Toning questions

drjules

Hi all

This may well have come up before and please excuse the newbie questions if it has but: are there any ways for mere mortals such as myself to tell if toning is artificial and what methods are employed to artificially tone coins?

Dr J

FC57Coins

Hey Dr. J - This one of the questions for the ages around here - and the answer in my opinion is - NO - You have to see for yoursel as many toned coins as you can and learn what real toning looks like - only then will you start feeling that gut feel of confidence that you can tell the good from the not so good

SirAnthonyAC

Hi,

Here's a cool link from the PCGS, no photos but it's a start:
PCGS toning page

Anthony

robertpr

Frank is right, it becomes a "gut feeling" after much experience and after you've looked at enough coins, both NT and AT, that "gut feeling" will be right on the money about 95% of the time.

In general, a "monster" toned coin in a third tier slab is something I would be leery of if I can't see the coin in person or if it looks even a little bit fishy. I think most of the AT jobs in third tier slabs have been tried at PCGS, NGC, and/or ANACS. The reason they're not in those slabs I believe is because they got bodybagged and that material then filters to the third tier slabbers (either by the bodybag 'victim' or by the next owner)...though many coins do exist in these slabs that I think are NT as well...

Many of the experts tell people to tell how color "lays" on the coin if it's "deep" (natural) or if it "floats" like it was colored on with a crayon (supposedly AT)

On the other hand, I think the very best thing you can do is learn the natural progression of colors - ROYGBIV - most "monsters" *should* follow this color progression. Anything that doesnt, is probably suspect. FYI, ROYGBIV is for Red, Orange, Yellow, Green, Blue, Indigo, Violet and that is the general order in which colors should follow each other on a naturally toned coin. Just like a rainbow.

Imagine a rainbow where all the colors were mixed up in different places. Wouldn't look right, would it? Well, it doesn't on a coin either.

FrattLaw

The operative word here is doctor -- in my opinion you have to look at toning like a doctor would in regards to making a diagnosis. If a doctor merely looks the sypmtoms ie., the color, progression of such and how the color lays on the surface of a coin, you might make a mis-diagnosis of AT or NT. You have to look at the source of the toning as a doctor would want to run tests to find the virus or the cause of the symptoms.

Certainly types of environments cause certain type of toning. I always ask myself -- how did THAT color get on THAT coin? For instance certain colors that are common on certain coins won't be common on others. For instance if I saw mint set toning on a Franklin Half, it wouldn't cause me to wonder or question the color at first, but the same type of toning on a Ike that was never exposed to the same environment would cause me to think the coin was AT or at least purposeful NT.

Bag toning on Peace $ would be extremely rare. Anything with neon, fishing lure colors MUST be questioned.

Basically, it'll take time, effort, careful study and hard work and even then you will always still not be 100% correct.

The more coins of a particular series you look at the more comfortable you will become, but again, all toning isn't equal. What's right for onr series won't be for another. You have to know the series you are collecting.

Michael

Cladiator

touching on what fratlaw said...

Most series of coins tone differently for many reasons (metal involved, metal content, physical size, how they were most commonly stored, planchet preperation...just to name a few). Use this to your advantage. Instead of trying to learn to spot AT in general just concentrate on the series of coin you are interested in. If I see a Peace dollar rainbow toned with textile marks i would be suspicious but on a morgan dollar i would not be right away suspicious. Pick a series and find as many pcgs/ngc slabbed toners and study them, then compare them with the unreal amount of raw toners on ebay...youll be able to pick out the fake ones soon enough. and when in doubt post a pic here....these guys/gals can and have helped TONS.