Does it really matter what the dealer paid for the coin...

RYK

if you really want it?

Hypothetically, let's say you need an 1879-O $20 to complete a set (I do--that part is not hypothetical). At a coin show:

Dealer A offers to sell you a nice PCGS XF-45 for $6000 ($400 above Trends). He just bought the coin from a collector earlier that day for $5250, and he shows you credible documentation for the transaction.

Dealer B offers to sell you an equally appealing PCGS XF-45 for $5500. He tells you he bought it an estate sale for $500. The person selling the coin did not notice the "O" mint mark on the reverse and sells it to him as a "P".

Dealer C offers to sell you a similarly appealing, same grade coin, for $5000. You ask him why he can sell it for so much less than Dealer A or B, and he tells you that he would rather not say, but that it was legit (not stolen).

All dealers are well-known, reputable folks. Which dealer do you choose to buy the coin from?

VonZipper

D.

Petescorner

I'd go back to the estate sale seller who doesn't notice mint marks!

Russ

No, it doesn't matter. I'd buy whichever one I found most appealing.

Russ, NCNE

michael

i am assuming it is a legit coin from a legit seller

then i really do not care or want to know what the seller paid
it would be okie if they told me

but not necessary

all i want to know is how much do they want for it?

then based on the coin i can deside for myself

sincerely michael

lordmarcovan

What the seller bought it for is between him and the person he bought it from. If it's a good deal for me as a buyer, and I can get a nice coin at a nice price, I personally don't care if the dealer is making an obscene profit, or just barely squeaking by on a thin margin. That's his business.

If I am the dealer, sometimes I'm up front with a potential customer on what I paid for a coin- obviously, he wants to know what the lowest price I'll sell it for is (can't blame him there- we all want a good price, right?) I, on the other hand, want to sell the coin for as much as I can get, but I want to give the customer a good deal, too, so he'll come back and consider me a stand-up guy.

So, often I end up saying frankly,

"I have XXX in this coin, and it lists for XXX. Make me an offer that'll leave me a decent profit, but still give you a price you can live with, so everyone can be happy."

Usually, an agreement can be reached with a minimum of haggling or hassle. Most customers don't want to insult a dealer by lowballing them, and most dealers don't want a potential customer to walk away. If my margin is absurdly thin, as it often is, or something is just hard to find or replace, then I tell 'em the price is firm. If, on the other hand, I got the coin for a ridiculously low price and stand to make a very fat profit, I don't volunteer the fact, but if the customer asks, I say I got it for a good price and there's a little room to bargain.

Dog97

If they are similarly appealing then I buy the cheapest. That's a no-brainer.

Lakesammman

The only thing that matters is what the coin is worth. Who cares what they paid? If reasonable, buy it. If not, pass. It's not something to agonize over - it's just a decision. Decide and move on.

coinlieutenant

In answer to your overall question, no it doesnt matter. Nor do I think you should ask a dealer unless you have a close relationship with them. Generally bad etiquette and it puts a bit of tension in the deal if he decided not to tell you.

There are some dealers who will volunteer the info. Some dont. It is generally a sign of respect if a dealer tells you his price. As a collector I will sometimes tell dealers that I like the same information, but again only if I respect them.

bottom line: If you like the coin and you are willing to pay that price after negotions end then buy it!

John

Mrpawn

I have not figuired out why it is any of the buyer's business what the dealer paid for the coin. Any one that would like to enlighten me feel free to do so

My choice between dealer A B or C is which ever one is the best coin for the price offered. None are stolen. Documentation of prices paid is easily falsified. I figuired out my (former) main coin dealer's cost code long ago, so what? If the coin was what I wanted at a price that I was willing to pay then what does it matter what he paid for it or when he bought it? Some he doubled his money on - others he only made a few dollars or broke even - on a few he even lost money on. Market changes and perceptions of value matter more than what the person selling you the coin paid for it.

dorkkarl

i'd buy the coin i liked the most

K S

Steve27

Unless I saw a sworn statement from the previous owner, I would not believe any of the dealer's stories, and I would buy the coin which had the best price. A common bargaining technique is to set a floor, the story beginning with "this is what I paid for the coin so I can go any lower," is one of the most common ways used to establish one. Best thing to do when you hear those words is walk away.

dorkkarl

for me, this always comes down to what i learned from the most wise coin dealer i ever knew:

if you like the coin, if you really really like it, the price does not matter

if you honestly & carefully ALWAYS follow this rule, then the issue of what a dealer paid for the coin is a moot point

K S

BigD5

Buy the coin you like. The rest of the mumbo jumbo means diddly.
Ever go into a car dealership, and they offer to sell you a car for x amount over "invoice"? Means nothing.
Dealer B is going to rip someone. If you like the coin, why not let it be you? If the scenario were true, I'd really push this seller for the sale though. You could get a deal here.
Dealer C is politely telling you it's none of your ****ing business, would you like to buy the coin?

I never ( at least I can't remember ever asking) ask what someone paid for a coin. Doesn't really matter. If the offered price makes sense, great. PLENTY of dealers will let you know what they paid (true or not) for a coin.

BillJones

As long as the dealer has good and clear title to the coin, and I like the coin and the price, I buy the coin. Period.

RYK

Most of the respondents here support my point. If the coins are equal, you probably would buy the least expensive coin, no matter what the dealer paid, said he paid, refused to divulge he paid, etc for the coin. So it really does not matter to the buyer whether the seller found the coin on the sidewalk thirty years ago or paid more than you would paid for it in acquiring it.

ksteelheader

I'd buy the coin with the best price IMO............Ken

MadMonk

Ultimately, It's what I'll pay for it that matters.

agentjim007

How 'bout this senerio. The dealer "rips" the coin for a hundred bucks, it's a $1K coin. It's beautiful and you would give the dealer $1K in a second knowing he paid $100. You would probably even go to $1500 because you really, really , really want it. The dealer wants $2K. Are you pissed now?

RYK

007,

If $2000 is a reasonable price for the coin, and I really want it, I would buy it. If the price is not reasonable, I would not buy it.

dorkkarl

<< <i>The dealer "rips" the coin for a hundred bucks, it's a $1K coin. It's beautiful and you would give the dealer $1K in a second knowing he paid $100. You would probably even go to $1500 because you really, really , really want it. The dealer wants $2K. Are you pissed now? >>

no. i don't see how this has bearing on the situation.

it sounds like you are not being honest w/ yourself.

put it another way, if you decide that the price on a coin is too high, you won't pay it, then the reality is, you did not really, really want it. the reality is that you were NOT honest w/ yourself. that's the reality, the honest part of this equation that is difficult for most folks to grasp, but i assure you, if you follow that philosophy w/out wavering, being REALLY HONEST WITH YOURSELF, i guarnatee you will discover it to be the truth.

(note that this works for coin collectors only. if you are a coin DEALER (or coin-dealer wannabe), then it is not relevant.)

agentjim007, you complain about various & asundry things on the forum - how you get screwed on this , how you got screwed on that - that's fine! that's great! but if you want to become a truly satisfied coin collector, if you ever want to be happy w/ how your collecting coins, you MUST realize that the only factor of any consequence is: do you like the coins you own, regardless of price, regardless of grade, regardless of where it came from, or who it's pedigreed to, & regardless of what ANYONE else says about the coin, do you like it

as a coin collector, i will say it AGAIN & again & again:

if you like the coin, if you really REALLY like it, then it's price does not matter

enjoying the hobby is really exceedingly simple. it's that noise that drowns out most people's enjoyment of coins.

K S

agentjim007

I am not asking my self this question I am asking you. Would it piss you off or not..yes or no. The answer is that easy and I was curious. My answer would be probably a little aggravated but in this senerio it would be a scarce coin ( if I really wanted it) and I would tell myself your not going to find another for a long time if ever and I would most likely buy it. My ass is open keep blowin the smoke up it if you like.

agentjim007

Listen Dork...I do talk about my mistakes here but usually take the blame, like I paid too much or did something stupid. A well seasoned collector like you has nothing to learn but some one just might say I can learn something from his stupid mistake.

dorkkarl

i answered your question w/ the 1st word i put in my response (after your quote)

K S

agentjim007

Yes you did answer in one word..very good, you had quite a blech afterwords

dorkkarl

<< <i>Listen Dork...I do talk about my mistakes here but usually take the blame, like I paid too much or did something stupid. A well seasoned collector like you has nothing to learn but some one just might say I can learn something from his stupid mistake. >>

bwuahahahahahah! dude, i got PLENTY to learn, i know only the tiniest little flimsy smidgeon of what there is to know about collecting. in comparison to what there is to know, i don't know jack!

but jimmy-bop-007, lemme tell you, there is 1 thing i DO know. you will never become a satisfied collctor till you realize what i just told you. all that worry about making a stupid mistake, paying to much, blah blah blah, it don't mean diddly if you never learn about what you enjoy.

BUY THE COINS YOU REALLY REALLY LIKE, & don't worry about what all those "other" people are telling you what you should buy or how bad they say you got ripped off.

K S

agentjim007

It's not about worrying about stupid mistakes it's trying to learn from them and hopefully avoiding doing it again (which I haven't perfected yet) I have many coins I am proud of owning, pieces with wondferful history behind them. I suppose as long as there is another coin I would like I'll never be a satisfied collector. Dork you win, I loose...OK?

RYK

007,

Regarding the "would it pi$$ you off" part of the question, I would answer no. If the seller could get $2000 for the coin, and I think that price is more than I should pay for it, that is fine and good for him/her. I will keep looking. If I REALLY, REALLY wanted the coin, I would probably buy it for any price that I could comfortably afford. I guess that I agree with Dorkkarl on this point.

dorkkarl

no way agentjim007!

nobody does it better
makes me feel sad for the rest
nobody does it half as good as you
except maybe, K S

Dabigkahuna

I was waiting for a punch line. Something like, this was a the same coin in each case. This I have seen happen before and it does make you wonder what the real price might be.

I don't see where there would be any conflict so buy the coin you like best. IMHO


Larry
Dabigkahuna