emails me to ask if I will guarantee it will grade MS63 at PCGS.

My reply to him was It is an MS63, but if he reads the auction listing, I state that the coin appears to have been cleaned in the past, so I cannot guarantee it will grade at PCGS.

There were three strong bidders on it. I am thinking none of them read the auction.

Any advice?

Thanks.

UPDATE
I have decided to refund the buyer's money and relist the coin. I tried to put myself in his shoes and think about how I would feel if I made a $227.00 mistake. TRUE, he made placed the bid and won the auction, and TRUE, he failed to read the auction because he rushed into it; but I do not want someone to buy a coin they will not be happy with. I would have a hard time sleeping at night if I made someone buy something they did not want to begin with.

Thank you to all who replied to my post.

Cheers, Richard.

LucyBop · January 30, 2005 8:15PM

Sounds to me like the winner bidder should have asked about this coin grading garantee before even bidding....

This person won the auction..... Send them thier coin.

MadMarty · January 30, 2005 8:17PM

Since grading is an opinion, and you stated that the coin had been cleaned in the auction, there is no way you can guarantee what a coin will grade at PCGS. But if they bought it, they are stuck with it. If you want to be a nice guy, have then pay your fees on it and re-list it, with THIS COIN HAS BEEN CLEANED IN THE PAST! in bigger letters!

MORGANHUNTER2 · January 30, 2005 8:17PM

linky linky check the buyer to see if he is stinky.

Rampage · January 30, 2005 8:20PM

Here is a link to the auction. He bid on my MS62 problem free coin that several minutes earlier, and to me, it looks like he rushed his bid in on this one. What do you think?

auction

ER · January 30, 2005 8:24PM

You guaranteed it to be authentic, not the grade, so it's his problem, not yours. JMO.

MORGANHUNTER2 · January 30, 2005 8:24PM

sniper fire- he did not look at the auction- I would email him and tell him to re read the auction before he went any further with the transaction- why get a neggy from a guy on a buying spree- check his feedback- he buys in multiples.

BAJJERFAN · January 30, 2005 8:26PM

Well you do say its a 63 I believe, in spite of a possible cleaning. If you feel its a 63 then why shouldn't PCGS, although there is no way that you can guarantee what grade that PCGS will give it unless you are HRH.

Rampage · January 30, 2005 8:28PM

I think I will email him back and tell him to reread the auction and see what he wants to do. I certainly do not want a negative over this coin. I may offer it to him at a discount. What do you all think about that? Or should I offer to let it go and not hold him responsible?

Rampage · January 30, 2005 8:29PM

<< Well you do say its a 63 I believe, in spite of a possible cleaning. If you feel its a 63 then why shouldn't PCGS, although there is no way that you can guarantee what grade that PCGS will give it unless you are HRH. >>

The grade is MS63, but the cleaning would hold it out of PCGS slabs.

MORGANHUNTER2 · January 30, 2005 8:30PM

email him/her, wait for a response- if he still wants it- no discount, and advise him/her that what you say for grade IS YOUR OPINION ONLY- what PCGS will grade it nobody knows- it is not a science- grading that is- it is strictly ones opinion.

slabfab · January 30, 2005 8:44PM

You were up front about the coin being cleaned. I think the phrase "But, please bid based on your grade, not mine." gets you off the hook. Seems clear to me, he owes you $227.50 plus shipping.

Rampage · January 30, 2005 8:51PM

I sent the buyer an email. His reply is below. What should I do now. Do you think all is okay?

My email
NAME HERE,

I looked at your bidding history on this coin and the other coin I had up. I am not sure, but did you get a chance to read the auction before bidding? I noticed you got outbid at the last couple of minutes of the MS62 coin. I was thinking you rushed to get your bids in before the auction closed. Please take a look at the auction again and please let me know. Thanks, Richard.

His reply:

HI,
I think I may have.
I usually buy graded coins, PCGS

If I made a mistake, I guess it's my fault,
NAME HERE

kieferscoins · January 30, 2005 8:59PM

He admits it is his fault and don't let him have it for a discount. He owes you the whole amount.

Cameron Kiefer

LeeG · January 30, 2005 9:27PM

You stated all the relevant facts in your listing!!! He bid and won. He owns it! His responsability to read before bidding! Lee

IrishMike · January 30, 2005 9:30PM

I don't know if there is one right solution. You have some options so you have to decide which one to live with. I guess a starting point would be to put yourself in this guys shoes and imagine how you would want this resolved. Next time I would be more cautious about putting an MS grade in the listing title or at all. I would have listed it as uncirculated and most likely cleaned. I am not implying that you did anything wrong but we all know that folks don't read the entire ebay description, of course it's their fault not yours but by listing it as an MS63 you left the door if only a little open for someone to misinterpret the auction.

ellewood · January 30, 2005 9:37PM

Send the coin and take the money chief! Go out and buy yourself a nice new fat coin too!!

P.S. A coin is always worth what someone will pay for it!!!!!!!!!!

tlhoy · January 30, 2005 9:44PM

Let him off on this one. Its not going to kill you. Not worth the Neg or Neutral he'd give you. (Which he does gives out!)
You'll probably have a customer for life.

Glenn

Tootawl · January 30, 2005 9:47PM

It's not your fault the buyer can't read. When he made a bid, he made a legal obligation to purchase the coin. No one forced him to make a bid. All of us at one time bid on something without reading every word. Get the payment and send him his coin.

moosesr · January 30, 2005 9:50PM

Have you ever allowed a buyer to return a coin to you for a refund because they were unhappy with the way the coin looked in hand? If your return policy allows this, then this person may do that to you so it might be better to try and resolve any problems before shipping the coin.

The reason I asked is you guarantee the coin to be "100% authentic and that the variety is as described and labeled", which to me would mean in most cases there would be no returns allowed.

Charlie

Rampage · January 30, 2005 10:10PM

Charlie,

I have an unlisted return policy. I do not list it because then I would be subject to being an approval service. I have only ever had two coins returned to me. One was slabbed and the other was not. One was my fault and one was not. The one that was my fault, I refunded shipping both ways. We were each happy in the end.

I feel I give honest and accurate descriptions of the coins I sell. HOWEVER, if I am wrong about something, I have no problems taking the coin back. I am very careful not to hype or overstate coins. I do not enhance my scans or anything.

KurtHorn · January 30, 2005 11:10PM

Your listing was pretty clear. You need to decide how much a risk you're willing to take for a potential neg. I'd probably let him off, but that's me. One note here... meant as advice not criticism. If you had said: This coin is a cleaned MS 63, I think you might have avoided confusion. Usually I net grade by my own opinion any raw coins that have problems. So, I would have said maybe Unc. details cleaned net MS60 or AU58 or 55, depending on how I grade the end result of the coin. The highest net grade I have ever seen given to a cleaned coin from ANACS was a net 60.

Now if I was in the buyer's shoes... I personally would not neg you, since I would realize it was my mistake. But, I would be totally pissed and probably never buy anything from you ever again...

You know, try as hard as we do to be honest and list our stuff fairly every now and then we can fall into a crack like this and it really blows. On the other hand, when you're brutally honest in your auctions (as I try to be) then people who are bidding assume the coin is really even worse than you have described and you take a financial hit that you don't deserve. All I can say is after awhile, your reputation is what helps get you the best prices. Good luck, the fact that you came here to discuss the best course of action shows you're a good guy. I'd be happy to buy from you anytime.

zzzz · January 30, 2005 11:47PM

Solution :
Do what ever YOU feel comfortable doing !!!!

It is YOU that has to live with YOUR decision

Instead of emphising YOUR grade on a raw coin in the main title (twice) I would have mention Your grade and then also put "may have been cleaned"

Myself I wouldn't have had to worry about it ... I DON'T buy raw coins ...

Too me a coin that's RAW is just that ... RAW ... Worth face value

Sorry .. But I'm never impressed with RAW coin sellers with perfect feedback because it is ussually after the buyer gives his positive that he finds more problems then were stated ...

INHO

uofa1285 · January 30, 2005 11:55PM

He made a mistake...let him off the hook and get your refunds from eBay. Relist it or offer it to the underbidders. I've done it before - It's the nice thing to do.

Also, saves both parties from shipping back and forth just to utilize your return policy.

Thanks,

Doug

Rampage · January 31, 2005 12:06AM

<< Sorry .. But I'm never impressed with RAW coin sellers with perfect feedback because it is ussually after the buyer gives his positive that he finds more problems then were stated ... >>

Selling raw coins is not what I primarily do on eBay, but I had them, so I sold them. I stated the coin had a problem. Don't think I just sell raw coins, because I don't. Put a little effort into things and search my past auctions. Ask anyone who has dealt with me on these boards. I am very honest.

As for selling raw coins: Are you saying that you would not buy a $5.00 coin on eBay unless it was slabbed? Some coins do not warrant the fees of getting them graded. This coin was one of them. If it was, I would have sent it to ANACS.

Russ · January 31, 2005 12:14AM

<< But I'm never impressed with RAW coin sellers with perfect feedback because it is ussually after the buyer gives his positive that he finds more problems then were stated ... >>

You might be shocked to learn that some of us have frequently sold raw coins that ended up being a rip for the buyer when they submitted them for grading and the coin became far more valuable than what they paid. Not every seller who offers raw coins is a crook.

Russ, NCNE

kieferscoins · January 31, 2005 12:30AM

<< Sorry .. But I'm never impressed with RAW coin sellers with perfect feedback because it is ussually after the buyer gives his positive that he finds more problems then were stated ... >>

Look at the coin before giving a positive.

Cameron Kiefer

Rampage · January 31, 2005 3:19AM

I think I have made the right decision. Will post it tonight.

Rampage · January 31, 2005 8:03PM

TTT

TerrapinWill · January 31, 2005 10:06PM

I think you did the right thing, even though you could have made an excellent case for not needing to. That puts you head and shoulders above the crowd.

slabfab · January 31, 2005 10:14PM

I agree, your conduct in this matter is admirable.

RickMilauskas · January 31, 2005 10:29PM

Richard,

Whatever you decide to do, I commend you for your honesty (stating the possinle cleaning up front) and your good conscience.
The world needs more individuals like you!

rb7557 · January 31, 2005 10:43PM

<< I think you did the right thing, even though you could have made an excellent case for not needing to. That puts you head and shoulders above the crowd. >>

I think we have all made a mistake when it comes to seeing something we really want, and bidding it without reading the description. I think you could have stuck the bidder with this, as your description states the cleaning. I think you're to be commended on the way you handled the situation.

I need to learn to check my spelling

csw · January 31, 2005 10:45PM

Talk about ethical....
-c-

XpipedreamR · January 31, 2005 11:05PM

I think that you'll probably feel better with this course of action. Are you going to block this bidder in the future?

Rampage · January 31, 2005 11:07PM

<< I think that you'll probably feel better with this course of action. Are you going to block this bidder in the future? >>

No, I will not block the bidder. Mistakes happen.

KurtHorn · January 31, 2005 11:29PM

<< 
UPDATE
I have decided to refund the buyer's money and relist the coin. I tried to put myself in his shoes and think about how I would feel if I made a $227.00 mistake. TRUE, he made placed the bid and won the auction, and TRUE, he failed to read the auction because he rushed into it; but I do not want someone to buy a coin they will not be happy with. I would have a hard time sleeping at night if I made someone buy something they did not want to begin with.

Thank you to all who replied to my post.

Cheers, Richard. >>

Bravo Richard, you are a gentleman and a scholar! -Kurt-

Rampage · February 1, 2005 6:15AM

Thanks again guuys.

Coinhusker1 · February 1, 2005 6:24AM

You did the right thing. Who knows, he my end up buying $1000 worth of stuff from you in the long run.

eBay Situation, What would you do?--UPDATED (See First Post)

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