Has anyone argued with David Hall ......AND WON ?
STEWARTBLAYNUMIS
Posts: 2,697 ✭✭✭✭
I have been trying to convince him for some time now that I know how to grade a few coins but I continue to fail.Has anyone EVER won him over and convinced him HE was wrong.
Tell me your secrets.What are his weak spots.
Stewart
0
Comments
Ray
<< <i>I have been trying to convince him for some time now that I know how to grade a few coins but I continue to fail. >>
Maybe your grading and PCGS's grading aren't the same and hence you will never win.
Cameron Kiefer
But who is right?
Joe.
It does sometimes take years to win an argument but I still lose more than I win with him. But I am closing in the "pennant race."
I also got PAID to win an argument since I stumped not only David Hall but also David Q. Bowers along with everyone else in an old Stump the Experts contest!
Secret: Hammering away at Hall does not work. But steady persistence and sticking to your "guns" does. It mighjt take years but what is the hurry?
I would have enjoyed meeting you formally and shared a few jokes and ideas after the PCGS Registry luncheon but I got sidetracked.
New collectors, please educate yourself before spending money on coins; there are people who believe that using numismatic knowledge to rip the naïve is what this hobby is all about.
That is a matter of perspective - not an absolute.
Furthermore lately he has been arrogant to me as though I am annoying him....and I am
Perhaps that is the problem.
Step back and look at the big picture. HRH has been doing this for nigh on 20 years. By the nature of his position, everyone wants something from him. If he wasn't able to effectively tune that out years ago, he would have gone nuts. So, IMO, the best way to win your argument is to not want something from him. State your case and let him do what he wants ... after all, that's what's going to happen anyway so why get stressed out about it?
K S
Mike
<< <i>rumor is that they won the norweb pedigree argument. >>
I'll confirm this.
It increases your chances of success. I am sure even he would second that thought.
David can be a reasonable fella if you reason with him in a measured way without bombarding him. Slow but steady. Keeping it friendly and affable never hurt either since he can be a most affable guy.
He is no different than anyone else that I know (except my 19 year old daughter who is NEVER reasonable).
Cameron Kiefer
Russ, NCNE
Lighten up, it was a joke.
Russ, NCNE
oh yeah, i forgot, once a coin has a slabed grade, your opinion don't mean squat.
K S
I haven't even been able to have an argument with him, let alone win one. I tried contacting him numerous times through various channnels and have never received a reply. Stewart, consider yourself lucky for having his royal highness even speak with you.
David had been arguing vehemently in favor of letting Stewart win an argument with him. But, I argued that David shouldn't do that. After a lengthy and heated debate, I won the argument with David, and as a result, Stewart isn't allowed to win one with David.
Stewart, have you tried to be calm, gentlemanly, flexible, polite and open-minded in approaching David with your argument(s)? Have you tried any ONE of those things? I know you can do it if you try hard enough.
Sorry Stewart, I had to pick on you....
DH gets a big
Go BIG or GO HOME. ©Bill
If you can't no one can.
Registry 1909-1958 Proof Lincolns
And TDN, "nigh on 20 years" is in actuality "nigh on 30 years."
I still recall photos of HRH looking at coins in the Great Eastern Collection catalog back in 1975 or 1976. And I don't think he was a newbie even then.
roadrunner
MS68: I can see why someone wouldn't want to send a red copper coin in every six months .... isn't that just asking for trouble?
<< <i>Edited since some people have no sense of humor..
Russ, NCNE >>
Interesting comment from the King of Bile!
What's NCNE?? Nasty Caustic Nerd Expert?
I'll try them once - after that you pros get your chance ... but all mine are silver. If I owned red copper, I'd be much more reluctant. But I can see where if you do it all the time you just come to regard it as an acceptable risk.
TDN and David- Stop it! You're giving me the willies. I just sent in a prized Lincoln of mine for a second look. If it comes back with ANY mark whatsoever I'll be sick. I can do surgery on a beating heart without getting the least bit excited (O'K, maybe just a little), but if that coin has so much as fleck of lint on it I think I'll get sick and faint.
Jack
Kind of like this...
Me, too!
I had a proof 50's quarter that I had picked out and submitted myself. It came back a PCGS 66/67 CAM. Not an expensive coin by no means, but it had a rather large, fresh fingerprint on the obverse. When I sat down and showed him the coin's obverse fingerprint his response was quite comical (not to me, but he laughed)
"How do I know that we put that fingerprint on that coin! It could have come from you or even the prior owner. That print could be from a galaxy far far away. I'm not paying you for that coin!"
My response -- as I slowly turned the slab over ---
"Okay perhaps you're right, but what about the hair stuck to the back of the reverse, inside the slab -- how do you think that got there?"
"BJ -- We have to buy this coin back."
And with that I was paid full CU Price Guide for it.
Michael
“It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.” Mark Twain
Newmismatist
The most widely doctored coins are gold.Second is silver.Red copper is almost impossible to doctor without detecting.The only thing that I've seen removed from copper in an acceptable fashion is SOME carbon flecks.But more often than not the mechanics that do this (operation) don't know when to stop.Recoloring copper ..hahaha
I also disagree with David Hall that ALL coins must be cracked out in order to be graded at PCGS.TO the best of my knowledge during the16 or so years PCGS has been in business coins have been graded "in the holder" at the request of the submitter.David Hall has done away with the Round Table Review.
Green Label Holders will become Blue Label Holders because David says so.That's it ..NO Exceptions
What about DNC explanations ? PCGS has not as yet done this because they are too busy making money
Stewart
Newmismatist,
That 22-D is in a 66RD holder if you can believe it. It would be my contention that it was very likely the result of mishandling by PCGS and that the fingerprint developed well after being put in the holder. If that's not the case, the graders really missed the boat.
Jack
K S