Anyone who is complaining about GAI better then throw away half there PSA cards because the guys who graded your PSA cards are the same ones grading the GAI cards. Of course your going to find isolated cards from all the services that are under and over graded. Get a group of cards that are over graded and have them still tell you there in the right grade and then make a comment.
Of course your going to find isolated cards from all the services that are under and over graded. Get a group of cards that are over graded and have them still tell you there in the right grade and then make a comment.
WOOOOOOOO - another first! Two excellent points in the same post! Nice point gaspipe.
I am really looking forward to the next Fort Washington show now.
Get a group of cards that are over graded and have them still tell you there in the right grade and then make a comment.
Gaspipe...having got stuck with a GAI lemon, I have every right to make a "comment" and I take exception to your questioning my right to do so. Many PSA overgrades came in their early years. If GAI is supposedly using "experienced" former PSA graders, those type errors shouldn't occur as often. Maybe that's why they're "former" PSA employees. Wolfbear's GAI 8 Hayes crossing over to a PSA 5 is just another good example of why I'm off GAI permanently.
I'm not sure if 1420 last post is condensending of not, but I'll be explain my opinion on the subject. I feel at this time PSA is feeling some pressure, whether its financially or competitive I dont know. I do know that GAI is doing heavy customer contact with large submitters. They are spending alot of time and effort in bringing business in. SGC also did this at one time. I also feel that none of the companies intentionally give higher grades to specific submitters. BUT mistakes do happen and they all should be accountable for them. My issue is in fixing the mistakes when they happen. PSA has not shown be that they will do so. I have not had any issues at this time with GAI, but then again I've done very well with what I bought in GAI holders and crossed, so I cant complain.I've not sent in any large submissions to PSA in quite awhile, GAI either. and then again I have not tried to cross PSA to GAI. There is 1 thing I dont like about all the companies and thats the 10 grade. If a card is MINT that that should be the highest grade.
Mantlefan, You can take any exception you want. I have 13 PSA 9 pieces of crap, all won on ebay the same day. I cracked them out and resubmitted them after PSA said they were graded correctly, 1 came back a 7, 10 came back 8's 2 remained 9. So what does that tell you?I also submitted a 1965 T.Perez Rookie and it came back a PSA 6, re submitted it again and it came back a PSA 8. Cracked out a 1969 Yaz Allstar that was in a GAI 8 and came back a PSA 9. For every instance you can bring up about a bad GAI I can come back with a bad PSA 3 fold. If you dont like card call GAI and ask them to explain the grade. If they wont explain or compensate then I'll take issue.
With all due respect, your militant stance against GAI based on one card (that may very well cross to a PSA 9 anyway--though it's tough to tell with their inconsistent standards of late) seems out of character for someone of your collecting prowess. While I too find the stain quite offensive, the fact is that PSA routinely grades cards like these 9's. This is not an opinion. It is imperical fact. Sell the card if you don't like it. I would question the seller for not disclosing the stain, however. That flaw is obvious and should have been noted.
Calleocho, Thank you for that earth-shattering revelation. I would never have guessed that PSA had more cards listed on ebay. By the way folks, the earth is probably round and my Mom thinks I'm handsome...
Just because McDonald's makes and sells more hamburgers in no way, shape or form discredits Burger King. Nor does it mean McDonald's is superior or makes a better burger. The thread was about GAI's viablility as a card grading company. Nothing more. Anybody who is conscious understands that PSA has a larger market share at this point. It has more to do with consumers being creatures of habit than quality at this point. PSA is fine but not the righteous perfectionists some posters proclaim. Just a grading company who is better than some and comparable to others. Happy Holidays!
DGI...My original post was just a reply to the thread asking what our experience has been with GAI. I simply replied that I had one experience and it was a bad one. Re-read my first post...I showed a scan of the card and said I was not happy. That certainly wasn't "militant". I was surprised by the responses I got...Gator told me I got a "bargain" on an "awesome" card and Gaspipe questioned my right to offer any opinion at all. I then began reviewing prior posts on this topic, specifically the November 27, 2002 thread on this Forum. There, I found that several members of this Forum had GAI 8's come back PSA 7's. The more I read, I guess, the more "militant" I became. Even so, why isn't one bad experience enough to make an opinion. Grading is a service. If you had your car fixed by a mechanic and he did a bad job, would you go back to him, even if others told you he was great. I think not. I have over 300 PSA 9 1950's and 60's cards, and there's not a stain on one of them! GAI will never overtake PSA. I think most of their cards are being bought at low prices to be cracked out and sent to PSA. But that's just my opinion, I could be wrong [miss you Dennis].
I'm not sure if 1420 last post is condensending of not, but I'll be explain my opinion on the subject
not at all gaspipe - but I can see where you amy have interpreted just that. I have heard about mistakes on undergrades and that was the first I have heard on "what about overgrades" - I have both. My last thread on the Byron and Fort Washington experience had nothing to do with complaining about grades, but it had something to do with this ...
My issue is in fixing the mistakes when they happen. PSA has not shown be that they will do so
after the Walter Johnson experience, I felt betrayed as a customer. Some of you could have moved on, chalked it up as a learning experience, etc. I could not, and I am having a hard time feeling the confidence I once had with PSA. If I get a PSA 8 and feel it was a PSA 9 -- so be it, no biggie to me. That situation was different and I will not get into again, as some forum members may take offense. But I am not over it in the least.
I am not overly concerned about resale. My collection is the most important one in the world to me. When I try to add to it and something happens differently than what I was told, that hits home. My collecting efforts get thwarted, and am left feeling a little disarayed about the company. I was offered a cup of coffee at the next show however.
GAI is looking like a company I want to talk to, and I will do just that in Fort Washington.
PSA should have more misgraded cards in circulation than any other company since they have so many cards out there relative to the other companies. If people suscribe to the theory of buy the card and not the holder buy from SGC and GAI. You will get a nice card at a better price than you would have to pay with PSA. I talked to Mastro at the Canadian Expo and I thought their viewpoint was excellent. They stated that all three companies graded cards well, had a few differences, but for the most part all did a good job. However, as a seller PSA cards brought a better return. The set registry has done a brilliant job of having collectors fight over PSA cards, and search for tough to get raw cards to submit to PSA. At that show I bought a GAI graded 8 Michael Jordan rookie. It has beautiful centering, and an outstanding appearance. The corners are nice but NMMT. The only reason I would contemplate crossing the card over is because of the set registry. The set registry has changed the shape of collecting as much as almost anything else in the past 15 years.
I'm sure GAI is an excellent choice. For me I got my own personal reasons and experiences for why I can not or will not do business with them. I know they are busting their rear ends to bring in business and get established in the industry. So when I post, I definitely do so with biase. I do not like Gai.
My only advice to anyone buying a card is do your best to "buy the card and not the holder."
After reading aro13' s post I've decided to comment some more.
From the standpoint of red man cards, Psa's grading has been all over the place as of late. Very inconsistent. I'm trying to complete a 53 set on the registry in Nm or better. I would love to replace seven's with eight's. But it's tough to justify spending the money on eights when I know the seven's are as good if not better. It is discouraging to pass on higher graded cards that would help improve my set rating. But I plug away.
I've also been crossing over my 54's to Sgc. I can easily say that overall these cards are graded much more accurately and consistently (correct). And I know that when I crack out a $800 Campanella in a Psa 8 holder to an Sgc 88 holder I've eliminated future buyers if you believe Psa is more liquid. I do... but red man cards sell in both holders... and I've been a collector of nice cards for over 20 years. I've started buying holders in the last three. I hope that a true collector recognizes the card not the holder. I hope to keep them for a long long time. I also hope that Sgc can make gains in this industry especially since I would only use them or Psa. Otherwise my cards will go in screw cases.
Lately some of the 54's would not cross. For various reasons. I hope to talk to Joe Orlando when I get a chance to discuss.
To help maximize my purchasing power of quality red man cards I've been lucky enough to have some dealers send me cards to look at first to decide if I want to buy them. I won't go into details but I can agree with many comments made the last few days as I review the latest group.
I feel your pain with the card you bought. Mistakes happen. But in the back of my mind I do wonder if it was a mistake or a gift. I'm a very cynical person. It can be a bad character trait. Hopefully, Gai can make this good for you.
We here said always buy the card and not the holder. It's tough to do when you don't have the card in hand.
I don't want anyone to think that with my last post I'm not a Psa supporter. I'm probably one weird dude since I support Psa and Sgc. I like the fact you can have choices. And I'm big on consistency and following up on overgrades.
Aconte> I encounter this with my 75 and 78 set all the time. With my 78s, I am looking for 9s but if I get 8s from my own submissions I'll put them in there - because I know those are about the highest-end 8s in circulation. If I find a 9 that honestly beats the 8 that I have I'll upgrade. But if I don't get around to it, it's not a big deal to me. Regardless of the GPA number next to my set on the registry, I know the quality of my set. My 75 set shows a GPA of 8.05 on the set registry, but I'd put it card-for-card against any 75 set out there where the owner built it by just buying the holder and not the card.
Aconte-Thanks. Sorry, I deleted my post before you posted and after I re-read your post and realized you were merely pointing out inconsistencies in the grading of red man cards which I know absolutely nothing about.
My perspective on GAI is rooted in experiences with PSA that date back about 4 years. I used to be a true PSA loyalist...until a submission of mine and a letter from them announcing a price increase and TAT change criss-crossed in the mail. My submission was post marked before the increase, but they received it afterwards. And the answer was...cough up another buck per card. It was a small amount of money ($50), but it really ticked me off. That was my last submission to PSA (but definately not my last purchase of a PSA graded card!)
I first became aware of GAI when a dealer friend of mine sent me an email telling me about. them He tells me that there was a defection from PSA of the president, head grader and customer service manager (you guys know all the names, I'm sure). I said, too bad they took the customer service manager. He said, good point.
So, it is actually that defection that has me submitting to PSA again (not yet, waiting to see what Jan. 15th brings)
Competition is a good thing -- and should benefit all of us.
With GAI , im taking a wait and see attitude. I have purchased several GAI graded 1955 and 1956 Topps with the purpose of crossing them over to PSA. After reveiwing the cards I deemed all except for one would likely fall a grade if i tried to cross them to PSA. I elected to resell them rather than try to cross them over. From now on unless i can absolutely steal the card in that holder or see it in person . I will not put a serious bid on one of their cards. As for them gaining support amongst dealers im not suprised because when Rocchi and gang were running PSA . They put the dealers first. Honestly they have to walk a fine line in their early years of business first by catering to the dealers all the while not giving collectors the impression that back door deals are going on (which they made famous at PSA before they left, aconte alluded to this above in referring to the card as a "gift" but took the high road on this.
Do they know there stuff YES are they honest enough for me to put my faith in them (Im not sure as of now)
As for their holders i like them but i feel PSA are more sturdy . I really like the Beckett holder (but would never use them for grading). I would pay PSA to reslab all my cards if they put the time and effort to put out a safe and attractive holder
the analogy between mcdonalds and burger king is not close to PSA and GAI
competition is a good thing and PSA has become an even stronger company because of this.
Both SGC and BGS have niche followings in pre war and modern rookies ...but for my collection needs PSA is simply the best way to go and the only one i would consider.
GAI might indeed one day become a stronger force but that would only make it worse for SGC and BGS since they already are the 2 and 3 companies.
1420:
you sound really bitter about one experience that didnt go your way. if PSA had offered you some free grades and make it better would you still have consider GAi as an alternative?
Ethan
"Women should be obscene and not heard. " Groucho Marx
We have Three viable grading companies in the marketplace that actually know how to grade cards and stand behind their product/service., PSA, SGC, and GAI
We all have our personal preferences and it is good that we do have the competition in the market. As Sol, I remember the horrible service in the late 90's, coupled with the higher fees that we all paid per card when PSA was the only game in town. I was no different. When SGC and Beckett opened their doors, my business went to them, despite the lack of guarantee with Beckett (which is something that I would not do today), as I feel that this aspect is critical to the credibility of the product.
Mantlefan: With all due respect, did you contact GAI in an effort to rectify this situation? They actually guarantee the grade unlike Beckett, and if you have a legitimate complaint, I think that you would be far better served by taking the matter up with them. We have seen several occasions on this board of similar PSA errors, and what is the first thing the board responds with?....Contact Charlie!!!! .........and most of the time, that is the last thing that we hear about the issue with Charlie having resolved the matter.
I apologize for the remark, but being myself after submitting thousands of cards to psa vintage and newer. The stain comes in a 9 holder at least one grader thinks so and according to psa 3 graders looked at the card so what does that tell you..
As Paul said give them a shout and see what they say for I can only seeing that being a plus for you. For they might buy the card back or ask the dealer for a return for that is what psa would tell you to do. Or they might stick by the psa standby everyones human and give you some story of how it fits within the standards on the technical merit....
I think you will find gai more than happy to help!!!!
Keep in mind that I'm not saying that gai is the answer for everyone only a alternative that seems to be on the correct track...
Mantlefan hit the nail on the head. Why would you have GAI grade your card when a psa card goers for substantially more in the market. The only logic could be either long-term "relationships" that these dealers have with Baker/Rocchi or that they are getting preferential treatment in some regard. Lets ask Mr. Rocchi to address these issues publicly. As it stands today, GAI in my mind is a grading service that favors the dealers versus the collectors. Sort of like SCD is a publication that historically has represented the dealers.
Calleocho, You're right--it's not close--it's dead-on. As it is applied in this context it is exact. I still prefer Wendy's... and my Mom STILL thinks I'm handsome.
Mantlefan, Good for you...I hope it goes your way. It DOES look like a nice copy otherwise. By "militant", I meant unwavering and unwilling to accept an explanation. I think this term fits in respect to your post. If I misunderstood your tone, I apologize. I like GAI at this point and am quick to defend the same guys I bashed five years ago. PSA had gotten ridiculous, but I'd like to think Mike and Steve are more enlightened to collectors needs these days--they're gonna have to be to survive.
Notice to all concerned, I'd be suprised if six months ago this thread wouldn't have topped a dozen replies--this is #78--a sign that people are no longer "indifferent" to the options available to them.
i think all companies and that includes grading companies favor the dealer over the collector. i own a business and i know i do. if that wasn't true how many topics would be about dsl sports. anybody submitting 10,000 cards a year is going to get more sliders, favors,gifts or whatever you want to call them than someone sending in submissions of 25 a month. is it fair, more than likely not but that is the way the world works. i have never had a problem with gai and hope i don't in the future. i talk to steve and mary at least once a week. they know i send submissions to psa and to them, they are even re-grading some 8's and 9's star cards for me since they were graded before the half point system. i don't think they will ever take over as #1 and they know as well as every one else that gai cards don't command the price of psa. they are an option and its's good to have options.
Thanks. At least some good came out of this. I was prepared to "eat" this card. Now, maybe I can get something back on it. BTW, should I use barbecue sauce or ketchup when eating cards?
Hey thanks, I thought it was time to bring my tone to a happy side for sometimes I think many of you get the wrong impression of me..Sometimes I cross the line unknowingly until I read the post the next morning only to figure that was in know way what I was trying to say for I dont express myself very well....
Or I just woke up having a nightmare of how my 81 babies just got botched!!!
Ah grading companies something to tie the world together I think forest gump mom sais it best "grading is like a box of chocalates you never not what your going to get" HAHA
Or lyle and joe are in a meeting and the grader are sitting in a three man circle playing paper, rock, scissors on your 57 low pops...
Thats all I've got for I found that funny maybe not you guys...
With all that said I apologize if I've offended anyone in the past for that is not my purpose in life as I sell alot of my gems to you folks for your pleasure and mine...
you sound really bitter about one experience that didnt go your way. if PSA had offered you some free grades and make it better would you still have consider GAi as an alternative?
Ethan
I have been thinking about GAI for a few months. Although I do not have the collection some do, I do value my collection, enjoy looking at it, and have fun. From strictly and aestetical standpoint, I think my cards would look better in a GAI holder.
Yes, I am bitter. And I hope it goes away real soon. I enjoy PSA but like I have said in this post and the other, I have a bad taste in my mouth regarding the whole Ft Washington experience. If I would have been reimbursed my fees from the get go (which is what I was asking for and NOTHING more) I would have been 114% fine. To have Joe Orlando defend the GRADER, was unacceptable .... especially when other collectors went thru the same thing with Byron. Joe and I had a phone conversation about this, and I was thinking cool, Joe is going to look into this and say, "Neal, we see your point on WHY you purchased this card so here is a refund." A free grade would have been nice as well.
I have had two problems with PSA - both fairly minor and very easy to fix. Steve Rocchi fixed the one problem when he was there with ease. The other problem, which was a recent thread of mine, was not and will not be fixed. A simple $33.00 refund would have done it and I would have been happy. Mistakes happen all the time -- I make them as well. I may sound insane to act up over a small amount of money, but principle means alot to me.
I know exactly how good things were handled when Steve was there. I had a shipment that my local post office screwed up and gave the package to someone else, of course it was insured, but if anyone has ever filed a USPS claim you know the extended time it takes to get your money back. Bottom line is I spoke to Lyle (who I met 2 years ago in Nashville) and after a few days Steve called to let me know that PSA would be sending me a check for $2600 which was the value of the package and I would not have to wait the time it takes dealing with the Post Office. Three days later I cashed my check!!! This deal with you really sucks, the grader should not have made any comment, and you should at least receive a refund of your fees.
Lyle Raimer is the man, and I wish I had talked to him first. I am glad he is still there. Actually, everyone with whom I have spoken to at PSA is quality people. That is why I was truly surprised with the outcome. Oh well, I need to move on and concentrate on other things.
Comments
WOOOOOOOO - another first! Two excellent points in the same post! Nice point gaspipe.
I am really looking forward to the next Fort Washington show now.
Gaspipe...having got stuck with a GAI lemon, I have every right to make a "comment" and I take exception to your questioning my right to do so. Many PSA overgrades came in their early years. If GAI is supposedly using "experienced" former PSA graders, those type errors shouldn't occur as often. Maybe that's why they're "former" PSA employees. Wolfbear's GAI 8 Hayes crossing over to a PSA 5 is just another good example of why I'm off GAI permanently.
Always looking for 1957 Topps BB in PSA 9!
I feel at this time PSA is feeling some pressure, whether its financially or competitive I dont know. I do know that GAI is doing heavy customer contact with large submitters. They are spending alot of time and effort in bringing business in. SGC also did this at one time. I also feel that none of the companies intentionally give higher grades to specific submitters. BUT mistakes do happen and they all should be accountable for them. My issue is in fixing the mistakes when they happen. PSA has not shown be that they will do so. I have not had any issues at this time with GAI, but then again I've done very well with what I bought in GAI holders and crossed, so I cant complain.I've not sent in any large submissions to PSA in quite awhile, GAI either. and then again I have not tried to cross PSA to GAI.
There is 1 thing I dont like about all the companies and thats the 10 grade. If a card is MINT that that should be the highest grade.
You can take any exception you want. I have 13 PSA 9 pieces of crap, all won on ebay the same day. I cracked them out and resubmitted them after PSA said they were graded correctly, 1 came back a 7, 10 came back 8's 2 remained 9. So what does that tell you?I also submitted a 1965 T.Perez Rookie and it came back a PSA 6, re submitted it again and it came back a PSA 8. Cracked out a 1969 Yaz Allstar that was in a GAI 8 and came back a PSA 9. For every instance you can bring up about a bad GAI I can come back with a bad PSA 3 fold. If you dont like card call GAI and ask them to explain the grade. If they wont explain or compensate then I'll take issue.
With all due respect, your militant stance against GAI based on one card (that may very well cross to a PSA 9 anyway--though it's tough to tell with their inconsistent standards of late) seems out of character for someone of your collecting prowess. While I too find the stain quite offensive, the fact is that PSA routinely grades cards like these 9's. This is not an opinion. It is imperical fact. Sell the card if you don't like it. I would question the seller for not disclosing the stain, however. That flaw is obvious and should have been noted.
dgf
Thank you for that earth-shattering revelation. I would never have guessed that PSA had more cards listed on ebay. By the way folks, the earth is probably round and my Mom thinks I'm handsome...
Just because McDonald's makes and sells more hamburgers in no way, shape or form discredits Burger King. Nor does it mean McDonald's is superior or makes a better burger. The thread was about GAI's viablility as a card grading company. Nothing more. Anybody who is conscious understands that PSA has a larger market share at this point. It has more to do with consumers being creatures of habit than quality at this point. PSA is fine but not the righteous perfectionists some posters proclaim. Just a grading company who is better than some and comparable to others. Happy Holidays!
Always looking for 1957 Topps BB in PSA 9!
not at all gaspipe - but I can see where you amy have interpreted just that. I have heard about mistakes on undergrades and that was the first I have heard on "what about overgrades" - I have both. My last thread on the Byron and Fort Washington experience had nothing to do with complaining about grades, but it had something to do with this ...
My issue is in fixing the mistakes when they happen. PSA has not shown be that they will do so
after the Walter Johnson experience, I felt betrayed as a customer. Some of you could have moved on, chalked it up as a learning experience, etc. I could not, and I am having a hard time feeling the confidence I once had with PSA. If I get a PSA 8 and feel it was a PSA 9 -- so be it, no biggie to me. That situation was different and I will not get into again, as some forum members may take offense. But I am not over it in the least.
I am not overly concerned about resale. My collection is the most important one in the world to me. When I try to add to it and something happens differently than what I was told, that hits home. My collecting efforts get thwarted, and am left feeling a little disarayed about the company. I was offered a cup of coffee at the next show however.
GAI is looking like a company I want to talk to, and I will do just that in Fort Washington.
At that show I bought a GAI graded 8 Michael Jordan rookie. It has beautiful centering, and an outstanding appearance. The corners are nice but NMMT. The only reason I would contemplate crossing the card over is because of the set registry. The set registry has changed the shape of collecting as much as almost anything else in the past 15 years.
Excellent Post.
I'm sure GAI is an excellent choice. For me I got my own personal reasons and experiences for
why I can not or will not do business with them. I know they are busting their rear ends to
bring in business and get established in the industry. So when I post, I definitely do so with
biase. I do not like Gai.
My only advice to anyone buying a card is do your best to "buy the card and not the holder."
aconte
Well said.
Always looking for 1957 Topps BB in PSA 9!
From the standpoint of red man cards, Psa's grading has been all over the place as of late.
Very inconsistent. I'm trying to complete a 53 set on the registry in Nm or better. I would love
to replace seven's with eight's. But it's tough to justify spending the money on eights when
I know the seven's are as good if not better. It is discouraging to pass on higher graded cards
that would help improve my set rating. But I plug away.
I've also been crossing over my 54's to Sgc. I can easily say that overall these cards are graded
much more accurately and consistently (correct). And I know that when I crack out a $800
Campanella in a Psa 8 holder to an Sgc 88 holder I've eliminated future buyers if you believe
Psa is more liquid. I do... but red man cards sell in both holders... and I've been a collector
of nice cards for over 20 years. I've started buying holders in the last three. I hope that
a true collector recognizes the card not the holder. I hope to keep them for a long long time.
I also hope that Sgc can make gains in this industry especially since I would only use them
or Psa. Otherwise my cards will go in screw cases.
Lately some of the 54's would not cross. For various reasons. I hope to talk to Joe Orlando
when I get a chance to discuss.
To help maximize my purchasing power of quality red man cards I've been lucky enough to have
some dealers send me cards to look at first to decide if I want to buy them. I won't go into
details but I can agree with many comments made the last few days as I review the latest
group.
aconte
Thank you.
I feel your pain with the card you bought. Mistakes happen. But in the back of my mind I do
wonder if it was a mistake or a gift. I'm a very cynical person. It can be a bad character
trait. Hopefully, Gai can make this good for you.
We here said always buy the card and not the holder. It's tough to do when you don't have
the card in hand.
I don't want anyone to think that with my last post I'm not a Psa supporter. I'm probably
one weird dude since I support Psa and Sgc. I like the fact you can have choices. And
I'm big on consistency and following up on overgrades.
aconte
Mike
I do agree with your post! It can work both ways.
aconte
I first became aware of GAI when a dealer friend of mine sent me an email telling me about. them He tells me that there was a defection from PSA of the president, head grader and customer service manager (you guys know all the names, I'm sure). I said, too bad they took the customer service manager. He said, good point.
So, it is actually that defection that has me submitting to PSA again (not yet, waiting to see what Jan. 15th brings)
Competition is a good thing -- and should benefit all of us.
Scott
With GAI , im taking a wait and see attitude. I have purchased several GAI graded 1955 and 1956 Topps with the purpose of crossing them over to PSA. After reveiwing the cards I deemed all except for one would likely fall a grade if i tried to cross them to PSA. I elected to resell them rather than try to cross them over. From now on unless i can absolutely steal the card in that holder or see it in person . I will not put a serious bid on one of their cards.
As for them gaining support amongst dealers im not suprised because when Rocchi and gang were running PSA . They put the dealers first. Honestly they have to walk a fine line in their early years of business first by catering to the dealers all the while not giving collectors the impression that back door deals are going on (which they made famous at PSA before they left, aconte alluded to this above in referring to the card as a "gift" but took the high road on this.
Do they know there stuff YES are they honest enough for me to put my faith in them (Im not sure as of now)
As for their holders i like them but i feel PSA are more sturdy . I really like the Beckett holder (but would never use them for grading). I would pay PSA to reslab all my cards if they put the time and effort to put out a safe and attractive holder
Yzerman19c,
I agree with you there. Why else would a seller use GAI, when he knows GAI cards generally bring lower prices than PSA.
Always looking for 1957 Topps BB in PSA 9!
the analogy between mcdonalds and burger king is not close to PSA and GAI
competition is a good thing and PSA has become an even stronger company because of this.
Both SGC and BGS have niche followings in pre war and modern rookies ...but for my collection needs PSA is simply the best way to go and the only one i would consider.
GAI might indeed one day become a stronger force but that would only make it worse for SGC and BGS since they already are the 2 and 3 companies.
1420:
you sound really bitter about one experience that didnt go your way. if PSA had offered you some free grades and make it better would you still have consider GAi as an alternative?
Ethan
Groucho Marx
We have Three viable grading companies in the marketplace that actually know how to grade cards and stand behind their product/service., PSA, SGC, and GAI
We all have our personal preferences and it is good that we do have the competition in the market. As Sol, I remember the horrible service in the late 90's, coupled with the higher fees that we all paid per card when PSA was the only game in town. I was no different. When SGC and Beckett opened their doors, my business went to them, despite the lack of guarantee with Beckett (which is something that I would not do today), as I feel that this aspect is critical to the credibility of the product.
Mantlefan: With all due respect, did you contact GAI in an effort to rectify this situation? They actually guarantee the grade unlike Beckett, and if you have a legitimate complaint, I think that you would be far better served by taking the matter up with them. We have seen several occasions on this board of similar PSA errors, and what is the first thing the board responds with?....Contact Charlie!!!! .........and most of the time, that is the last thing that we hear about the issue with Charlie having resolved the matter.
I apologize for the remark, but being myself after submitting thousands of cards
to psa vintage and newer. The stain comes in a 9 holder at least one grader thinks
so and according to psa 3 graders looked at the card so what does that tell you..
As Paul said give them a shout and see what they say for I can only seeing that
being a plus for you. For they might buy the card back or ask the dealer for a return
for that is what psa would tell you to do. Or they might stick by the psa standby
everyones human and give you some story of how it fits within the standards
on the technical merit....
I think you will find gai more than happy to help!!!!
Keep in mind that I'm not saying that gai is the answer for everyone only a alternative
that seems to be on the correct track...
Matt
Lets ask Mr. Rocchi to address these issues publicly. As it stands today, GAI in my mind is a grading service that favors the dealers versus the collectors. Sort of like SCD is a publication that historically has represented the dealers.
Davalillo
Thanks. We're cool.
Zardoz,
E-mailed GAI yesterday. Waiting for their response. Will post it when I hear.
Happy Holidays guys.
Always looking for 1957 Topps BB in PSA 9!
You're right--it's not close--it's dead-on. As it is applied in this context it is exact. I still prefer Wendy's... and my Mom STILL thinks I'm handsome.
Mantlefan, Good for you...I hope it goes your way. It DOES look like a nice copy otherwise. By "militant", I meant unwavering and unwilling to accept an explanation. I think this term fits in respect to your post. If I misunderstood your tone, I apologize. I like GAI at this point and am quick to defend the same guys I bashed five years ago. PSA had gotten ridiculous, but I'd like to think Mike and Steve are more enlightened to collectors needs these days--they're gonna have to be to survive.
Notice to all concerned,
I'd be suprised if six months ago this thread wouldn't have topped a dozen replies--this is #78--a sign that people are no longer "indifferent" to the options available to them.
Matt,
Cool icon...more fitting of the "Guru"
I like the new logo !!!!
..............fab4.................
Thanks. At least some good came out of this. I was prepared to "eat" this card. Now, maybe I can get something back on it. BTW, should I use barbecue sauce or ketchup when eating cards?
Always looking for 1957 Topps BB in PSA 9!
Hey thanks, I thought it was time to bring my tone to a happy side for
sometimes I think many of you get the wrong impression of me..Sometimes
I cross the line unknowingly until I read the post the next morning only to
figure that was in know way what I was trying to say for I dont express
myself very well....
Or I just woke up having a nightmare of how my 81 babies just got botched!!!
Ah grading companies something to tie the world together I think forest
gump mom sais it best "grading is like a box of chocalates you never not what
your going to get" HAHA
Or lyle and joe are in a meeting and the grader are sitting in a three man circle
playing paper, rock, scissors on your 57 low pops...
Thats all I've got for I found that funny maybe not you guys...
With all that said I apologize if I've offended anyone in the past for that is not
my purpose in life as I sell alot of my gems to you folks for your pleasure and mine...
Sincerely, Matt
you sound really bitter about one experience that didnt go your way. if PSA had offered you some free grades and make it better would you still have consider GAi as an alternative?
Ethan
I have been thinking about GAI for a few months. Although I do not have the collection some do, I do value my collection, enjoy looking at it, and have fun. From strictly and aestetical standpoint, I think my cards would look better in a GAI holder.
Yes, I am bitter. And I hope it goes away real soon. I enjoy PSA but like I have said in this post and the other, I have a bad taste in my mouth regarding the whole Ft Washington experience. If I would have been reimbursed my fees from the get go (which is what I was asking for and NOTHING more) I would have been 114% fine. To have Joe Orlando defend the GRADER, was unacceptable .... especially when other collectors went thru the same thing with Byron. Joe and I had a phone conversation about this, and I was thinking cool, Joe is going to look into this and say, "Neal, we see your point on WHY you purchased this card so here is a refund." A free grade would have been nice as well.
I have had two problems with PSA - both fairly minor and very easy to fix. Steve Rocchi fixed the one problem when he was there with ease. The other problem, which was a recent thread of mine, was not and will not be fixed. A simple $33.00 refund would have done it and I would have been happy. Mistakes happen all the time -- I make them as well. I may sound insane to act up over a small amount of money, but principle means alot to me.
maybe you do have a point in being a little bitter w/ PSA. who knows maybe they will fix this problem ..better late than never.
as far as holders go...its a lot like women.
DGF:
i also prefer wendy's...and im glad you have a loving mom
Ethan
Groucho Marx
I know exactly how good things were handled when Steve was there. I had a shipment that my local post office screwed up and gave the package to someone else, of course it was insured, but if anyone has ever filed a USPS claim you know the extended time it takes to get your money back. Bottom line is I spoke to Lyle (who I met 2 years ago in Nashville) and after a few days Steve called to let me know that PSA would be sending me a check for $2600 which was the value of the package and I would not have to wait the time it takes dealing with the Post Office. Three days later I cashed my check!!!
This deal with you really sucks, the grader should not have made any comment, and you should at least receive a refund of your fees.
Good luck