Why do people collect coins? Questions about collectors vs. dealers and what does market mean.
Joshiah
Posts: 15
First - Do people on this forum collect coins to make money or because they like coins?
Second - Aren't coins like every other thing that people buy or sell in that if a really good salesperson puts the right slant on it for the right customer it gets sold because of it's percieved value not nessacarily it acctual value.
Which brings me to the question are registry sets just a tool to get people to buy certin coins thus increasing demand and driving up prices or are they just a friendly little way to keep track of your coin collection on line, and if they are friendly why do they all have to be graded by one specific grading company? Aren't all grading companies supposed to use the same standards to grade coins?
Third - Can one grading company even the top grading company drasticly change the market by it's actions and if it can what type of checks and balances are in place to keep that from happening. Are the top two or three companies in league to change some things or do they keep each other honest as it were?
Fourth - I work at a gas station and I know that the people who mine the raw petroleum determine the price that they sell it to the refineries and the refineries determine the price at which to sell it to the people who distribute it to the people with the cars and all this is based on how much people are willing to pay for what they're used to or are they willing to develop something to replace gas, so my question is this, Are we the collectors the ones who determine if we are going to pay for the coins we collect or do we take our passion for collecting to some thing else like pizza boxes or credit card applications(rediculessley exagerated to prove a point)? I mean the mints make the same thing determined on something other than what the collectors want right. They make money determined on what the public needs for money to function right?
Fifth - I collect coins because I want some thing to do to help me relax and to take up some of my time so I don't get into trouble as I have a tendacy to do, and I thought this was a place of learning not a place to insult people or try to make them look stupid, so why flame wars and battleing threads when what I was looking for was a relaxing place to learn about coins from real people and not books by people I don't really know, a place where I could ask questions and get answers instead of my own interpratation which is addmittedly some what flawed.
Disclaimer-Spelling and grammar are prone to be a little flawed as I am a little flawed but if you can understand what I am saying please respond with or without good grammar.
Second - Aren't coins like every other thing that people buy or sell in that if a really good salesperson puts the right slant on it for the right customer it gets sold because of it's percieved value not nessacarily it acctual value.
Which brings me to the question are registry sets just a tool to get people to buy certin coins thus increasing demand and driving up prices or are they just a friendly little way to keep track of your coin collection on line, and if they are friendly why do they all have to be graded by one specific grading company? Aren't all grading companies supposed to use the same standards to grade coins?
Third - Can one grading company even the top grading company drasticly change the market by it's actions and if it can what type of checks and balances are in place to keep that from happening. Are the top two or three companies in league to change some things or do they keep each other honest as it were?
Fourth - I work at a gas station and I know that the people who mine the raw petroleum determine the price that they sell it to the refineries and the refineries determine the price at which to sell it to the people who distribute it to the people with the cars and all this is based on how much people are willing to pay for what they're used to or are they willing to develop something to replace gas, so my question is this, Are we the collectors the ones who determine if we are going to pay for the coins we collect or do we take our passion for collecting to some thing else like pizza boxes or credit card applications(rediculessley exagerated to prove a point)? I mean the mints make the same thing determined on something other than what the collectors want right. They make money determined on what the public needs for money to function right?
Fifth - I collect coins because I want some thing to do to help me relax and to take up some of my time so I don't get into trouble as I have a tendacy to do, and I thought this was a place of learning not a place to insult people or try to make them look stupid, so why flame wars and battleing threads when what I was looking for was a relaxing place to learn about coins from real people and not books by people I don't really know, a place where I could ask questions and get answers instead of my own interpratation which is addmittedly some what flawed.
Disclaimer-Spelling and grammar are prone to be a little flawed as I am a little flawed but if you can understand what I am saying please respond with or without good grammar.
Bear with me I'm new to the hobby and trying to learn something here.
Thanks dad (MacCoin) for getting me into this.
Thanks dad (MacCoin) for getting me into this.
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Comments
"Senorita HepKitty"
"I want a real cool Kitty from Hepcat City, to stay in step with me" - Bill Carter
all the flaming is not helping me learn how to grade coins its just showing me that the supper high end grader(david hall) is talking down on all us that dont know how to grade coins!
but i tell you what i like the idea LucyBop and the wrestling match!!
Gary
Maybe some of you should be honest with yourselves
Just my opinion
Chris
no one has a gun to your head to have a registry set -
if your passion is collecting for the sake of collecting -> define it for me -> complete a set?
have a high end type set? a rare date set?
many people respond to posts here - some are true collectors - sell nothing ? hoarders ?
for these people, why do you care about slabs?
IT CALLED THE COIN BUSINESS!!
A handful of greedy overbearing dealers feel CU is their a] marketplace, b] marketing turf, and c] coin dumping ground. You challenge them and then they try to bully and intimidate. Afterall, who are you but a dumb collector, right? Maybe, but I am the one with the checkbook.
Not all of them are like that. Mark Feld [aka coinguy1] of Pinnacle Rarities is level headed and always has wonderful posts. Read some of his old posts and you will learn alot. Then go buy a coin or two from them to help them make some money. They are one of the good guys.
1) I collect because I LOVE coins, and have since I was 7 years old. I sell because, either A) I can make a nice profit or
2) Three part question: Yes, in that regard, coins are just like everything else, a slick salesman can take you for a ride. Yes, registry sets are a marketing tool for PCGS, but to the people that participate it's an ego stroker (not sure if that's due to an inferiority or superiority complex, maybe both). NO, all grading companies do not use the same standard, specifically in MS grades. In circulated grades, most stick to the ANA guidelines, however.
3) We are the checks and balances. Vote by spending your dollars wisely. The last thing I want are government regulations for coin trading, so don't give 'em any ideas.
4) This isn't OPEC and the grading services aren't colluding to fix prices. They compete with one another, just like it should be in a free market society. Price is determined by demand/supply imbalances.
5) Beats the heck outta me.
Look at some of the nicknames on the forums and you can see alot of collectors interest in them like; barberlover, trime, trade dollar nut, merc and of course the hepkitty and her frankies or oldcameo proofguy.
Enjoy and don't get upset when you see family arguments [will kiss and makeup in the end] lol
enjoy this hobby it's great!
Must be alot of miserable collectors out there!
My 2 cents
Chris
But the real question is... Are we having fun yet?
"There is a very fine line between "hobby" and "mental
illness."
Remember. ... First pillage, Then burn
<< <i>I collect because I like coins and the History around them. >>
My same sentiments exactly.
My website
I have a passion for coin collecting that started in the mid 1960's when my dad got me interested in coins when he gave me his unc. collwctions of lincoln pennies and jefferson nickles, as i got older that interest changed to collect morgan dollars and type date saints.
I left the hobby for a number of years in 1989 because when my wife and i got married in the spring of 89 we needed furniture and a place to live. I also felt coin prices for the coins i liked and owned had reached obsurd price levels so i sold all my coins between march and october of 89. I still went to coin shows on occasion after that, but i didn't buy another coin for 10 years.
My reentry in the hobby in 99 let me at much reduced price levels start pursuing the coins that i liked but had never owned due to price in 89. Nice quality mint state barber quarters and halves. As well as trying to buy other mint state coins by type for a type set.
My latest find in change was a 1941 wheatie in change at the store also in the last three years i have gotton 1 silver quarter in change at a store and on 2 different occasions got a war nickle in change from the same pop machine where i worked.
I agree the name calling stuff should stop. I will admit using the term "stupid money" because i have a great concern that some newer collectors who don't know value or how to grade are being taken advantage of pursuing common coins with color or anything with a 70 on the slab for 20 to as much as 100 times bid levels. I think this fad has the potetial to damage the hobby almost as badly as the ever changing grading standards of the 1970's to the early 1980's.
(or anything) for pleasure. The pleasure of finding a long sought coin. The pleasure of
finishing a set you weren't sure you could complete, the pleasure of having something
truly special whether others appreciate it or not.
In the course of collecting many will find opportunities to profit. This is good for the in-
dividual, his collection, and the coin market. So if collectors here occasionally get a little
off topic it should come as no surprise. If dealers here discuss the inticasies of dealing
this shouldn't surprise either. And if those interested in toning, grading, registries or any
other aspect of coins bring up points near to their hearts then everything is perfectly
normal.
Todd
800.954.0270
On the other hand, there is a group of folks within the coin collecting world who are trying to make a living and put food on the table and send their children to college. I respect that and am glad that they exist. But....I also take into account that they are coming from a different perspective than I am and often have a different motivation when I respectfully listen to their comments. I learn an awful lot from them on this forum and appreciate all of them....the ogres (sp?) and the angels.
1. I collect for the coins first, money second. However, I've learned to not ignore how much money coins cost or what the potential resale value of it is. It's been a long learning process (ongoing) for me. After I get back from the Charlotte show, I'm going to probably sell off 1/3 of my slabs to raise money for the coins I really want.
2. Yes, any good salesman can make an excellent case for why a particular coin is superior. Just like it is in other areas, the consumer needs to be educated. Too bad there isn't a Consumers Reports for coins.
And, yes, the registry does get people to buy certain coins. It fuels competition. I can see it in both a positive and negative light. And, unfortunately, all the grading companies do not use the same standards to grade. I think the industry will need to try to do that at some point, though.
3. Yes, a grading company can have a big impact on the market (Assuming they have enough slabs out there). The free market is the only check and balance for them. I wouldn't mind seeing the ANA doing more watchdog activity, though.
4. I think the market does decide the prices, but the market is made up of more than collectors.
5. It's easier for some people to be rude online than in person. At first I used to do battle with people who disagreed or were acting like a troll. Now when I see a thread go down that path, I just move on.
Neil
Joshiah,
if you're looking for a forum of collectors, and for collectors, you could do much better than this one. If you're looking for a forum of investors, and for investors, you could do much worse
This forum, and the attitudes many of the more prolific posters display has all but squelched my desire for US coins at the moment. If this is the present, or the future of US coins, then start sending me shillings. Arrogance and piety have no place in my hobby, but perhaps when I know everything like most of the folks here, I'll be better suited to participate in the business of coin collecting.
(didn't it used to be a hobby?)
"France said this week they need more evidence to convince them Saddam is a threat. Yeah, last time France asked for more evidence it came rollin thru Paris with a German Flag on it." -Dave Letterman
Just ignore the posts that do not interest you, there are lots of good people here who can be very helpful.
After collecting for over 40 years with a degree of intelligence, I have found that my collection has performed pretty well financially. That is a nice by-product. Is it a secure investment? It’s probably more secure than some things and less secure than others. Years ago Woolworth, Eastern Airlines, Pan Am and W.T. Grant all looked like great stocks at one time. Today they are all in the financial graveyard. As Douglas MacArthur said, “There are no guarantees in life, only opportunities."
As for my business, well right now it’s the best of all occupations. I get to earn money doing one of the things I most enjoy in life, and very few people ever get to say that.
Tom