US Mint Surcharges - Scandal?

chiefbob

Until reading the Coin World issue that arrived yesterday, I had no idea that the recipient organization had to raise the equivalent amount of the Mint sales-collected surcharges. If they don't, they receive absolutely nothing from the Mint. What a bunch of BS.

I thought that, by buying some of the Mint commemoratives, I was contributing my surcharge to that organization. If the organization can't raise the total surcharges collected, especially if the coin is a quick sellout, they should at least get dollar for dollar raised.

Does it bother anyone else that you pay a surcharge and it might be pocketed by the Mint? If the recipient organization doesn't get anything, the surcharges collected should be refunded to the Mint customers who purchased that particular coin.

Conder101

Yes it bothers me and I have known about it for years. I consider it to be fraudulent or deceptive advertising on the part of the government. One other thing that you didn't mention. Even if the organization does raise the matching funds, if the coin doesn't sell well, or the mint goes overboard say on the advertising, or for some reason the mints cost aren't covered by their share of the mark up in the price of the coin then they recover their losses out of the surcharges earmarked for the organization. So the organiztion could raise the matching funds and still get nothing. Now to me that surcharge money is a "donation" to the organization and it is their money. For the mint to appropriate the money for their own uses is just theft.

kranky

I just got my Coin World today with that story. It's a shame that any commem program would end up just putting more money into the Mint's pocket - regardless of their lack of fundraising ability.

According to the article, of the commems from 1997-2002, only two resulted in no surcharges being turned over to the organization, which are the Black Revolutionary War Patriots and the Leif Erikson Millennium coins. The Mint pocketed nearly $3 million of surcharges on those.

I'm sure the Mint thanks you who bought those coins!

Conder101

Only two recieved none of the surcharges but how many had their take significantly reduced? (And that doesn't even include things like the Jackie Robinson coin that had the first million of its surcharge funds drained away and given to the US Botanical Gardens, a cause that had already had its own coin. The head of the Botanical Garden was the wife of the congressman/senator who added the ammendment to the Jackie Robinson bill that siphoned off the surcharge money.)

Russ

It isn't the same thing with the post office is it? I bought a bunch of the 45¢ stamps. I hope the whole of the extra goes where it's supposed to.

Russ, NCNE

kranky

<< <i>Only two recieved none of the surcharges but how many had their take significantly reduced? >>



According to the article, for the commems from 1997-2002, only these coins did NOT have all surcharges paid to the organization:

Black Revolutionary War Patriots: surcharges collected $1,122,800, paid nothing
Leif Erikson Millennium: surcharges collected $2,749,810, paid $1,020,830, unpaid balance $1,728,980 (the Mint paid the money to the Central Bank of Iceland under a memorandum of agreement between the Mint and the CBI)
2002 Winter Olympics: surcharges collected $3,592,380, paid $2,638,220, unpaid balance $953,756
2002 Military Academy Bicentennial: surcharges collected $3,907,160, paid $2,876,220, unpaid balance $1,030,940.

The other 11 programs all got the total surcharge.

nwcs

Simply appalling. I had no idea that the mint did this. They should be ashamed of themselves. Especially when you consider the extraordinarily generous seignorage they receive on all business strike coins.

relayer

The biggest scandal is that they resell their returns.

You can buy 1000 proof sets, cherry pick them and return 980 back for a refund and those sets get sold again as original.

Conder101

They have some pretty hefty markups for themseves on the commemorative coins too! I don't collect the commems so I'm hot sure what the current price for the silver coins is but I think it is at least $28. Ten dollars of that is surcharge for the organization, allow five dollars for the silver (I know that is high, I'm being generous to prove my point.) and another five dollars for fabrication costs and the holder, plus the one dollar face value that the mint accounting always wants to claim for themselves. That leaves seven dollars PER coin for advertising and marketing with anything not spent for those puposes being the mints profit. Now does the mint really spend more than seven dollars per coin advertising these things? If they do they should stop considering more than 90% of their sales come from their existing mailing list anyway.


I also wonder if any of those organizations were able to circumvent the law and receive their surcharges even without the matching fundraising? I know in the case of the Buffalo dollar they were trying to get to because they were having trouble raising the money. But I don't know if were successful or not. I also wonder about the visitors center and the Library of Congress. I don't see those as being real successful fundraising groups.

tgilliams

It's time we bring this scam to the attention of our legislators. We pay the premium and the mint uses a loop-hole to keep it. Would love to see the Mint Director explain their position to Congress. I bet some heads would roll, and it's about time. We are the first to point out abuses of other countries, appears to be a double standard. We hold ourselves above everyone else, except when it affects us.

A little off the subject, but reminds me of a story where we contrived an international incident that we outright lied about.

In 1969 I had rotated out of Nam and was stationed in Japan for the remainder of my tour. I was the tower supervisor and was called back into work. The Air Station I was assigned to had a squardon of P-3's (Electronic Spy Planes). We launched a search for a P-3 that was supposedly shot down over South Korea by the North Koreans.

However, the seach area was 61 miles inside North Korea and plane was located 69 miles inside North Korea. The Stars & Stripes (Military Newspaper) and the New York Times ran a story and headline "North Korean's Broached South Korean Airspace and Shot Down our P-3 in South Korean Airspace".

This story came out the day after we launched our search in North Korea. Two days later only story that ran was plane was found-no mention that it was found in North Korea. Makes you think just how "lily-white" the US is. Same story about troops in Cambodia. It took 20 years before we admitted we lied. We are the best nation in the world, but don't EVER believe all our Propaganda. It's written only to further our own needs.

All countries engage in this, but the US never admits it, only points out other countries faults, while telling Americans we are Perfect. Makes you thnk what else we have lied about to further our interests. Granted the Mint Scam is small potatos, but certainly follows a pattern.

I gave 4 years of my life to the US Marine Corps and 14 pieces of scrapnel in my back. I love this country, but we preach "Do as we say, not what we do". And don't feed us the BS that Saddam was the only reason we're in Iraq. They have the 5th largest oil reserves and what was the only Iraqi government's installations we guarded-the oil fields. A large portion of Bush's contributions to his campaign came from who? The Texas oil company's. Go figure!!

BillJones

The main scandal is the surcharges in the first place. They are a tax that placed upon coin collectors, and they have been excessive for years. Many of the coins are sold for prices that are usually higher than the coins are worth as collectors' items.

As for the organization, if there is so little interest in it that it can't raise the money to meet the requirements, one might ask how worthy is it to receive what is really a subsidy from the government?

These changes to the way that the surcharges are paid out were a result of the Atlanta Olympics. That year Congress authorized 16 different coins in two formats, Proof and Mint State for a total of 32 pieces. Most collectors bulked at that, and the program raised less money that it cost to run it. As a result, John Q. Taxpayer ended up with the bill for the shortfall.

Like I have written before, I hope that the governemnt NEVER has a coin program in it with as many coins was in the Atlanta Olympic coin program.