Grades posted 1 out of 3 upgrades

jbsteven

LINE # CERT # COIN DATE DENOMINATION VARIETY GRADE
1 21298616 1880-S S$1 MS67
2 21298617 1885 S$1 MS66
3 21298618 1882-S S$1 MS67

Date Received: 06/05/2003
Date Shipped: No Date Specified



I overnighted these on 6-3-03 and PCGS got them into their system on 6-5-03 for the $50 a coin 7 day service. Grades were posted on 6-10-03 which is the 3rd business day.
The 80-s was a coin I picked up on Sunday morning right before I left Long Beach. The 82s will be in a ms68 holder sometime as I believe it has the look to be in a 68 holder. It has one of the nicest cheeks I have seen on any 67 and most 68's. The 85 was a longshot (cracked out of a NGC ms66 holder.

The 80s was in a older generation PCGS holder and the 82s was in a new PCGS holder.

All coins were cracked out as I do with EVERY coin I send in.

Russ

Which one was the upgrade?

Russ, NCNE

SeattleSlammer

Definitely no offense intended, but it really is depressing to constantly read about coins getting cracked out and regraded. As a collector that intends to keep my coins for some time, I'd much rather have the PQ 67 in the 67 holder and not barely making a 68. Also would rather have a PQ 65 in a 65 holder and not a 66. A solid 65 in a 64 holder would be especially cool.

Maxed out coins are not as fun as those with potential.

I'd rather know that my coins are PQ and have that "what if"-aspect to them. Maybe that's just me. Of course, I don't depend upon coins for any income either, so I can afford to be an idealist about all of this.

Elcontador

Señor Seattle:

We don't know if the coin which upgraded was a 'liner' coin (if it was, I may agree with you), or whether this upgraded coin would look just fine in its new holder. A case in point was when I got a Walker back from PCGS in a 5 holder that looked much better than other 5s I saw. I sent it back & it was upgraded. This coin does not look out of place in a 6 holder, while this may not be the case re a 'liner' coin.

braddick

Congratulations. It is good to see cherrypicking paying off for the diligent and risk taker.

jbsteven

the 80s is the upgrade but the 82s should be in a ms68 holder! very PQ for the grade (reading this seattle?)

the 80s is a middle of the road 67 the 82s is the same but in ms68.

the 80s was in a older holder. I was at long beach and bought a ms66 first gen PCGS 80s for $75 over greysheet because I knew it was a PQ coin and should be a 67. Sure enough with a 1 walkthrough it is in a ms67 holder. Even Seattle would have agreed on this one

braddick:

one thing I can say is I am a risk taker. No guts no glory.

SeattleSlammer

jbsteven,

Just to clarify, I am happy that you are happy.

However, as a collector and as the guy walking up to a dealer's table at a show, I would STILL rather have that 80-S in its original old PCGS holder in MS66 (and not just because of the money)...now that it's in a MS67 holder, not only will it cost the new owner much more, but the odds are good that it's maxed out, and therefore it no longer illicits a nice "wow, that's a PQ coin, probably undergraded, too...." response when you pull it out and show it to your friends. Now it's just a boring common date 67, "properly" graded.

Do you catch my drift?

It's just depressing to hear about people "walking" their coins through PCGS multiple times until the said coin is finally the grade they are shooting for. This is my opinion REGARDLESS of whether or not the coin in question actually is undergraded. Think of it this way: the more truly PQ coins in old holders out there, the more fun there is to be had for the average collector that wants to get a great coin at a great price.

Cheers

jbsteven

Seattle:

I understand your point but would the average collector pay $600 for a ms66 80s Morgan because it was PQ? no they wouldn't

If the same coin is in a ms67 holder then they will pay $600 for it. If they do not like it as a ms67 they can pass.

It is 50 times easier to sell a coin that is middle of the road for the grade for roughly greysheet levels than a PQ coin for triple greysheet.

I have a hard time getting an extra 25% for PQ coins.

Again I understand where you are coming from so I hope you understand the other side.



<< <i>the more truly PQ coins in old holders out there, the more fun there is to be had for the average collector that wants to get a great coin at a great price >>



It is also good for dealers that find the undergraded by todays standard coin and having them upgraded to todays standards. It kind of works both ways as a collector you want to find a PQ coin for cheap and so do dealers!

paigowjohnny

plus those old rattler holders drive me crazy...they gotta put some rub on the coin over time.

jbsteven

that's what I figure too! I was actually doing the collecting community a favor

baccaruda

Seattle -

I agree with your thinking, somewhat.

For example I'm willing to spend quite a bit on 1 nice commem - I want an Oregon. I'd be willing to pay $500-$600 for a 66, but a 65 may be just $200. Then I think "That 66 is likely just a 65 that was submitted 500 times until it came back a 66". I'll stick with the 65. Then I'll think the same thing about the 65 actually being a 64.

So now I've decided I can't even buy it on Ebay, I have to buy nice coins sight-seen for just this reason. It's best to buy coins that are 1 grade below a huge price-jump.

Dog97

I never did have much luck with the 80-S. They seemed to be tough on that one for some reason. My favorite was the 81-S. There were tons of them around in 66 for less than $200 and I could always get them in a 67 holder which was a doubling of my $$ even after the grading fees etc were added in. Along about 1998 all my 6's started coming back as 6's so I was basically buying $200 coins and selling them for $180 so I quit all that mess.
It was also about the time PCGS changed from green inserts to blue inserts. The days of the easy upgrades are over & it's not worth my time of $$ to play the game anymore.
The ocasional pq undergrade liner that I find I do snag up for my personal collection. I'll agree that everybody says buy the coinnot the holder but are not willing to PQ $$ for common Morgans in common grades. Collectors forget all about the coin because it's easier to just match the grade on the slab with the grade in a pricelist.

SeattleSlammer

jbsteven,

I totally see your side of it, too. I'm just greedy and want to discourage all dealers from upgrading coins so that I can get to those coins first! Still, I don't like it when I know a coin has been regraded multiple times and is just barely clinging to the bottom of its grade.

I know I wish I'd gotten to your 68 PCGS monster reverse rainbow while it was still raw.....who knows how much that traded hands for originally? (perhaps you do?) I can see it now, "this color must be fake, but it has a pretty cheek, I think it's a 66, I'll give it to you for $200...."

jbsteven

I would have given my left AND right nuts for my ms68 raw for $200!

I do not know what it sold for raw. I bet it was a little cheaper than what it is going for now