Annoyed question for dealers
EVillageProwler
Posts: 5,856 ✭✭✭✭✭
Since late last year, a key date higher-grade MS Seated Dollar had been (until very recently) on a fairly well known modest-sized dealer's web site. To my surprise, the coin was also consigned to the Bowers Rarities auction at FUN '03. I won that coin at auction, but did not then realize that the auction coin and the dealer specimen were the same coin.
I went to the dealer's table and inquired about the coin. They (a father/son team) claimed absolutely ZERO knowledge of the coin. I just assumed they forgot -- which was kinda weird -- and walked away.
After the show, I noticed the coin was still on their web site, and I compared my coin to their image. It was the same coin. By this point, several friends of mine also told me about the coin (that's on their web site).
A week or so before Baltimore, I politely emailed these folks about the coin and asked them to look into it.
I find out today that the coin had just been removed from their site. No acknowledgement from them. No thanks, no apologies, nothing.
My question to the dealers is ... how do you think you can get away with this kind of questionable behavior? The Internet is an excellent way of disseminating information.
I am pretty annoyed and will not lightly do business with these people ever again. Moreover, I will not recommend them to any of my friends.
EVP
PS They are members here, but they post very infrequently and primarily to advertise.
I went to the dealer's table and inquired about the coin. They (a father/son team) claimed absolutely ZERO knowledge of the coin. I just assumed they forgot -- which was kinda weird -- and walked away.
After the show, I noticed the coin was still on their web site, and I compared my coin to their image. It was the same coin. By this point, several friends of mine also told me about the coin (that's on their web site).
A week or so before Baltimore, I politely emailed these folks about the coin and asked them to look into it.
I find out today that the coin had just been removed from their site. No acknowledgement from them. No thanks, no apologies, nothing.
My question to the dealers is ... how do you think you can get away with this kind of questionable behavior? The Internet is an excellent way of disseminating information.
I am pretty annoyed and will not lightly do business with these people ever again. Moreover, I will not recommend them to any of my friends.
EVP
PS They are members here, but they post very infrequently and primarily to advertise.
How does one get a hater to stop hating?
I can be reached at evillageprowler@gmail.com
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Comments
A common tactic. Bait and switch. You order the dollar and they send you something else and hope you keep it. I will take some heat,
but so what. It is hard to find an honest coin dealer. And super hard to find a honest dealer who knows anything. Be careful out there.
Rusty
I like to look at both sides of a situation before pointing fingers.
are you mad that you overpaid or are you mad about them claiming zero knowledge of the coin?
I am not trying to be the bad guy so please do not take it as such.
Maybe the previous owner ran it through the FUN sale and had a reserve set high enough that he was not 100% sure it would sell -
Maybe the previous owner had it listed at 10 different dealers who all had pictures on the internet and you only knew about one of them -
Maybe they were similar but different coins -
Why is it you are annoyed? If you have the coin in your possession, someone wanting to buy it from dealer X (posting coin they do not have) will cause problems for dealer X rather than you.
I paid *much* less at auction than the dealers had it listed on their site.
I am annoyed that they claimed ZERO knowledge of the coin. When I mean "they", I mean I spoke to BOTH of the father/son team.
I am annoyed that they never got back to me.
I am annoyed that they left the coin on their site for so long -- a few months! And, for 2 months after it was sold!
They suck. If they were to read this thread, they should know I'm talking about them. (They are non-contributing members here, and only here to peddle their wares.)
EVP
How does one get a hater to stop hating?
I can be reached at evillageprowler@gmail.com
A bit harsh as no harm was done. While I agree with your reasons, you already stated the correct course of action......never to buy from them.
No need to air it on a public board unless your going to out the parties involved and allow them a defense to your claim. We have mistakenly sold coins at auction or shows before and just plain forgot to remove them from our web site. It’s embarrassing but not done in a mean or unethical manner.
BTW, glad to see your still around,
TBT
I am airing this because I feel the need to vent. I checked with a few other board members, and they all felt it was reasonable of me to post. So I did. I do not want to name any dealer publicly, but I want to serve notice to all that questionable conduct is unwise now that we're in the Internet age.
It is my hope that the offending dealer will catch wind of this thread and recognize that I am trying to maintain some degree of anonymity for them and that they will be more careful next time with regard to their conduct.
Additionally, TBT, I feel that what they did was purposeful and egregious. I don't think it was a simple mistake. This is not a case of their selling a coin and then forgetting to de-list it.
Finally, I do not question your ethics. As far as I am concerned, I would not be afraid to give you a chance if you have something of interest to me.
Regards,
EVP
How does one get a hater to stop hating?
I can be reached at evillageprowler@gmail.com
TBT
Would you lose a coin priced at close to $20K?
EVP
How does one get a hater to stop hating?
I can be reached at evillageprowler@gmail.com
Guess **it happens....
adrian
I read your opening post three times, and I am still not sure I understand how you were wronged. Is it that the dealer was essentially advertising a specific and unique coin for sale that you owned and was in your possession?
Respectfully,
Robert
Please check out my post timestamped 2:12 PM from today. (If the software adjusts for timezone changes, then it's 2:12 PM Eastern Time.)
The dealer advertised my coin. Not another coin of the same series, date and grade. The EXACT same coin. And, he had it listed for a long time and claimed no knowledge of it when questioned and never acknowledged my email message.
As for how I was wronged... Technically, I wasn't wronged in any material way. This post is to serve notice to those dealers with lousy attitudes and business ethics that the Internet-driven world is way too small to allow them to remain the way they are without risk of negative publicity.
EVP
How does one get a hater to stop hating?
I can be reached at evillageprowler@gmail.com
I am on your side, but knowing these two dealers, I am ttrying to understand why they might have lied to you. Mayby you should call them and explain how you know that it is the same coin, and that will jog their memory. Of course the decision to do, or not do, business with them is entirely up to you, but since even as you said they did no material harm to you, it would be a shame, as they handle so many high end coins: And you know how hard it is to find coins these days.
EVP- I understand your frustration and need to vent.
It would have been so easy for them to recognize their error, corrected it quickly and thanked you for the notification.
On another, related note:
Don't hold back! Show us the coin- it sounds like a winner.
peacockcoins
I'm still a little confused about your gripe. What is your basis for stating: "I feel that what they did was purposeful and egregious. I don't think it was a simple mistake. This is not a case of their selling a coin and then forgetting to de-list it."
It seems to me that it most likely was an honest mistake by the dealer. What incentive would they have had to lie to you about knowing about the coin? And, what incentive would they have had to continue listing a coin that had already sold and that you had already recieved? Are you implying that you did not get the coin after the auction and the dealers were still trying to sell it at a higher price?
It seems more likely to me that the dealers were simply forgetful and slow. Although they were somewhat rude in not responding to you directly, it appears they did address your concern and remove the coin from their website.
JGrech,
I understand your skepticism. It's ok, as I'm not really looking to name any specific dealer nor slam them publicly. The facts of the case isn't really germane. The point is that in the Internet era, it would be horribly imprudent for dealers to think they can conduct themselves in questionable terms and not get revealed.
Regards,
EVP
How does one get a hater to stop hating?
I can be reached at evillageprowler@gmail.com
On a related note......
One of the really cool things about eBay is that when someone buys something off of your site, it goes away.
I have purhcased things from some dealers that they have had on their web sites and it stays up on their site for days, sometimes weeks. Of course, i don't generally list anything that is also listed somewhere else. It makes them look bad when i offer it for less than they were offering it and when their picture is better than mine. (Ga head...)
Some web sites are maintained by guys who are just web site maintainers...not maintained by the owners. When these web site tenders don't tend to their business, potentially bad things happen.
snake
<< <i>Show me one private site that has that kind of traffic. >>
www.pcgs.com
Cameron Kiefer
EP - What price did coin sell for at auction vs their website? Or for that matter Did you get the auction coin for less?
This thread is more than 19 years old so you may not get a response to your question.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
It sold 13 times since...
Strip club must not be open today.
"Got a flaming heart, can't get my fill"
The OP's sigfile seems... ironic.
It seems like we are at one of those points on the calendar lately where people dig up threads 18-20 yrs old and just dive right into it like nothing. Tbh tho I am happy to read some of Anacondas thoughts. His bluntness, concise nature, knowledge and activity is missing lately. I hope South America was/is treating him well.
Chance favors the prepared mind.
. . . never did get to see the coin.
peacockcoins
there is a story as to why this nondescript thread was resurrected.
i'd love to know.
When I read the opening post, I thought EVP got the coin as a 'deal' in auction, but never received it.
I didn't understand the gripe when I saw he did, indeed get it.
If I buy a coin that you owned, or once owned, a coin that I'm happy with, I'm afraid I honestly don't care if you want to talk about it or not.
Yes it looks like he got the coin he wanted at auction but cheaper than the situation he was making big deal about lol. So the whole thing does not make any sense to me. Go figure…
I think, nineteen years ago, the OP was displeased because he had purchased a coin but it was still listed for sale on the dealer's site. That's all.