3/8/03 - A milestone in Early Dollars
cardinal
Posts: 2,005 ✭✭✭✭✭
Today was a very good day for the Cardinal Collection of Early Dollars. No, not from a much-awaited grading submission. No MS69s or MS70s exist for early dollars, and I don't expect PCGS to grade one in the near future. Today I was fortunate enough to acquire the Eliasberg 1803 Small 3 dollar, graded by NGC as MS63.
From William Friesner to John Clapp in 1894, to Louis Eliasberg in 1942, to Philip Flannagan in 1997, to a prominent Midwestern collector in 2001, to the Cardinal Collection in 2003. My thanks go out to Laura Sperber for bringing the coin into the Flannagan collection, Gary Carlson for providing the specimen used for trading material, and to Chris Napolitano as agent for the Midwestern collector in putting the final deal together.
The Eliasberg 1803 provides a valuable upgrade to my already completed Redbook Set of Early Dollars (most of which reside in PCGS holders and appear in the PCGS Registry), but beyond that, it completes a subset of my collection -- the 14-coin basic date/major type circulation strike set -- in mint state. For many series of U.S. coins, a complete mint state date set may have been achieved many times over. However, for the series of early dollars, this is the first time in history that this set has been completed in certified mint state grades.
Here's how tough this short 14-coin set is:
The Garrett, Norweb, and Carter collections all lacked MULTIPLE dates in mint state.
The Eliasberg collection, the most COMPLETE collection of U.S. coins ever assembled, contained an array of outstanding early dollars, but lacked the 1794, 1796, and 1802/1 in mint state.
The collection of Phillip Flannagan specialized in early dollars and contained several choice examples from the Eliasberg sale, but it too lacked the 1802/1 in mint state.
Two other incredible sets of early dollars (one with a certain 1804 in PR-68, and the other with a certain 1797 in MS-65) are currently being assembled, and both include mint state specimens of the rare 1802/1 date (total population of 3 mint state coins PCGS & NGC combined, excluding known regrades and crossovers). However, both of these sets currently lack the 1798 small eagle dollar in mint state.
Including today's acquisition of the Eliasberg 1803 dollar, the Cardinal Collection date set now consists of the following:
1794 Flowing Hair dollar, NGC-MS64 -- fifth finest known 1794 dollar
1795 Flowing Hair dollar, PCGS-MS64 -- tied second finest PCGS 1795 flowing hair dollar
1795 Draped Bust dollar, PCGS-MS65 -- tied finest PCGS 1795 draped bust dollar
1796 Draped Bust dollar, PCGS-MS62 -- single finest PCGS 1796 dollar
1797 Draped Bust dollar, PCGS-MS62 -- tied second finest PCGS 1797 dollar
1798 Draped Bust Small Eagle dollar, PCGS-MS62 -- single finest PCGS 1798 small eagle dollar
1798 Draped Bust Large Eagle dollar, PCGS-MS63 -- tied third finest 1798 large eagle dollar
1799/8 Draped Bust dollar, PCGS-MS63 -- tied second finest 1799/8 dollar
1799 Draped Bust dollar, PCGS-MS64 -- tied third finest 1799 dollar
1800 Draped Bust dollar, PCGS-MS64 -- tied finest PCGS 1800 dollar
1801 Draped Bust dollar, PCGS-MS64 -- single finest PCGS 1801 dollar
1802/1 Draped Bust dollar, PCGS-MS62 -- tied second finest 1802/1 dollar
1802 Draped Bust dollar, NGC-MS65 -- tied finest 1802 dollar
1803 Draped Bust dollar, NGC-MS63 -- tied second finest 1803 dollar
BJ is working on a Registry Set display of early dollars, and has tentatively scheduled to display my set at the June, 2003, Long Beach show. I invite everyone to stop by and see these, and the rest of my set of early dollars, in person. BJ will also have a supply of my booklet "Early Dollars: A Pocket Guide to Major Varieties" that you can pick up at the show for free. I've attached images as a prelude to the show, but nothing can match viewing the real coins live with your own eyes.
-- Cardinal
Early Dollar Website
From William Friesner to John Clapp in 1894, to Louis Eliasberg in 1942, to Philip Flannagan in 1997, to a prominent Midwestern collector in 2001, to the Cardinal Collection in 2003. My thanks go out to Laura Sperber for bringing the coin into the Flannagan collection, Gary Carlson for providing the specimen used for trading material, and to Chris Napolitano as agent for the Midwestern collector in putting the final deal together.
The Eliasberg 1803 provides a valuable upgrade to my already completed Redbook Set of Early Dollars (most of which reside in PCGS holders and appear in the PCGS Registry), but beyond that, it completes a subset of my collection -- the 14-coin basic date/major type circulation strike set -- in mint state. For many series of U.S. coins, a complete mint state date set may have been achieved many times over. However, for the series of early dollars, this is the first time in history that this set has been completed in certified mint state grades.
Here's how tough this short 14-coin set is:
The Garrett, Norweb, and Carter collections all lacked MULTIPLE dates in mint state.
The Eliasberg collection, the most COMPLETE collection of U.S. coins ever assembled, contained an array of outstanding early dollars, but lacked the 1794, 1796, and 1802/1 in mint state.
The collection of Phillip Flannagan specialized in early dollars and contained several choice examples from the Eliasberg sale, but it too lacked the 1802/1 in mint state.
Two other incredible sets of early dollars (one with a certain 1804 in PR-68, and the other with a certain 1797 in MS-65) are currently being assembled, and both include mint state specimens of the rare 1802/1 date (total population of 3 mint state coins PCGS & NGC combined, excluding known regrades and crossovers). However, both of these sets currently lack the 1798 small eagle dollar in mint state.
Including today's acquisition of the Eliasberg 1803 dollar, the Cardinal Collection date set now consists of the following:
1794 Flowing Hair dollar, NGC-MS64 -- fifth finest known 1794 dollar
1795 Flowing Hair dollar, PCGS-MS64 -- tied second finest PCGS 1795 flowing hair dollar
1795 Draped Bust dollar, PCGS-MS65 -- tied finest PCGS 1795 draped bust dollar
1796 Draped Bust dollar, PCGS-MS62 -- single finest PCGS 1796 dollar
1797 Draped Bust dollar, PCGS-MS62 -- tied second finest PCGS 1797 dollar
1798 Draped Bust Small Eagle dollar, PCGS-MS62 -- single finest PCGS 1798 small eagle dollar
1798 Draped Bust Large Eagle dollar, PCGS-MS63 -- tied third finest 1798 large eagle dollar
1799/8 Draped Bust dollar, PCGS-MS63 -- tied second finest 1799/8 dollar
1799 Draped Bust dollar, PCGS-MS64 -- tied third finest 1799 dollar
1800 Draped Bust dollar, PCGS-MS64 -- tied finest PCGS 1800 dollar
1801 Draped Bust dollar, PCGS-MS64 -- single finest PCGS 1801 dollar
1802/1 Draped Bust dollar, PCGS-MS62 -- tied second finest 1802/1 dollar
1802 Draped Bust dollar, NGC-MS65 -- tied finest 1802 dollar
1803 Draped Bust dollar, NGC-MS63 -- tied second finest 1803 dollar
BJ is working on a Registry Set display of early dollars, and has tentatively scheduled to display my set at the June, 2003, Long Beach show. I invite everyone to stop by and see these, and the rest of my set of early dollars, in person. BJ will also have a supply of my booklet "Early Dollars: A Pocket Guide to Major Varieties" that you can pick up at the show for free. I've attached images as a prelude to the show, but nothing can match viewing the real coins live with your own eyes.
-- Cardinal
Early Dollar Website
0
Comments
Very very impressive.
If I owned that, I'd go around telling everybody that I had the Clapp.
That's my dream set.
Absolutely astounding!
Please enter me in your most generous giveaway.
09/07/2006
LSCC#1864
Ebay Stuff
Even with the substantial wealth needed to complete your set, it must have taken a great amount of time. How long has it taken you so far?
Tom
Two questions:
1. Are you planning to add the 1804, if one becomes available?
2. What are your plans, going forward, to add/upgrade the set?
This is an extraordinary achievement that I appreciate you sharing with us.
I realize no matter what anyone's budget is, this feat is almost impossible to attain.
Thanks also for your selfless dedication to advancing the learning and appreciation of Early Dollars.
Mike
A great achievement and accomplishment to be remembered.
I could more fully appreciate your accomplishment if I knew SOMETHING about you, other than this impressive collection. Ya' got a little bio you could PM?
Envy is really a terrible flaw to have, and BOY do I have it!
of the collection are indeed mind boggling. The coins are absolutely magnificent and it has been
an honor to have reviewed pictures of them. Thank you.
Camelot
I assure you that the display will be my first and last stop at Long Beach. Congratulations on a most impressive accomplishment and a truly spectacular collection.
What next, Ikes?
z
EVP
How does one get a hater to stop hating?
I can be reached at evillageprowler@gmail.com
Building the set has been a long work in progess. I initially set out to put together the early dollar set nine years ago. Back then, my new business (I'm a self-employed bean counter, or as someone once put it, "really sophisticated at adding 2 plus 2.") grown enough to have something left over after paying business expenses, rent and food. There was actually some money for some "extras," and the coin bank a friend bought for his newborn daughter reminded me of my childhood hobby. (His wife commented that the bank wouldn't go very far is saving for his daughter's college education unless he started putting in silver dollars instead of pennies and nickels.)
There was something historic about early silver dollars that had interested me as a kid that I remembered. These were the coins designed by those same figures in history that had fought for our country's independence and designed our government. As a kid, I saw such coins as wildly more expensive than I could possibly ever afford -- but, oh, if I ever hit the lottery or made some money someday...well, maybe then. As of nine years ago, early dollars were rather overlooked by collectors. Nice XF's Draped Bust/Large Eagle dollars were available for around $700 to $1000 each, and AU's started around $2000. (I remember turning down an offer back then of a PCGS-graded XF40 R-6 dollar for $1000, thinking it was way more than it was worth.) On that basis, I figured I could eventually put together a Redbook set of early dollars, with the Draped Bust/Large Eagle dollars in XF-45 to AU-50, the Small Eagle dollars in XF40, the Flowing Hair Dollars in VF, and skipping the 1794 dollar.
Well one thing led to another. After accumulating a number of nice XF's, I got a couple AU's and those seemed really nice. So, I figured on putting together a set with Large Eagle dollars in AU and the rest in XF. Then I came upon a nice AU 1797 dollar. It really did match my AU Large Eagle dollars better than my XF 1797 dollar, so I figured I should go for those in AU also. As I was selling or trading in my lower grade coins for the higher grade pieces, I found I was typically able to get more in trade than I had paid for the coins originally. By horsetrading and adding a little more money along the way (business continued to improve as time moved on), I was able to slowly upgrade the set.
Eventually, I found my way into mint state specimens, and then I realized what I then REALLY wanted was to complete the set with as high a grade as I could -- focusing on AU55's and above. Jules Reiver commented in an article in Coin World long ago that a collector should focus on getting the toughest coins first. With that in mind, and a good deal of luck with coins becoming available at auction, I was able to get some of the really tough ones early on, when prices were much lower than they are now. For instance, one of my earliest "high end" coins was the 1799 Irregular Date/13 Stars reverse variety B-13, BB-151. Telephone bidding with Superior back in 1996, I was able to obtain the finest known (now graded PCGS-AU58) specimen of this tough R5+ variety for $4,000. At the recent Long Beach show, I viewed a lesser NGC-AU53 specimen which was offered at around $14,000. Times have certainly changed!
My advice to EVERYONE out there is to collect what you like. That is precisely what I have been doing. Don't overlook the early classic coins just because you think they are unobtainable, and don't let someone else's coins interfere with your enjoyment of the collection that you can reasonably afford to put together. A lot of fun can be gained from putting together an nice VG-VF set of classic coins. I know that while I was focusing on VF and XF coins and not yet able to afford AU's and MS pieces, I enjoyed my collection every bit as much as I do now. Money is relative. This is our hobby -- it's important that it be an enjoyable pursuit!
Regardless of the series you collect, always go for the toughest coins first. Because they are tougher, you will have fewer opportunities to get them if you pass them up the first few times. The most common coins will always be relatively more available when you are ready for them.
As for my set, the date set and Redbook set are complete, but I am still actively pursuing upgrades. I view my set as a "circulation strike" set, which necessarily excludes the proof coins dated 1801 through 1804 (which were actually minted in 1834 and later years). So, I'm not seeking an 1804 dollar at this time; but I certainly wouldn't be so discourteous as to reject a gift of one! (After all, the first owners of the 1804 dollars were foreign dignitaries who received them as GIFTS from the U.S. government.)
Happy Collecting!
--Cardinal
BTW - love your 1794! Laura curses every time I mention that coin - I think she really regrets not buying it! It's a beautiful coin.
Thank you for your kind comments.
I'm not sure my post would fit under 2000 characters. I guess I don't post that often (not too much discussion about early dollars goes on here), but I seem to be longwinded when I do. I guess in school I was much better in writing novels than short stories.
The 1794 is certainly the star of my set. Who would have guessed a bean counter could trade his way into one? Maybe that's part of why Laura calls me a "coin weenie?" (I always take it a term of endearment!)
I must say, even though my whole collecting focus is early dollars, I was totally blown away to see your AMAZING set on display at Long Beach!!! A proof set highlighted by the finest known 1885, one of only five made, and a circulation strike set with no remaining possibilities for upgrade unless new coins are "made" by the services!! All I can say is WOW!
I must be buying your,sell for up grade,coins because i have a similar set in F to XF,and thats up from g and vg.Been at it for fifteen years. I don't plan on going to the Long Beach show,but would like to get a copy of your pocket guide,if you can get one to me' i'll be happy to pay for it.
We'll use our hands and hearts and if we must we'll use our heads.
Obscurum per obscurius
Lastly, thank you for sharing your collection and thoughts.
and it sets us apart from practitioners and consultants. Gregor
The chase is definitely thrilling, but the ultimate success is very satisfying. Nonetheless, I will be continuing to chase for those fugitive upgrades.
In the meantime, here are the 1795 Flowing Hair dollars that have already been captured -- showing the various combinations of Obverse portrait styles, Reverse wreath styles, and presence of silver plugs.
-- Cardinal
they're all beautiful! you have a fine eye for quality. congratulations!
it is the thrill of the chase, isn't it?
This is a collection of “real coins” that are worth “real money.” Putting together a collection like this takes more than a big bank balance. One has to be patient and know when to “pull the trigger” and have a good eye for great early material.
congratulations!
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
Is a collection of ED's by die variety next?
For a time, while I was focusing on the XF-AU grades, I considered assembling a full (or almost full) die variety set. Toward that end, I acquired 4 Rarity-8 (1-3 known specimens) varieties, and multiple R-7s and R-6s. For the most part, these high rarity varieties are not available in higher grades (or are REALLY pricey), so when I shifted my focus to high-AUs and Mint State pieces, I gave up my die variety set aspirations. The rarest specimens from my earlier set have been dispersed and now reside in other collections, including the Jules Reiver and Warren Miller collections. The R-8 varieties I sold to Warren Miller put him past Jules Reiver for the single most complete die variety set of early dollars. Warren's set is really an amazing accomplishment for a die variety collection.
My collecting goals are now focused on top grade pieces within what I call and "expanded" Redbook set. The Redbook set of early dollars (as recognized by PCGS) consists of 38 distinct types, but also excludes a number of very distinctive varieties. For example, Draped Bust Large Eagle dollars of 1798 feature stars on the reverse that are either arranged in straight lines or nicely curved arcs. I see those differences as very distinctive, easily recognizable with the naked eye, but they are not currently included in the Redbook. It is these other very distinctive varieties that I seek to include in my set in addition to the traditional Redbook varieties.
By my count, there are 62 readily distinguishable varieties of early dollars, and that is what my ultimate set would include (in the highest grade I can afford). This already accounts for more than half of the known different die varieties of early dollars. The remaining die varieties that I would not be going after are so very similar to the others that you truly cannot tell them apart without a book and magnifying glass, so I feel okay in leaving them out of my set.
-- Cardinal
Early Dollars Website
1. For that set that most of us can't dream of ever matching.
2. For a post, leading to a lengthy thread, about coins, not flames!
Happy Collecting!
Cardinal
Early Dollars Website
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Well said!!
And what a fantastic set! Have you ever assembled a historical accounting of each coin? Ie; this date in history?
When are you going to get some nice coins for your early dollar collection?? (HAHAHA) I e mailed your earlydollar website to order 1794 book.. did you get anything from "lloydmincy@aol.com"? Gave you my visa number and everything. Is it a go? Need anything else?