<< <i>Read my last post........ and pay very special attention to the word CLUELESS >>
I'm sorry...but that was pretty funny.
<< <i>you are a forum troll. >>
<< <i>you are a troll. >>
OK, which is it...dammit?! lol
<< <i>You guys look at more Morgans than I do >>
I can assure you, that is NOT the case (for me). I usualy avoid Morgans for the most part. I was just thinking that what Dragon pointed out: sometimes there are "toning breaks" as he put it. It could be scratches however. As far as a benefit of the doubt is concerned: You're right...I wouldn't buy ANY coin on Ebay without a return policy. If not, I don't bid, period.
heeeeyyyyy, why you calling that thread INfamous???
<< <i>Dorkkarl, Sorry if I misquoted you verbatem, but I was pretty close. >>
loki, i'm sorry, but it was not close at all, in fact it was misleading. there are 2 types of toning - natural, & non-natural. my def'n is pretty danged specific. sorry to keep ratting on this 1, but it's the type of misquote that leads to arguments (see what you started?)
<< <i><< sadly, the bottom line theme that runs through this thread continues to be ignored. all coins with wild'n'crazy colors are artificially toned. it is a plain & simple FACT. what you are paying for when you buy 1 in a holder is the blessing of the plastic company. when you accept that FACT, you will find it much easier to find the right direction to take w/ coins of this ilk. >>
i absolutely stand behind that statement 100%. take the present example. would you buy it because it's natural toning? or would you like it because you LIKE it? no doubt because you LIKE it. & why do you like it? i bet it's because the coin is in plastic. & that's OK. to enjoy this hobby, you must be willing to buy what you like. but i think you'll get 10 times more enjoyment when you learn to be honest w/ yourself as to why you like certain things.
note that in no way am i trying to be disparaging. but like i said, i unequivocally stand behind my previous statements, for which your misquote was NOT close.
As has been stated it is hard to tell from a scan if the break in color is from scratches or a normal toning break. Quite a few O mints and late P mint Morgans show breaks in color.In my opinion the market value for the coin if pictured close to what the scan looks like would be in the ballpark of what the buyer paid. Breaks in tone are all in the eyes of the beholder,but it will normally depend on the date of the coin. If it is a tougher date tone wise it is usually ignored, if it is not too distracting in hand. The bottom line is it looks like a real nice coin color wise, and if the buyer is happy with the coin and price, that is really all that matters.
If It doesn't have great eye appeal, I don't want it.
Dorkkarl, Your actual quote and my close approximation do bear one important thing in common; they are both ridiculous. To say something so groundbreaking as "all wild and crazy colors are AT", state it as a FACT, and not substantiate that with any acceptable PROOF is just a belliose OPINION. This one statement renders scrutiny to every other comment you make, and makes your avatar a correct choice in reflecting yourself to others on this forum. Opinions related to toning run rampant in this forum, with proven facts being quite rare. Now is your chance to shine and substantiate this fact of yours with a dose of proof! I won't hold my breath so take your time.
<< <i>i bet it's because the coin is in plastic. & that's OK. to enjoy this hobby, you must be willing to buy what you like. but i think you'll get 10 times more enjoyment when you learn to be honest w/ yourself as to why you like certain things >>
I have to learn to be honest with myself as to why I like certain things? OK, I honestly like this coin. That's good enough for me, and I am being quite honest. Yes, the coin being currently encased in a PCGS holder was also a factor, because it does make the coin have more marketability, and when the time comes to sell, it will be much easier to get some or all of my money back. Honest! Whether you like it or not, coins certified by reputable grading companies such as PCGS are the way to go with expensive purchases, in my opinion. To buy otherwise opens up a greater risk factor and pits only you against the coin collecting world. You'd better know what you are doing if you go the unslabbed route with expensive coins, and I can honestly say I am not confident enough to be willing to take that chance just yet.
I will post an unbiased honest pic of the coin when I receive it, so anyone that cares will get another look.
For what it's worth, I agree totally with your buying strategy when it comes to coins: use discretionary income, buy what you like, and don't worry about what anyone else thinks. It's YOUR collection and you're putting it together for YOUR enjoyment.
Please do let us know when the coin arrives how you like it and how closely it approximates the scans. I've done business with Andrew and always found him very easy to work with. I doubt seriously you'll come away from the deal with a bad experience.
Talking about vibrantly toned coins, I wanted to note one in Mike Billy's ebay store. It's an 84-O in a PCGS MS63 holder. The item number is 3306393112. Perhaps someone can provide a linky.
This coin was sold by a forum member to Mike at the FUN show for considerably less than the one you've just bought from Andrew. Mike obviously likes it a lot with an asking price of $2400. While I'd be surprised if he gets anywhere near that amount for the coin, it just goes to show how much some of us like vibrantly toned coins.
<< <i>Your actual quote and my close approximation do bear one important thing in common; they are both ridiculous. To say something so groundbreaking as "all wild and crazy colors are AT", state it as a FACT, and not substantiate that with any acceptable PROOF is just a belliose OPINION. >>
no sir, it is a FACT. i challenge you to look throught mounds & mounds & mounds of coins that have always been in pocket change, which is the intended environment of, well, pocket-change, and find ONE, just ONE single a-t coin. it would be extremely simple for you to disprove my statement by finding that ONE example.
<< <i>This one statement renders scrutiny to every other comment you make, and makes your avatar a correct choice in reflecting yourself to others on this forum. >>
i do not deny it!
<< <i>Opinions related to toning run rampant in this forum, >>
no, what runs rampant are endless, pointless arguments over what is a-t & what is not. & why do they run rampant? because the participants in such arguments do not bother to present THEIR def'n of what constitutes a-t. where have you made YOURS? but i will agree w/ this, it sure as he11 takes guts to express a def'n & commit to it. where is YOUR commitment?
<< <i> with proven facts being quite rare. Now is your chance to shine and substantiate this fact of yours with a dose of proof! I won't hold my breath so take your time. >>
uh, the proof is pretty simple, though admittedly quantitative. it very simply amounts to this: i have NEVER, EVER, NOT EVEN ONCE IN THIRTY YEARS SEEN A COIN A-T'd AS A RESULT OF ITS INTENDED ENVIRONMENT. your absolutely correct that such does not consitute "proof", but gee, you know what? i do not know a single person who has ever done so either, and that includes YOU!
<< <i><< i bet it's because the coin is in plastic. & that's OK. to enjoy this hobby, you must be willing to buy what you like. but i think you'll get 10 times more enjoyment when you learn to be honest w/ yourself as to why you like certain things >>
I have to learn to be honest with myself as to why I like certain things? OK, I honestly like this coin. >>
so you are saying that had the coin not been slabed, you would have pay the exact same amount for it? the plastic has ABSOLUTELY NO INFLUENCE on you whatsoever? baloney.
<< <i>That's good enough for me, and I am being quite honest. Yes, the coin being currently encased in a PCGS holder was also a factor, >>
THAT is being honest
<< <i> because it does make the coin have more marketability >>
and so is THAT.
<< <i>and when the time comes to sell >>
and that too!
so what you just admitted is that it is not the COIN you like, it is the coin plus holder plus marketabilty of the holder plus salability of the older. the 2 statements are not equal:
"i like this coin" does not equal "i like this coin because of what the holder adds to it"
<< <i>Whether you like it or not, coins certified by reputable grading companies such as PCGS are the way to go with expensive purchases, in my opinion. >>
this is a change in subject, so i'll go along w/ it.
again, your opinion, but you don't define what your talking about . "expensive"? what constitutes "expensive" for you? OK, for me, expensive is > $100. so under $100 would be cheap, right? look around this forum, ebay, wherever, dude, how many coins, CHEAP coins do you see in pcgs plastic? don't you think it is rather ridiculous for a $100 coin to cost you $120 because the price of plastic has to be added in? how about a $30 coin costing $50? why do you suppose coins are so expensive these days? is it because certain cheap coins have suddenly became the object of all desires? or could it possibly be because of the FACT that in the past 10 years, $350MILLION has been spent on certifying coins? who do you think pays for that?
YOU DO. & I have to too, whether i want to or not.
<< <i>To buy otherwise opens up a greater risk factor and pits only you against the coin collecting world. >>
oh really? so the hundreds of books written by hundreds of authors to arm you with information are worthless then? poor pitiful collectors, they really need pcgs because, golly gee, it's just so hard to learn how to grade coins yourself. is this what you're saying? without the might cloak of protection offered by pcgs, we would all just be a bunch of bumbling, sniveling, clueless idiots shivering with fear because of all the scary dark corners in coin dealers shops? c'mon, dude. YOU are smarter than that!
<< <i>You'd better know what you are doing if you go the unslabbed route with expensive coins, and I can honestly say I am not confident enough to be willing to take that chance just yet. >>
& this is the ultimate crux of the matter, you have just stated it in an a roundabout way. i ask you to consider if it isn't just possible, just remotely within the realm of possiblity that all the money you've spent on the "value-added" of slabs, ie the $20 per slabed coin that you MUST pay, one way or another, is it just possible that had you invested that money in YOURSELF, and made YOURSELF a confident collector, do you think there's the slightest possiblity you might get a little more enjoyment out of the coins you buy?
everything above, despite where it may come across as flaming, i submit to everyone w/ utter respect & w/ no insult or put-downs intended whatsoever. it is not directed at any 1 individual, but you ask good questions, & i've attempted to provide good answers.
no question about it, the ultimate truth, the bottom line, is "to each his own", ie. buy what you like. but i fear that the blindness to anything but plastic has deprived many from discovering what it is they like.
sorry, had to followup because i note there are now several threads asking "is this a-t?". but it may be an opportunity to drive home my point.
what if, every time someone asked "is this coin a-t?", the response was "how do YOU define a-t?" i think that best expresses my complaints about the discussions.
Hey gsaguy, the fact that the dealer you call mike is trying to make approximately 2000.00 profit on a 50.00 coin is part and parcel of what is wrong with this toning craze. Liking toned Morgans is one thing and Im sure I like them. I sure wouldnt want to give this guy mike a 2000 dollar profit on that coin though. That would make me sour on the whole thing if I was a beginning coin buyer and I found out something like that. Thats what happend to the stock market. People got too greedy. Your guy mike is too greedy. Shame on him and on all others who engage in such ugly stuff.
In an insane society, a sane person will appear to be insane.
Wow GsaGuy, I must say That is a Beauty!!I would say that Mike purchased this coin at a gift price. I guess sometimes Santa Clause pokes his tummy in numismatics once in a while. I take it the price Mike paid for this is more an exception than the rule? I paid less than $750 for mine and I am uncomfortable revealing the exact amount before the deal is fully consumated (meaning I get a chance to visually inspect it and approve/disapprove of the coin).
Dorkkarl, I love the way you take bits and pieces of what I say while leaving out the rest of the comments so you can contort your responses the way you please. Sort of like a press interview gone bad for the interviewee, I suppose. Anyway I will respond to only one of your rebuttals and leave it at that.
<< <i>so you are saying that had the coin not been slabed, you would have pay the exact same amount for it? the plastic has ABSOLUTELY NO INFLUENCE on you whatsoever? >>
No, I didn't say that. I admit to paying a higher price than I would have if the coin was sold raw. Therefore, the coin being encased in a PCGS holder did have bearing on the price I was willing to pay.
Also, I will not comment on a definition of AT because, unlike yourself, I like to back up any meaningful contribution I would input with facts. To do otherwise would be just adding another opinion, of which this forum already has in abundance on this subject. Since I cannot present valid facts, I will leave that sort of thing to you and the other cooks around here that like to stir up the pot.
hey hadleydog, bring on the heat, i can take it!!!
<< <i>I will not comment on a definition of AT because, unlike yourself, I like to back up any meaningful contribution I would input with facts. >>
now, i do NOT think you are being honest. i think the real reason is because your def'n of a-t is: "pcgs won't slab it". isn't that the truth? ie. you do not have a def'n of a-t, you just know you don't like it, based on what someone else (pcgs) thinks it is! i think that is too bad. the point is, without defining what it is you are discussing, how can your discussions be meaningful?
<< <i> To do otherwise would be just adding another opinion, of which this forum already has in abundance on this subject. >>
on the other hand , the number of stated opinons as to a definition is sadly lacking. again, the norm often seems to "if it's in a pcgs holder, by golly it must not be a-t". so is that a reflection of the observer's opinion? or someone else's?
<< <i>Since I cannot present valid facts, I will leave that sort of thing to you and the other cooks around here that like to stir up the pot >>
are you sure? is the real reason that your taking the easy way out that you cannot present valid facts? or is it because you just don't want to invest the time it would take to come up with your own definition?
again, i am not trying to disparage you , not by any means. but it is just so disheartening that the turn of the "hobby" these days is, "i can't think for myself, so i gladly give pcgs my money so they can think for me".
i guess that, in your opinion, i'm the only 1 who believes that.
as for "stirring up the pot", by golly, is it better to just blindly follow the whims of that great nameless, faceless plastic company in the sky? is it so horrible to ask questions? to call under scrutiny the motives behind who & what determines the market? why is that so bad? is it because you just might not like the answers, because they may show that pcgs is not so infallible, or even so consistent, after all?
i apologize to everyone reading my constant ranting & raving, but doesn't there come a point when, if you rely completely on others (say, plastic corporations) to do your thinking for you, you forget how to think yourself?
or do you need someone to figure the answer to that question for you?
I agree that his asking price sounds high, but then, he owns the coin and can ask what he pleases. At the end of the day, the value of a coin is what a willing seller and a willing buyer agree upon.
And for the record, to me, the price someone paid for a coin is of no importance to the actual value of the coin. Perhaps he underpaid, but perhaps he overpaid as well. If he overpaid, I'm under no obligation to guarantee him a profit.
Anyway, I agree with you on one thing. There's always been plenty of greed in the coin business in general......not just toned coins. It all goes back to the same thing: Know what you're doing, buy what you can afford, and buy what you like. Do these things and I think coins can be a pleasurable experience!
Comments
<< <i>Read my last post........ and pay very special attention to the word CLUELESS >>
I'm sorry...but that was pretty funny.
<< <i>you are a forum troll. >>
<< <i>you are a troll. >>
OK, which is it...dammit?! lol
<< <i>You guys look at more Morgans than I do >>
I can assure you, that is NOT the case (for me). I usualy avoid Morgans for the most part. I was just thinking that what Dragon pointed out: sometimes there are "toning breaks" as he put it. It could be scratches however. As far as a benefit of the doubt is concerned: You're right...I wouldn't buy ANY coin on Ebay without a return policy. If not, I don't bid, period.
jom
IMHO, I'll bet it is beautiful when you finally get it in hand. And very real!
<< <i>From the infamous Coin Doctor Thread >>
heeeeyyyyy, why you calling that thread INfamous???
<< <i>Dorkkarl, Sorry if I misquoted you verbatem, but I was pretty close. >>
loki, i'm sorry, but it was not close at all, in fact it was misleading. there are 2 types of toning - natural, & non-natural. my def'n is pretty danged specific. sorry to keep ratting on this 1, but it's the type of misquote that leads to arguments (see what you started?)
<< <i><< sadly, the bottom line theme that runs through this thread continues to be ignored. all coins with wild'n'crazy colors are artificially toned. it is a plain & simple FACT. what you are paying for when you buy 1 in a holder is the blessing of the plastic company. when you accept that FACT, you will find it much easier to find the right direction to take w/ coins of this ilk. >>
i absolutely stand behind that statement 100%. take the present example. would you buy it because it's natural toning? or would you like it because you LIKE it? no doubt because you LIKE it. & why do you like it? i bet it's because the coin is in plastic. & that's OK. to enjoy this hobby, you must be willing to buy what you like. but i think you'll get 10 times more enjoyment when you learn to be honest w/ yourself as to why you like certain things.
note that in no way am i trying to be disparaging. but like i said, i unequivocally stand behind my previous statements, for which your misquote was NOT close.
K S
Your actual quote and my close approximation do bear one important thing in common; they are both ridiculous. To say something so groundbreaking as "all wild and crazy colors are AT", state it as a FACT, and not substantiate that with any acceptable PROOF is just a belliose OPINION. This one statement renders scrutiny to every other comment you make, and makes your avatar a correct choice in reflecting yourself to others on this forum. Opinions related to toning run rampant in this forum, with proven facts being quite rare. Now is your chance to shine and substantiate this fact of yours with a dose of proof! I won't hold my breath so take your time.
<< <i>i bet it's because the coin is in plastic. & that's OK. to enjoy this hobby, you must be willing to buy what you like. but i think you'll get 10 times more enjoyment when you learn to be honest w/ yourself as to why you like certain things >>
I have to learn to be honest with myself as to why I like certain things? OK, I honestly like this coin. That's good enough for me, and I am being quite honest. Yes, the coin being currently encased in a PCGS holder was also a factor, because it does make the coin have more marketability, and when the time comes to sell, it will be much easier to get some or all of my money back. Honest! Whether you like it or not, coins certified by reputable grading companies such as PCGS are the way to go with expensive purchases, in my opinion. To buy otherwise opens up a greater risk factor and pits only you against the coin collecting world. You'd better know what you are doing if you go the unslabbed route with expensive coins, and I can honestly say I am not confident enough to be willing to take that chance just yet.
I will post an unbiased honest pic of the coin when I receive it, so anyone that cares will get another look.
PLONK!
For what it's worth, I agree totally with your buying strategy when it comes to coins: use discretionary income, buy what you like, and don't worry about what anyone else thinks. It's YOUR collection and you're putting it together for YOUR enjoyment.
Please do let us know when the coin arrives how you like it and how closely it approximates the scans. I've done business with Andrew and always found him very easy to work with. I doubt seriously you'll come away from the deal with a bad experience.
Talking about vibrantly toned coins, I wanted to note one in Mike Billy's ebay store. It's an 84-O in a PCGS MS63 holder. The item number is 3306393112. Perhaps someone can provide a linky.
This coin was sold by a forum member to Mike at the FUN show for considerably less than the one you've just bought from Andrew. Mike obviously likes it a lot with an asking price of $2400. While I'd be surprised if he gets anywhere near that amount for the coin, it just goes to show how much some of us like vibrantly toned coins.
GSAGUY
<< <i>Your actual quote and my close approximation do bear one important thing in common; they are both ridiculous. To say something so groundbreaking as "all wild and crazy colors are AT", state it as a FACT, and not substantiate that with any acceptable PROOF is just a belliose OPINION. >>
no sir, it is a FACT. i challenge you to look throught mounds & mounds & mounds of coins that have always been in pocket change, which is the intended environment of, well, pocket-change, and find ONE, just ONE single a-t coin. it would be extremely simple for you to disprove my statement by finding that ONE example.
<< <i>This one statement renders scrutiny to every other comment you make, and makes your avatar a correct choice in reflecting yourself to others on this forum. >>
i do not deny it!
<< <i>Opinions related to toning run rampant in this forum, >>
no, what runs rampant are endless, pointless arguments over what is a-t & what is not. & why do they run rampant? because the participants in such arguments do not bother to present THEIR def'n of what constitutes a-t. where have you made YOURS? but i will agree w/ this, it sure as he11 takes guts to express a def'n & commit to it. where is YOUR commitment?
<< <i> with proven facts being quite rare. Now is your chance to shine and substantiate this fact of yours with a dose of proof! I won't hold my breath so take your time. >>
uh, the proof is pretty simple, though admittedly quantitative. it very simply amounts to this: i have NEVER, EVER, NOT EVEN ONCE IN THIRTY YEARS SEEN A COIN A-T'd AS A RESULT OF ITS INTENDED ENVIRONMENT. your absolutely correct that such does not consitute "proof", but gee, you know what? i do not know a single person who has ever done so either, and that includes YOU!
<< <i><< i bet it's because the coin is in plastic. & that's OK. to enjoy this hobby, you must be willing to buy what you like. but i think you'll get 10 times more enjoyment when you learn to be honest w/ yourself as to why you like certain things >>
I have to learn to be honest with myself as to why I like certain things? OK, I honestly like this coin. >>
so you are saying that had the coin not been slabed, you would have pay the exact same amount for it? the plastic has ABSOLUTELY NO INFLUENCE on you whatsoever? baloney.
<< <i>That's good enough for me, and I am being quite honest. Yes, the coin being currently encased in a PCGS holder was also a factor, >>
THAT is being honest
<< <i> because it does make the coin have more marketability >>
and so is THAT.
<< <i>and when the time comes to sell >>
and that too!
so what you just admitted is that it is not the COIN you like, it is the coin plus holder plus marketabilty of the holder plus salability of the older. the 2 statements are not equal:
"i like this coin" does not equal "i like this coin because of what the holder adds to it"
<< <i>Whether you like it or not, coins certified by reputable grading companies such as PCGS are the way to go with expensive purchases, in my opinion. >>
this is a change in subject, so i'll go along w/ it.
again, your opinion, but you don't define what your talking about . "expensive"? what constitutes "expensive" for you? OK, for me, expensive is > $100. so under $100 would be cheap, right? look around this forum, ebay, wherever, dude, how many coins, CHEAP coins do you see in pcgs plastic? don't you think it is rather ridiculous for a $100 coin to cost you $120 because the price of plastic has to be added in? how about a $30 coin costing $50? why do you suppose coins are so expensive these days? is it because certain cheap coins have suddenly became the object of all desires? or could it possibly be because of the FACT that in the past 10 years, $350MILLION has been spent on certifying coins? who do you think pays for that?
YOU DO. & I have to too, whether i want to or not.
<< <i>To buy otherwise opens up a greater risk factor and pits only you against the coin collecting world. >>
oh really? so the hundreds of books written by hundreds of authors to arm you with information are worthless then? poor pitiful collectors, they really need pcgs because, golly gee, it's just so hard to learn how to grade coins yourself. is this what you're saying? without the might cloak of protection offered by pcgs, we would all just be a bunch of bumbling, sniveling, clueless idiots shivering with fear because of all the scary dark corners in coin dealers shops? c'mon, dude. YOU are smarter than that!
<< <i>You'd better know what you are doing if you go the unslabbed route with expensive coins, and I can honestly say I am not confident enough to be willing to take that chance just yet. >>
& this is the ultimate crux of the matter, you have just stated it in an a roundabout way. i ask you to consider if it isn't just possible, just remotely within the realm of possiblity that all the money you've spent on the "value-added" of slabs, ie the $20 per slabed coin that you MUST pay, one way or another, is it just possible that had you invested that money in YOURSELF, and made YOURSELF a confident collector, do you think there's the slightest possiblity you might get a little more enjoyment out of the coins you buy?
everything above, despite where it may come across as flaming, i submit to everyone w/ utter respect & w/ no insult or put-downs intended whatsoever. it is not directed at any 1 individual, but you ask good questions, & i've attempted to provide good answers.
no question about it, the ultimate truth, the bottom line, is "to each his own", ie. buy what you like. but i fear that the blindness to anything but plastic has deprived many from discovering what it is they like.
K S
what if, every time someone asked "is this coin a-t?", the response was "how do YOU define a-t?" i think that best expresses my complaints about the discussions.
K S
Dorkkarl, I love the way you take bits and pieces of what I say while leaving out the rest of the comments so you can contort your responses the way you please. Sort of like a press interview gone bad for the interviewee, I suppose. Anyway I will respond to only one of your rebuttals and leave it at that.
<< <i>so you are saying that had the coin not been slabed, you would have pay the exact same amount for it? the plastic has ABSOLUTELY NO INFLUENCE on you whatsoever? >>
No, I didn't say that. I admit to paying a higher price than I would have if the coin was sold raw. Therefore, the coin being encased in a PCGS holder did have bearing on the price I was willing to pay.
Also, I will not comment on a definition of AT because, unlike yourself, I like to back up any meaningful contribution I would input with facts. To do otherwise would be just adding another opinion, of which this forum already has in abundance on this subject. Since I cannot present valid facts, I will leave that sort of thing to you and the other cooks around here that like to stir up the pot.
<< <i>Hey Dorkkarl, PLONK! >>
hey hadleydog, bring on the heat, i can take it!!!
<< <i>I will not comment on a definition of AT because, unlike yourself, I like to back up any meaningful contribution I would input with facts. >>
now, i do NOT think you are being honest. i think the real reason is because your def'n of a-t is: "pcgs won't slab it". isn't that the truth? ie. you do not have a def'n of a-t, you just know you don't like it, based on what someone else (pcgs) thinks it is! i think that is too bad. the point is, without defining what it is you are discussing, how can your discussions be meaningful?
<< <i> To do otherwise would be just adding another opinion, of which this forum already has in abundance on this subject. >>
on the other hand , the number of stated opinons as to a definition is sadly lacking. again, the norm often seems to "if it's in a pcgs holder, by golly it must not be a-t". so is that a reflection of the observer's opinion? or someone else's?
<< <i>Since I cannot present valid facts, I will leave that sort of thing to you and the other cooks around here that like to stir up the pot >>
are you sure? is the real reason that your taking the easy way out that you cannot present valid facts? or is it because you just don't want to invest the time it would take to come up with your own definition?
again, i am not trying to disparage you , not by any means. but it is just so disheartening that the turn of the "hobby" these days is, "i can't think for myself, so i gladly give pcgs my money so they can think for me".
i guess that, in your opinion, i'm the only 1 who believes that.
as for "stirring up the pot", by golly, is it better to just blindly follow the whims of that great nameless, faceless plastic company in the sky? is it so horrible to ask questions? to call under scrutiny the motives behind who & what determines the market? why is that so bad? is it because you just might not like the answers, because they may show that pcgs is not so infallible, or even so consistent, after all?
i apologize to everyone reading my constant ranting & raving, but doesn't there come a point when, if you rely completely on others (say, plastic corporations) to do your thinking for you, you forget how to think yourself?
or do you need someone to figure the answer to that question for you?
K S
K S
I agree that his asking price sounds high, but then, he owns the coin and can ask what he pleases. At the end of the day, the value of a coin is what a willing seller and a willing buyer agree upon.
And for the record, to me, the price someone paid for a coin is of no importance to the actual value of the coin. Perhaps he underpaid, but perhaps he overpaid as well. If he overpaid, I'm under no obligation to guarantee him a profit.
Anyway, I agree with you on one thing. There's always been plenty of greed in the coin business in general......not just toned coins. It all goes back to the same thing: Know what you're doing, buy what you can afford, and buy what you like. Do these things and I think coins can be a pleasurable experience!
GSAGUY