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ICG loses more credibility...

Watching the Home Shopping Network guy hawk their wonderful coin bargains the other day, I was a bit surprised to hear the salesman refer to the fact that Keith Love (CEO of ICG) has been on their show!

Then when I thought about it, it made perfect sense: only an idiot would buy coins from HSN, so why not have the president of the Idiot Grading Service on the show!
"Wars are really ugly! They're dirty
and they're cold.
I don't want nobody to shoot me in the foxhole."
Mary






Best Franklin Website

Comments

  • They also sell NGC coins and I have seen PCGS coins also.

    Cameron Kiefer
  • Yes, but you won't see Rick Montgomery or David Hall on HSN!

    My point is that Keith Love appearing a show that rips off naive collectors seems to be an incredibly stupid marketing blunder on ICG's part.
    "Wars are really ugly! They're dirty
    and they're cold.
    I don't want nobody to shoot me in the foxhole."
    Mary






    Best Franklin Website
  • Bushmaster8, unless you personally saw Keith Love's appearance, what he said, how he presented himself, etc., it seems quite unfair to make comments such as the ones you did.
  • Who sez life is fair Mark ?

    And I dont care what Keith said, just the fact that he appeared on the show further discredits ICG IMO.
    "Wars are really ugly! They're dirty
    and they're cold.
    I don't want nobody to shoot me in the foxhole."
    Mary






    Best Franklin Website
  • You don't care what he said? Do you know it was over a year ago, and he only appeared once?

    He is a great guy and before you try to discredit him, get the facts in line.

    Cameron Kiefer
  • Bushmaster, glad to see you keep such an open mind.imageimage
  • LakesammmanLakesammman Posts: 17,282 ✭✭✭✭✭
    You too can be a sniperimage

    Bushmaster Firearms, Inc.
    P.O. Box 1479
    Windham, ME 04062

    "My friends who see my collection sometimes ask what something costs. I tell them and they are in awe at my stupidity." (Baccaruda, 12/03).I find it hard to believe that he (Trump) rushed to some hotel to meet girls of loose morals, although ours are undoubtedly the best in the world. (Putin 1/17) Gone but not forgotten. IGWT, Speedy, Bear, BigE, HokieFore, John Burns, Russ, TahoeDale, Dahlonega, Astrorat, Stewart Blay, Oldhoopster, Broadstruck, Ricko.
  • RussRuss Posts: 48,515 ✭✭✭
    An NGC representative regularly co-hosts The Coin Vault. What is this world coming to?

    Russ, NCNE
  • critocrito Posts: 1,735
    Just like all the other bashing threads, has nothing to do with coins. You don't like the seller so all his stuff must be cr@p.
  • Did they have any to begin with? Bash Bash...
  • flaminioflaminio Posts: 5,664 ✭✭✭


    << <i>Yes, but you won't see Rick Montgomery or David Hall on HSN!

    My point is that Keith Love appearing a show that rips off naive collectors seems to be an incredibly stupid marketing blunder on ICG's part. >>



    You must've missed the Coin Vault shows where NGC was representing. I forgot the guy who was on, but he was there under the auspices of NGC hawking their new multi-holder.

    Does that taint NGC in your mind?
  • ScarsdaleCoinScarsdaleCoin Posts: 5,179 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Think this post is just a bash of ICG and quite an unfair one at that.......but since we are on a PCGS host board, I am sure it will stay until it drops to the bottom......however I wonder if the post read PCGS loses more credibility ...dont you think it would be pulled? and by the way bushmaster8 how would you feel if your name was posted with a title bushmaster8 loses more credibility
    do onto others as you would do for yourselfimage
    Jon Lerner - Scarsdale Coin - www.CoinHelp.com
  • MacCoinMacCoin Posts: 2,545 ✭✭
    I do care who was where I still like ICG coin.


    << <i>They also sell NGC coins and I have seen PCGS coins also >>



    so K Love gets out to do a little marketing

    if only an idiot would buy coins from HSN why are you watching it.
    are you sure you not a closet HSN customerimageimage

    Don't worry ScarsdaleCoin we ain't all going to bash IGC.
    image


    I hate it when you see my post before I can edit the spelling.

    Always looking for nice type coins

    my local dealer
  • BarryBarry Posts: 10,100 ✭✭✭
    ICG had some credibility at one time, then everything was a 70, and that was the end of them. It's rare I see an ICG slab at a show. I see many more NTC and gold PCI slabs. Funny how that works. NTC and PCI have NO credibility so the sleaze dealers are drawn to them. ICG which is not well-respected, but also not an outright fraud like the others, can't find a market niche. Maybe their answer to survival is mass marketing.


  • << <i>I do care who was where I still like ICG coin.


    << <i>They also sell NGC coins and I have seen PCGS coins also >>



    so K Love get out to do a little marketing

    if only an idiot would buy coins from HSN why are you watching it.
    are you sure you not a closet HSN customerimageimage

    Don't worry ScarsdaleCoin we ain't all going to bash IGC. >>



    I agree with Mac.... I think "Bushmaster" is a closet HSN buyer!!!imageimageimageimageimageimageimageimage


  • << <i>My point is that Keith Love appearing a show that rips off naive collectors seems to be an incredibly stupid marketing blunder on ICG's part. >>



    I am a marketing manager and I would say it is possibily the best marketing move he could make. If, as you say, HSN customers are new naive buyers then it is possible IGC slabs will be their first experience with grading services. If their experiences are good, they will have no issues going back to ICG when they learn more and are ready to start submitting coins. NCG and PCGS would still have to show their worth against the proven IGC in their inexperienced minds.

    If the IGC president's appearance nets them a few dozen customers then it was probably worth it. I doubt they are getting a few dozen customers off the street as the word around is NGC and PGSC.
    image

    I can think of a dozen reasons not to have high capacity magazines, but it's the reasons I haven't thought about that I need them.
  • Cameron- I also think Keith is a great guy, and if you read carefully , you will see I am not picking on him. I think ICG is a crappy grading service though.


    "Wars are really ugly! They're dirty
    and they're cold.
    I don't want nobody to shoot me in the foxhole."
    Mary






    Best Franklin Website
  • BaleyBaley Posts: 22,658 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I have 2 coins in ICG slabs and I am very happy with the grading and the coins.

    Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry

  • This is another great thing about PCGS. You would never see David Hall publicly embarrassing himself like these people from the other 4th rate grading services do. PCGS and David Hall let the exceptional quality of their product speak for itself. The other grading services need to promote their junk using spin doctors and 3rd rate experts.

    Thank you PCGS for staying on the high ground!
    WORKING ON SEVERAL MODERN SETS. PCGS COINS ONLY FOR ME!
  • Can you pass me the pitcher of kool-aid you are drowning in fanofmoderns? I think you've had enough to drink today.

    Cameron Kiefer
  • As a newbie it has been drilled into me "buy the coin and not the holder". Wouldn't it be wrong for collectors to "prefer" one service over the other? If you believe the coin is MS66 then you should decide if the price is fair for MS66 even if it's in a Joe Shmoe slab and not pay a premium just because NGC or PCGS slab says it's MS66?
    image

    I can think of a dozen reasons not to have high capacity magazines, but it's the reasons I haven't thought about that I need them.
  • I'd be willing to bet that FOM is even on the CA ballot for governor. If not, he/she is missing out on a good BS opportunity..........Ken
  • airplanenutairplanenut Posts: 21,881 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>I'd be willing to bet that FOM is even on the CA ballot for governor. If not, he/she is missing out on a good BS opportunity..........Ken >>

    Is his first priority expanding PCGS to cover more of the state?

    ASEC- a 66 is a 66 if you think that way... the problem is, at least with HSN, most coins are in ICG 70 slabs... ICG has gotten so loose that a PCGS69, and sometimes 68 can pull more money than an ICG 70. HSN markets these as perfect coins that are exceedingly rare... accurately graded, a coin where you just can't see a tick may be rare... but in ICG holders, they certainly aren't rare at all.

    Jeremy
    JK Coin Photography - eBay Consignments | High Quality Photos | LOW Prices | 20% of Consignment Proceeds Go to Pancreatic Cancer Research
  • I.C.G ( I can't grade) is worthless ; the claim they made in a long running ad in COIN WORLD that their service was superior to PCGS/NGC was a blatent lie. Their coins trade for nickles on the dollar .
  • JohnMabenJohnMaben Posts: 957 ✭✭✭
    Mr, Feld just because Bushmaster (what a name) has an opinion doesn't mean he isn't being open minded, you of ALL people should know that! I agree with also that life is not fair, nor should one ever expect it to be, as we do not live in an ideal world. After saying all of this, I agree with YOU, it depends on what he said while on air, not the fact that he is there.

    John Maben
    Pegasus Coin and Jewelry (Brick and Mortar)
    ANA LM, PNG, APMD, FUN, Etc
    800-381-2646

  • SteveSteve Posts: 3,313 ✭✭✭
    I believe that HSN (Home Shopping Network) basically sells ICG slabs as described. A competing cable network is SAH (Shop at Home) which features "The Coin Vault" and has many hours of coin programing a week, especially their prime time Monday night. They feature NGC slabs, but also show a few PCGS. They comment on air that PCGS and NGC are supperior to other slabbers. Some people get these coin shows mixed up. I rarily watch the HSN coin shows because I don't know when they are on the air in my area. Steveimage
  • a comment made by man of Moderns back in sept. on this post appears to me that he is a seller of PCGS coins. The comment that Mr. Hall would not subject himself to such shows seems a bit one sided- If Pcgs's market share started to take a nose dive to the basement because it was found that their grading was suffering, their customer service was inadequate, and their 'price' guide was over inflated- Do you not think he would get on one of the cable programs that apparently we all watch from time to time just to 'see' what they have this bewitching hour? Hell yes he would- he is in the business obviously to keep his product moving, just like K. Love and the rest.
    what some people may seem to lose forethought of- is the coin itself- the COIN is the mystery to most of us, and I am a NEWBIE at collecting. I don't look at the holder- I look at the coin, if I like it and it is the right price for what I can or am willing to spend then I buy it. Anyone can slab a coin and sell it- but back in 1878- pcgs was not even a twinkle, nor ngc, icg, pci, anacs, etc.- MARKETING what you have in any manner will $ELL.

    BTW- Modern:
    PCGS is not the perfect grader, considering what I just recently went through with them, and then showing many 'professionals' what the 'grade' was given- some were in disbelief, some were downright amazed. Spend little to get graded= low grade. $pend $$= good grade, $pend $$$$=best grade.

  • Michael Dell came on HSN to sell Dells once. So does that discredit Dell.
  • roadrunnerroadrunner Posts: 28,303 ✭✭✭✭✭
    ICG coins, at least in the area of classic and type coins, carries NO weight in the market. They really don't trade either unless you are willing to discount down to the lowest possible grade the coin might come back from PCGS/NGC. I no longer will buy them. The few that I did buy, I lost money on. It really pained me to finally have to crack out a nicely toned ICG PF65 1865 quarter because it was just unsaleable in the holder....even at 64 money. And this was a nice solid 64 coin. It now resides in a PCGS 64 holder and is saleable once again, albeit at a few hundred dollars less than what I paid.
    Bottom line. The ICG grading standards are different from PCGS, NGC and even ANACS. It is another point of confusion that only muddies the waters further. Reduced liquidity and inability to determine what the thing is worth are tough nuts to overlook.

    Most buyers just won't take the time to even look at anything else but PCGS & NGC. The risk is not worth it, at least not on UNC/PF coins. ICG moderns may be a different story and one that I know nothing about.

    roadrunner


    Barbarous Relic No More, LSCC -GoldSeek--shadow stats--SafeHaven--321gold
  • coppercoinscoppercoins Posts: 6,084 ✭✭✭


    << <i>Think this post is just a bash of ICG and quite an unfair one at that.......but since we are on a PCGS host board, I am sure it will stay until it drops to the bottom......however I wonder if the post read PCGS loses more credibility ...dont you think it would be pulled? and by the way bushmaster8 how would you feel if your name was posted with a title bushmaster8 loses more credibility
    do onto others as you would do for yourselfimage >>



    I agree 110%.
    C. D. Daughtrey, NLG
    The Lincoln cent store:
    http://www.lincolncent.com

    My numismatic art work:
    http://www.cdaughtrey.com
    USAF veteran, 1986-1996 :: support our troops - the American way.
    image
  • RussRuss Posts: 48,515 ✭✭✭


    << <i>a comment made by man of Moderns back in sept. on this post appears to me that he is a seller of PCGS coins. >>



    That would be back in September of 2003. BTW, FanOfModerns is just some other member's troll handle. Feel free to ignore "it".

    Russ, NCNE
  • Thanks Russ- point taken- but still I feel the coin is what is important- seems like the yuppie generation is getting out of buying Harley's and jumping into coins.

    56 Panheads still rule!
  • I don't like anybody! So there.


    Jerry
  • I like ICG ... I might agree they might go a little overboard on the modern stuff but I made over $30,000 crossing one coin from ICG to PCGS ...

  • RussRuss Posts: 48,515 ✭✭✭


    << <i>but I made over $30,000 crossing one coin from ICG to PCGS .. >>



    That wouldn't happen to be an MS67 Lincoln?

    Russ, NCNE
  • Yes it is Russ and there was a lot of talk about it on these boards when I put it up on ebay ... You have a good memory .. LOL .. 1910S in MS67RD
  • RussRuss Posts: 48,515 ✭✭✭
    zzzz,

    I love stuff like that. Coin comes up at auction, basically gets ignored by all the big guys, buyer steps up to the plate and gets rewarded for having the nads to plunk down the money. Rock on! image

    Russ, NCNE
  • Actually, I think a smart collector who knows how to grade their series, can find some real nice deals in ICG holders! in fact, with almost every service, this holds true!! I've found a couple Frankies in ICG slabs that would easilly CAM at PCGS or NGC... and many will agree, that ICG is actually a fairly consistant and accurate grader of early 19th and 18th century circulated silver type...
    -George
    42/92
  • mozeppamozeppa Posts: 4,431 ✭✭✭

  • MyqqyMyqqy Posts: 9,777
    Sometimes I like these time warp threads....... although what type of "agenda" would make someone dig these up is rather odd to me......

    Actually, I think a smart collector who knows how to grade their series, can find some real nice deals in ICG holders!

    I agree with this- the key word in above sentence being "smart".......
    My style is impetuous, my defense is impregnable !
  • Coin FinderCoin Finder Posts: 6,944 ✭✭✭✭✭
    This is very strange s one night I was flipping through the channels and landed on the HSN and "coin Time" or whatever it is called. Anyway, the pitch was good and I found it it entertaining noting what they did not say! I must admit I even got excited about some of the stuff. Keith Love was a guest on this particular time slot and was on the program. I found Keiths comments to be way more credible than the "pitch men" however, I did not hear anything way out of line. He seemed like a very knowlegable guy to me.

    Just my two cents

    Tbig
  • ..........excuse me
  • Where is the Bush Miester8??

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