are toned coins dead?
barney
Posts: 205 ✭
According to Goldberg, they are...
They estimate the value of my '86 Morgan to be $300. you know, the one that Adrian took a picture of? the one that everyone liked, though many though that I indeed paid too much? Needless to say, I was not pleased. I must pay a $650 fee to withdraw my coins from their auction in late May, since my 13 coins have already been photographed and catalogued. As of this time I do not wish to pay the fee. I simply wish to recoup as much money from my foolish foray into coins as possible. In fact, I followed advice from this message board when I decided to sell the '86 Morgan and go with Goldberg. The coin is displayed on eBay LIVE! and in their catalog.
comments?
I will only respond to email at sdsu6993117@yahoo.com if anyone wishes to p/m me. Otherwise, I hope this sparks a lively discussion on the status of unusually-toned coins in the market. My next hobby will be rubbing wooden sticks together to keep warm under a bridge where I will live because of my financial follies.
Thank you,
Barney
They estimate the value of my '86 Morgan to be $300. you know, the one that Adrian took a picture of? the one that everyone liked, though many though that I indeed paid too much? Needless to say, I was not pleased. I must pay a $650 fee to withdraw my coins from their auction in late May, since my 13 coins have already been photographed and catalogued. As of this time I do not wish to pay the fee. I simply wish to recoup as much money from my foolish foray into coins as possible. In fact, I followed advice from this message board when I decided to sell the '86 Morgan and go with Goldberg. The coin is displayed on eBay LIVE! and in their catalog.
comments?
I will only respond to email at sdsu6993117@yahoo.com if anyone wishes to p/m me. Otherwise, I hope this sparks a lively discussion on the status of unusually-toned coins in the market. My next hobby will be rubbing wooden sticks together to keep warm under a bridge where I will live because of my financial follies.
Thank you,
Barney
Nicht mehr Münzen-für jetzt!
0
Comments
years ago. Toned coins will always be in demand if the quality of the coin upon which
the toning lies is of the highest quality. Even in a level to down market, rare beauty and high
quality will always be in demand. Our greatest lessons in life are always tought us by our errors.
Poor judgement gives us experience which leads , in most cases to wisdom.
Camelot
<< <i>Barney, If stupidity were a retail commodity, I would have cornered the market
years ago. Toned coins will always be in demand if the quality of the coin upon which
the toning lies is of the highest quality. Even in a level to down market, rare beauty and high
quality will always be in demand. Our greatest lessons in life are always tought us by our errors.
Poor judgement gives us experience which leads , in most cases to wisdom. >>
........well said bear.......if you have a superb coin, one of the highest quality, original never messed with, one that stands apart from the run of the mill kind ...... displaying a world of color that only time, and nature can give... like an artist who paints the colors of springtime.........or one that looks like it has been touched by the hand of god........they will always be in demand.........
dont worry about their estimate on their worth. The type of people that are in the market for your coin (if it is nice like you say) dont look at auction estimates. There is a market for toned coins that goes beyond auction estimates. Believe it or not, there is alot of strategy in preshow estimates. Auction houses do that kind of stuff for specific reasons....
John
siliconvalleycoins.com
Your coin should do ok in the auction. C to B+ color and grade coins have leveled at the 1.5 to 3x grey prices. A to A+ color coins are still getting good action (10x and up) and will always get it. Your coin has A+ color for a 2 sided Morgan. The only issue is your into the coin about $1200 more than its worth.
Did you put a reserve on the coin? What is your lot buy back %?
TBT
Heck I have a few I stepped up for because I wanted to obtain ownership. And if I went to sell, and didn't go the right route I wouldn't even get a kiss first. Sometimes that's important.
You need to get past that one Morgan and move on. I remember you put your coin on eBay and it was up to about 1800.00 which I know what you paid for the coin was more.... then you stopped the auction.
Notice I said earlier about going the right route when selling. There are people that will pay good money but you have to go to the right people when selling coins and even more with toned coins.
But sometimes we have to take some sort of loss, meaning... some people will go to their grave before losing 5.00 on a coin.
I just sold a fair amount of toned coins and either went to the person I bought it from and took a small hit on the coin, or knew somebody that would appreciate what I had. I just look at it as I owned the coin and enjoyed it for a while. If I bought a couch and sold it a year later I wouldn't get even close to what I paid.
People buying coins as a collector need to understand it is a hobby. Now I don't like losing money but, I did recoup most of what I spent. Maybe lost 15-20% which ain't bad considering I paid much more than sheet prices for them. Anyway, good luck to you and it's a beautiful Morgan I would love to have.
I love toned coins, especially when the luster is bursting thru the toning. Thats like a clear dark sky set off by the moon & the stars [it sings to me]
Collecting is at it's best when its looked at for what it should be a hobby, the greatest hobby on earth, but its a hobby not an investment. You want an investment buy real estate, you want a hobby buy the 1837 brown large cent i sold mike printz. Les
When we are planning for posterity, we ought to remember that virtue is not hereditary.
Thomas Paine
Toned coins are not dead, they are doing quite well. However, they need to have the look that most people appreciate. Dark toned coins usually go begging, because it's just not what people appreciate, though it may be original. Your 86P certainly is not dark, and does have a great deal of eye appeal. It is a coin people appreciate. $1800 for an MS64 should tell you that, though you did pay more. Toned dollars have done very well in the Goldbergs' auctions, but keep in mind that you are not marketing an entire collection of them, so you don't have a few horses to make up for the tortoises. While your experience can understandably drive you away from coins, why not learn from it, get better at buying coins and build a set that will bring you more appreciation and far less worry. We can always walk away from a deal, though we don't always do so. Want to swap mistake stories sometime?
I did learn one thing though...I found that the word of Larry Goldberg (his quote) wasn't worth a hoot.
Live and learn!
I don't think there is anyone on this board or across the street that has not felt buyer's remorse about some of his / her purchases, or for that matter, had similar feelings about other things we've done in our lives.
Hell, I still think about a race I ran while on the high school track team where the other guy beat me in a photo finish. At the time, I didn't think there was enough room to pass the guy on the inside, and that was the difference. I still wonder about my decision and that happened over 30 years ago!
I think about the Long Beach Show 4 years ago where I bought the nicest Barber Dime in MS 65 I saw on the floor when I should have not bought anything that day. It happens. As long as you learn something from it,
it's not a bad thing.
"Seu cabra da peste,
"Sou Mangueira......."
Toned coins are ALIVE and yummy
Conversely, when estimates are silly on the high side, some potential bidders are scared off and don't bid at all, when they otherwise would have.
In almost all cases, whether the estimates are high or low and whether the grades on the grading labels are too low or too high, to some extent, at least, coins will sell themselves.
An attractively toned coin should command a premium; I won't argue that.
I just don't think toning should command an insane premium.
One problem is how one decides what attractive toning is. For some folks, it just means color; never mind how heavy or streaky or blotchy or patterned it may be. I'm not one of those folks. I like light toning and pastel colors, but I like 'em evenly distributed, and preferably in concentric circles, (i.e. "target" toning). I do NOT like a lot of the "monster toned" coins that have been fetching fat premiums recently, particularly Morgan dollars. I do not like "textile" toning. I do not like blotchiness and streakiness, or anything that makes it harder to see the coin's features.
To each his own.
Toned coins certainly are NOT dead around here!
<< <i>YES, toned coins are dead. Bring out your dead..........bring out your dead...............AND GIVE THEM ALL TO ME.
........hey! get in line
I don't think toning is dead but buyers are more saavy and seem to know the $100 coins from the $2,000 coins.
The Goldbergs are very good at photographing and selling toned Morgans. I am sure that your coin will get good coverage in the market and you can be comfortable that the price yielded from the auction will be close to right. I don't know if May is a good auction month. I think generally early summer and spring are good.
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
yahoos and some interesting prices can result.
Camelot
From what I can gather though, I understand he tied up a tremendous amount of money in a 86 Morgan. It has long been my posistion that paying more than $300 or so for a common date Morgan is asking for trouble. At the Charlotte show I saw a PCGS MS64 85-O trade hands at $1600. I'm sorry, but this is ridiculous. There are plenty of very nicely toned common date Morgans that can be had for under $300 if you are persistent and look. I sell lower priced toned Morgans, and they sell well. The problem is when you pay a $500, $1000, or more premium for a common date Morgan you are dealing with a very thin market and it is very easy to sustain major losses buying them.
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
<< <i>I must have missed an image of the coin Barney is speaking of, so if someone could post a link to it I would like to see it. >>
Eric,
I believe this one is Barney's Morgan.
Russ, NCNE
They did a decent job with the photo. I think the photos Anaconda took were better.
Camelot
on a coin or coins a number of times in our collecting .
Camelot
sincerely michael
i think this coin will bring around $2000.00 including the juice
- j c c
Carl Wohlforth was with me when I bought the coin and he had severe reservations. The seller held firm to his price and I went for it. I do have problems with impulse buying and that's just something I have to learn from, as is the case with the '86.
Forturnately, I HAVE learned from the experience. I will stay away from coin collecting indefinitely until I get other facets of my life in order. I came into $30K in March and sank $10K in my friend's biofuel business (12% guaranteed interest for one year), bought a classic '59 Chevy (ask LucyBop about it!) and put the rest in the bank.
I recently asked the original seller, Evan Gale, if he would like to purchase the coin. He declined, citing recent heavy purchases. Anaconda Adrian, as have many others, suggested that Goldberg was the best route. The auction item is 58015 if anyone would like to look at the coin on eBay Live!
The coin has already received 5 absentee bids and I expect a significant loss on that coin. But it is ONLY one coin. And who knows? Maybe there's someone out there who will love it as much as I did and pay as much as I did.
I consider this just another example of "love at first sight." The coin was there, I had a collection of coins that I had already spent too much for, so it was essentially a trade. Yes, it was a loss, but again, caveat emptor, and I did not even know what an '86 booked for until I posted the pic here! Definitely a foolish venture, but so be it.
You play high stakes here. As an ex? gambler, you need to know the rules-and you need to be one step ahead of others to make the $. If one is only a collector, it's no big deal. I enjoyed collecting coins in the 2 years that I was involved, but knowing how much I lost was a bit difficult to swallow. But that's business, fellas.
Take care and thanks again,
Barney
I don't think you necessarily need to run away from coins. Coins are like anything else you buy- you must find out what it is worth before buying. You wouldn't pay $10 a gallon for gas because that is way too much at the moment. Same with coins. While toned Morgans are somewhat subjectively priced, the real experts (TBT, Anaconda, Morganluver, Drew) can all give you a pretty close range of what a coin might do in the toned market. I was astonished when I read that you had around $3,000 in the coin and thought at the time that your coin was not alot different than many I had seen in the $300-1,000 range. I'm not a real expert but I've bought enough that I can immediately spot the Snakey Morgans that are too unique and beautiful to be in my buying range. Your coin, subjectively, never hit me as being something I could not afford- admittedly a vague standard but it actually works well as a gauge.
People here say it alot but education by books, Forum, or "hard knocks" is how you learn about coins. You learned a lesson by hard knocks. If you like coins, that's no reason to quit- just a reason to learn more and be careful.
Best of luck in your auction!
JAMES
Apropos of the coin posse/aka caca: "The longer he spoke of his honor, the tighter I held to my purse."
Left a long time ago. It wasn't pelasant.
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
This is one of the common fallacies in the coin biz. While dealers always say that they want to buy their coins back, the truth of the matter is they either cannot afford to or are embarrassed about how little they can offer. It is has been very rare when I've ever sold a coin back to the original seller.
roadrunner
the second biggest fallacy is that dealers only mark stuff up about 10-15%. what do you think the third biggest fallacy about dealers is?? my guess is that they know how to grade!! many are mediocre at best, that's why they get beat!!
al h.
<< <i>are toned coins dead? >>
All I can say is
<< <i>are toned coins dead? >>
Go here if you you want an answer to your question.
Toned Coin Collectors Forum
Check out either the Toned Coins boards or the Rainbow Room. I think you will find that the passion for collecting toned coins is alive and VERY healthy
“It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.” Mark Twain
Newmismatist
I can then get more of them for my buck!
pre 1916 proof and ms minor coinage 50 cents and below ,,,,technically choice to gem grade extremely eye appealling original toned coins with the right look flash and blast and vibrancy the market is not dead but alive and well and has not even started yet as you aint seen nothing yet
and walkers and buffs and franklins monster toned high grade ms/pf 66 and above still on their way up not even close to their highs
and the above coins need to be extraordinary eye appealling coins with extraspecial qualities and most of what i see on many boards as being touted as monster great exceptional stunning toned coins are not even close
and that is okie
but for the right noned coins the market is great and getting greater the problem is what most all call great toned coins are not even close
and that is okie too
not good or bad just the way it is
michael