Barber proof mintage numbers increasing?

Oldnewbie

I've noticed that the mintage fiqures for proof Barber dimes, quarters, and halves from 1909 and up have increased from my 2004 Red Book to the 2005 Red Book.

There my be more mintage changes but these are the ones I've found so far. Anyone know what to make of this?

coinguy1

Oldnewbie, I think there might be some errors involved in the "revised" mintage figures.

I was recently contacted/questioned about the mintage figure (of 380) I had noted for a Proof 1914 Barber Quarter I had listed on my website. All sources I had accessed (including past "Red Books") had shown the figure to be 380 pieces, but apparently, the new "Red Book" shows a much higher figure.

Based upon that, and what you just mentioned, I suspect that there are errors in the new "Red Book".

Oldnewbie

<< <i>Oldnewbie, I think there might be some errors involved in the "revised" mintage figures.

I was recently contacted/questioned about the mintage figure (of 380) I had noted for a Proof 1914 Barber Quarter I had listed on my website. All sources I had accessed (including past "Red Books") had shown the figure to be 380 pieces, but apparently, the new "Red Book" shows a much higher figure.

Based upon that, and what you just mentioned, I suspect that there are errors in the new "Red Book". >>



Mark, that was me that contacted you on that 1914. I'm not sure what to make of all this.

coinguy1

Hi Eric - sorry, I didn't realize that you and "Oldnewbie" were one and the same - you didn't write like you were "old" or a "newbie".

Oldnewbie

I thought I'd bump this for the night crew to see if anyone had any ideas on the subject.

Oldnewbie

Ya' know, I just realized I never did get to the bottom of this. Anyone have some ideas?

Prethen

I think the definitive guide on this would be Breen's Proof book, which I have at home. If someone else has this handy (since I'm at work with no numismatic library...boo hoo), hopefully they can clear it up for you.

Oldnewbie

Yep, after I saw this, I gave up using the 2005 Redbook for mintage figures.

michael

with regards to the 2005 red book on proof barber mintages

the red book has not taken into account that you have true mintages and NET mintages

many time in fact most all of the time with pre 1916 proof coin mintages they melted many coins

and so you take the mintage minus what they melted for the true net mintage

even in modern coin times proofs have been destroyed at the mint and so you subtract the melted coins to get a true mintage a net mintage

the true mintage is waht the 2005 red book has for the example of 1914 proof barber quarter but since this year was a terrible recession for the usa many of these proof barber 1914 quaretes where melted hence the net mintage of 380 and this is proven by mint records accounting records which are accurate and available for the early 20th century

take for instance the mintage of the proof 1862 quarter eagle 35 minted and it is well known and documented that half if not more of the quarter eagles minted this year in proof where melted due to the financial circumstances and lack of sales due to the civil war

and as a side note all these proof 1862 quarter eagles where struck from melted down old worn damaged one dollar gold pieces in the sub treasury vaults

same with proof minor silver coinage of 1860 there might be a mintage of 1000 but at least 600 of the mintage was melted so the true mintage or net mintage is 400


hopefully the red book people will see their misunderstanding of the situation and have a corrected barber proof mintages/net mintages in the 2006 red book


michael



look at all the trade dollars that where melted the world over that where never recorded and even though say for example the 1874 trade dollar biz strike the calcutta mint in india counted and recorded that they melted a substancial portion of the 1874 trade dollar mintage but it is not taken off the official mintage so this adds to the confusion which is understandable

but

there is no excuse not to list net mintages for the proof barbers

when many years of these proof barbers where some where never released from the mint and many where melted and fully accounted for that the net mintages would not be used

but for advanced collectors that have the real mintages net mintages it really doesnot matter either way
they can put 5000 for the mintage of the proof 1914 barber quarter it just makes an advanced collector laugh and not buy the new red book and adds to new collectors confusion which is not positive for the hobby


michael

kranky

There's no reason for the Redbook to not show net mintages on proofs when the documentation exists to justify revising the number. They do it for all the classic commems.