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Buyer Beware on These 'Certified' Slabs?

dragondragon Posts: 4,548 ✭✭
in U.S. Coin Forum
Remember I mentioned a while back to be very cautious in buying coins in these holders? Take a look at Ebay Item # 3011926145 and see if you find anything wrong or unusual with this piece.

dragon
«1

Comments

  • DanCDanC Posts: 1,189
    Linky
    Coins currently for sale
  • K6AZK6AZ Posts: 9,295 ✭
    Looks like a crudely added mintmark to me. Yuck! image
  • stmanstman Posts: 11,352 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Nothing I can put my thumb on.
    Please... Save The Stories, Just Answer My Questions, And Tell Me How Much!!!!!
  • DanCDanC Posts: 1,189
    What's with the "Perfect CC" thing?
    Coins currently for sale
  • LucyBopLucyBop Posts: 14,001 ✭✭✭
    The only problem I see is the coin itself isn't a Franklin!
    imageBe Bop A Lula!!
    "Senorita HepKitty"
    "I want a real cool Kitty from Hepcat City, to stay in step with me" - Bill Carter
  • stmanstman Posts: 11,352 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Mintmark doesn't seem to be in the right place. Seems moved or added to the left.
    Please... Save The Stories, Just Answer My Questions, And Tell Me How Much!!!!!
  • LucyBopLucyBop Posts: 14,001 ✭✭✭
    I can't see the Full Bell Lines!
    imageBe Bop A Lula!!
    "Senorita HepKitty"
    "I want a real cool Kitty from Hepcat City, to stay in step with me" - Bill Carter
  • K6AZK6AZ Posts: 9,295 ✭
    It is totally bogus. The mintmark is added. As stman said, look how far left it is, not to mention the fact that the shape of the CC is not right.
  • dragondragon Posts: 4,548 ✭✭
    Actually guys, the mintmark looks ok.
  • stmanstman Posts: 11,352 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Well, I don't see evidence of any frosting added, so I'll stick with nothing I can put my thumb on. Something does look weird in the face.
    Please... Save The Stories, Just Answer My Questions, And Tell Me How Much!!!!!
  • K6AZK6AZ Posts: 9,295 ✭
    It's not OK, it does not conform to any known mintmarks of that date.
  • braddickbraddick Posts: 24,206 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Come on guys- work it. It's right before your eyes.
    (And, no. It is not the slight die rotation.)

    peacockcoins

  • relayerrelayer Posts: 10,570 ✭

    It's a Clear CC variety.
    image
    image
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  • abmluceabmluce Posts: 592
    why is it noted perfect CC on the holder? Is there such a thing as a non-perfect CC?
    give me liberty or give me death
    my hotelsimage
  • FC57CoinsFC57Coins Posts: 9,140 ✭
    Well - my guess is that it might have something to do with the broken up UNUM on the obverse legend - this is not a known variety listed for 1879 CC- and come to think of it, I don't recall seeing any variety that has that unusual quality to it. So, two thoughts come to mind - it might've been whizzed off, though the surfaces don't seem support that, or it could be a counterfit, in which case it would have to be a very good piece of work. Something else I noticed, but this could be just the picture, is that the main devices are frosted, but the surrounding letters, stars, etc don't appear to show this. This would make me think that maybe the frosting was added. I guess the obvious one would be too - what the hell is an MS63PL 1879CC doing in an NTC holder when CU lists the coin at $3900! Many red flags - but I would be very interested to see what dragon saw in this.

    Frank
  • pandamanpandaman Posts: 161
    Date looks off. The date seems too close Liberty's neck line...maybe just a bad scan. Date seems sharper than rest of obverse. CC looks off too. Was this an 1889. Everytime I look at date, it just looks wrong. Now the "7" seems too big...are there lines around the date?? I can't look at it any more. Will you tell what you see wrong in the coin?image
    98PANDA.98panda
  • itsnotjustmeitsnotjustme Posts: 8,779 ✭✭✭
    And the frost level on the 7 is different than the other 3 numbers.
    Give Blood (Red Bags) & Platelets (Yellow Bags)!
  • bulloncoinsbulloncoins Posts: 314
    That "N" in Unum on the obverse?

    Also seems week in UNITED on Reverse.
    Travis

    --------
    Howdy from Houston...

    Can't keep my eyes
    from the circling skies
    Tongue tied and twisted
    Just an earthbound misfit,
    I


    ">my registry set


    image
  • GilbertGilbert Posts: 1,533 ✭✭✭
    Besides being slabbed by the company that slabbed it, I haven't noticed anything too obvious, except the "D" in UNITED almost looks like and "O". I frequently am unable to see some of the intricate details noted by others in some scans though.

    Let us out of suspense?

    edited to add: the mintmark DOES look suspicious - it almost seems to contact the "D" in DOLLAR and also looks a bit far left with a bit much tilt. I guess it could be the image, but it sure peeks my curiosity. Oh, and it looks better than 63; at least the image does, but undergrading by Numistrust is unheard of. image
    Gilbert
  • gemtone65gemtone65 Posts: 901 ✭✭✭
    Tampered slab?
  • FC57CoinsFC57Coins Posts: 9,140 ✭
    Someone go wake up Dragon so he can tell us what's up with this dollar!
  • jeffnpcbjeffnpcb Posts: 1,943 ✭
    image If you blow up the pictures, there are so many things wrong with this thing the list is endless. It appears thatshe has initials above her eye and the reverse has a weird rectangular depression in the Eagle's chest.
    That doesn't include all the letter errors. If you blow up the N's, it appears to be a shape of a D in the middle. I'm still lost on the major point refered in the beginning.
    I would love to have the coin in my hand for further observation, and it's only an 8 hour drive from my house!
    NAH, who am I kidding, that's another thing I'll never do!!image

    imageimageimageimageimage I wish they would install spell check!
    HEAD TUCKED AND ROLLING ALONG ENJOYING THE VIEW! [Most people I know!]

    NEVER LET HIPPO MOUTH OVERLOAD HUMMINGBIRD BUTT!!!

    WORK HARDER!!!!
    Millions on WELFARE depend on you!
  • prooflikeprooflike Posts: 3,879 ✭✭
    It's an ex-COPY coin that had the surfaces altered to remove the COPY.
    image
  • Dog97Dog97 Posts: 7,874 ✭✭✭
    It's not a VAM1 because the mm is too big.
    It's not a VAM2 because mm isn't tilted.
    It's not a VAM3 because it's not an om.
    It's not a VAM4 bucause it's not a closed 9.
    So there, I just proved it's not really an 1879 CC.
    Change that we can believe in is that change which is 90% silver.
  • itsnotjustmeitsnotjustme Posts: 8,779 ✭✭✭
    She has a spider crawling on her forehead.
    Give Blood (Red Bags) & Platelets (Yellow Bags)!
  • RussRuss Posts: 48,514 ✭✭✭
    Have any of the Morgan guys contacted the seller of this coin to fill him in on whatever is wrong with it?

    Russ, NCNE
    eBay consignment sales | | Collectibles from Resco CCC
  • SpinynormanSpinynorman Posts: 603 ✭✭
    I probably missed something more obvious, but both wheat leaves are too long, even for the III(2) obverse.

    image
    image
    imageimageimage
  • jeffnpcbjeffnpcb Posts: 1,943 ✭
    image Does anyone have a picture of a Capped Die Variety?
    HEAD TUCKED AND ROLLING ALONG ENJOYING THE VIEW! [Most people I know!]

    NEVER LET HIPPO MOUTH OVERLOAD HUMMINGBIRD BUTT!!!

    WORK HARDER!!!!
    Millions on WELFARE depend on you!
  • MadMartyMadMarty Posts: 16,697 ✭✭✭
    It just does not look right, the 7 does not look right, and I swear I can see where copy was removed from the wing on the reverse. A tooled 1889-CC copy???
    It is not exactly cheating, I prefer to consider it creative problem solving!!!

  • Dog97Dog97 Posts: 7,874 ✭✭✭
    Russ-
    I can't attribute the coin with 100% certianity from the scan so I'll limit myself to discussing it here rather than harrassing the seller. I trust Dragon's opinion but he may be seeing something completely different than I do. The picture shows the first C to be different than the second C but it may well be the picture quality.
    Change that we can believe in is that change which is 90% silver.
  • critocrito Posts: 1,735 ✭
    I just emailed Gary Streich, President of NTC Corp, with a link to this thread and invited him to comment on these accusations. cya.
  • sinin1sinin1 Posts: 7,500 ✭
    ??? It's not even real - a die-struck copy ???
  • kyleknapkyleknap Posts: 980
    Artificial frosting on the portrait?

    If not, I'm clueless.

    Kyle
  • jbstevenjbsteven Posts: 6,178 ✭
    the date is too large. fake
  • Dog97Dog97 Posts: 7,874 ✭✭✭
    The seller's name is Fred?
    What? What?
    Change that we can believe in is that change which is 90% silver.
  • lavalava Posts: 3,286 ✭✭✭
    ttt
    I brake for ear bars.
  • jeffnpcbjeffnpcb Posts: 1,943 ✭
    imageIs this one of the reasons Halperin was charged by the FTC and this is actually a collector item! Or, is it an example of the tom-foolery that existed at Carson City Mint that I've read about?image
    HEAD TUCKED AND ROLLING ALONG ENJOYING THE VIEW! [Most people I know!]

    NEVER LET HIPPO MOUTH OVERLOAD HUMMINGBIRD BUTT!!!

    WORK HARDER!!!!
    Millions on WELFARE depend on you!
  • jbstevenjbsteven Posts: 6,178 ✭
    ttt
  • kyleknapkyleknap Posts: 980
    I wanna know!

    ttt

    Kyle
  • lavalava Posts: 3,286 ✭✭✭
    ttt
    I brake for ear bars.
  • critocrito Posts: 1,735 ✭
    Though I didn't ask for or receive permission to repost any private correspondence, he recalled the coin and assured me it is authentic. Not being an authority on, or particularly fond of, the series myself, I can't comment further. I do know NTC guarantees authenticity in all their advertising, however. Maybe some legal expert here should buy the coin and take them up on it image or, in plain English: put yer money where yer mouth is image Where's the "posse of the rich and famous" (pronounced like Robin Leech) when you need them image

  • K6AZK6AZ Posts: 9,295 ✭
    That is not an authentic 79-CC. He can claim to guarantee whatever he pleases, but that is not one of the four VAMs known to exist.
  • Dog97Dog97 Posts: 7,874 ✭✭✭
    Easy there K6AZ. image
    The scan might not look authentic but who knows what the coin really looks like?
    I have the utmost confidence in Mr. NTC's assessment of this coin. image On a positive note, they clearly have faster customer service than PCGS does.
    Change that we can believe in is that change which is 90% silver.
  • K6AZK6AZ Posts: 9,295 ✭
    Yeah Dog, and people start $3000+ coins at $9.95 with no reserve. When pigs fly! image
  • stmanstman Posts: 11,352 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Hey Dog, I think we might need to add kgaz to the grumpy collectors club. You think maybe? Naw because I've seen him be nice too many times.image
    Please... Save The Stories, Just Answer My Questions, And Tell Me How Much!!!!!
  • critocrito Posts: 1,735 ✭
    Never said it was or it wasn't. Just said they have a clearly stated guarantee and the "posse" said they were going after "altered" coins first, not AT... so here you go, served up on a platter... any time now.
  • FC57CoinsFC57Coins Posts: 9,140 ✭
    I'd still like to know what Braddick and Dragon saw on this coin!
  • critocrito Posts: 1,735 ✭
    He said he's going to Baltimore, probably the same show half the "posse" will be at image also recommends you bring your lawyers along... hope they like coins image

    Funny thing about "personal responsibility": those who demand it the most seldom take any themselves image

  • mercury1mercury1 Posts: 82
    I have only seen a few (maybe 3 or 4 )NTC graded coins in person and up close and I must say they are very close on the mark when it comes to grading( IMO ) not that I am any expert myself.
  • FC57CoinsFC57Coins Posts: 9,140 ✭


    << <i>I have only seen a few (maybe 3 or 4 )NTC graded coins in person and up close and I must say they are very close on the mark when it comes to grading( IMO ) not that I am any expert myself. >>



    I have seen quite a number of them and they range from accurate to upto 2 grades lower (Franklins). This doesn't make me feel warm and fuzzy.

    Frank

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