I am seeing all of this discussion about stealing business, and following people around and under-bidding.
The dealer said "I DON'T WWANT TO BUY THAT STUFF!!!!!"
I, in turn say "IF YOU DON'T WANT TO BUY IT, I WANT TO SEE IT IN CASE I WANT SOME OF IT"
The dealer passed. He could have put up his dough, and then sold it, or tried to sell it to me. HE DIDN'T WANT TO BUY IT!!!!
Goodness gracious, all of this unethical this and that is pure bs, topped only by the part about "The dealer, who gets the benefit of me buying thousands of dollars in goods in his shop, cussed me out good!"
I cannot believe this lunacy, particularly in light of the fact the dealer said - no thanks.
PS: If the dealer wants to black ball me, it's not my loss. If he wants to call everyone he knows and say - don't sell to this guy - he is welcome to do so. When I walk into a shop and want to buy a $500 or $700 coin another dealer has to sell, what will he tell me? - "Im not going to sell this $700.00 coin to you because so and so says you're a bad guy"
"I want to die peacefully in my sleep like my Grandfather did, as opposed to screaming in terror like his passengers."
believe it or not, there are people who operate as you described. shortsighted ones who are probably not real confident.
this thread has really gone "out there" with all the comparisons being made. the picture i have had drawn by all the various replies is someone showing up at a shop they've never been in before and waiting for customers at the door as they exit or hovering like a vulture inside when a transaction is taking place. confusing.
common sense should dictate that a quick word with the dealer is prudent, but that was covered on page one.
Going after a dealer's potential FUTURE customer is definately unethical and downright sleazy in my book. Just because the dealer say's "I'm not interested" does not mean he/she will not be interested next week or month when that customer comes back with something else for the dealer to view. Perhaps the dealer has some of the same pieces in stock, on order, etc. I am sure it is hard enough for that dealer to make a living without having to lose potential great customers to other customers of his, especially right in front of his nose.
It is the dealer's shop that brought the customer around you at that particular time and place. Do you honestly think it is ethical and "fair" to go to that customer after the dealer says "No", offer a higher price (with the added advantage of not having to pay business overhead of course), make a purchase, give the customer your phone number/business card, etc? I certainly don't.
Best thread in a while. I like the idea of asking permission from the owner to "hit up his customer", then flip the owner a percentage if a deal is made.
Edited to add: ps. After a few deals in the parking lot, one would probably realize the sleaziness... and realize that their place of business is attracting both buyers and sellers, and that it may profitably be turned into a flea market.
I was at a very small club show today - eight tables. I did manage to find a number of fabulous coins, and bought too many of them.
While looking over some Peace Dollars, a fellow came up to me and told me he had several sets of Peace Dollars "in his van", and I was welcome to take a look at them after I was finished. He of course did this out of earshot of the dealer.
I politely gave a non-answer, as opposed to absolutely not, just so as not to make a scene. If he had coins and no table, I figured he either didn't want the coins shown to the group at large, or he was too cheap to buy a table.
He hung around me for a while, having seen me make a pretty large purchase at another table.
He then showed the very same dealer what he claimed to be a unc Morgan in some sort of holder - very heavily toned.
The dealer told him the coin was far from UNC and showed him why. He assured the dealer that by the time "he got done with it" it would be an MS63 minimum. He continued "there is plenty you can do to these"
I could not resist the temptation to blurt out "Thanks for letting me know that I should stay as far away as possible from the coins you've got out in the van"
He kind of slithered off quietly.
"I want to die peacefully in my sleep like my Grandfather did, as opposed to screaming in terror like his passengers."
hmmmm. Some of you guys do sound territorial. And some of IT sounds a bit disingenious.
If you don't have an interest in the items offered, what difference does it make what happens to it? Or, maybe you are interested at a better price. Just say that.
Why shouldn't your customer be able to purchase, maybe get a decent deal from someone other than you?
It really sounds like the bottom line is, if you can't/don't want it on your terms, no one else can have it lest they suffer your ire.
If you truly have no interest, why should it bother you if one of your customers check it out. If you allow it in your facility, you still get the credit of facilitating a transaction, and if you expect compensation, it should be known in advance. As far as I am concerned, you get compensation from me everytime you make a profit off me.
You know. maybe you should consider how many times a customer could have gone elsewhere, could have recommended someone else, is going to continue doing business with you, DIDN'T jump every other person whose "junk" you didn't want, etc. etc.
Yes a local shop is convenient, enjoyable, and many other positive things, but the attitude that your customer must only purchase through you is bogus. You should be grateful that customer doesn't directly compete with you via a local coin club, that many dealers don't even bother with. You realize how much business comes your way because of your customers?????????OR maybe, do you realize how much business could be diverted away because of your customers? Or how, about tha many times I've purchased merely for taking up time. Despite all the "considerations" I and other customers give, I have yet to meet the dealer who has considered or compensated me for sending a customer their way, or for being a loyal a frequent customer. Sure, a reasonable price for something, but nothing that has come across a a true act of "gratitude" to be recognized as such. Anyway, ... how many "customers" really hang around chasing your rejects down? What does it say about you when you are offended because your customer is willing to buy something you won't? Is your business REALLY being threatened or are you just trying to squeeze the person(s) you rejected?
No, I have never gone out the door after someone, although, I've come to know that on some of those ocassions, that person did have something I would have gladly purchased. You think the dealer felt any kind of remorse for that? But, these are just the thoughts of a collector, and I grant you that the average dealer is no different that the average person, so I expect nothing different. It's just "enlightening" if you will, to hear how adamant some of you are at the THOUGHT of a customer doing something that in the scheme of things isn't really any more harmful than NOT making a purchase from the offended dealer.
I didn't see any good points by Gilbert. Gibert wants the dealer to tell him if he wanted the coins at a better price, why does this dealer answer to Gilbert? There are too many senerio's being lumper together here. 1. Guy comes in asks what I'll pay. I quote him a price. He walks, you go in parking lot and say you'll pay it. Unacceptable. 2. guy walks in and asks a price. I quote him a price, he's about to take it, you kick his shin get him in the parking lot and say you'll pay more. Unacceptable 3. I Bid on a collection the seller has no intention of selling at that time, he's getting bids. You follow him in the parking lot give him your phone number and say I'll beat the dealers offers. Unacceptable. 4. guy walks in and wants too much for his coins dealer says do you want a shot. Acceptable. You guy don't see the bigger picture.
Just got one more point to make. Why is the coin shop any different than any other store you go to? When is the last time you asked K-Mart for a better deal on your pants just because your such a good customer and you deserve a deal. Or you catch the Levi guy delivering those pants to K-Mart and you stop him and say you'll pay more than K-Mart. I think you get my point. How many times did you catch the Wonder bread man in the grocery store did you ask him to buy bread?
you're not even worth argueing with. like this is the first time you've gone into attack mode because someone expressed an opinion other than yours. what i find comical is that i essentially AGREE with you. go read my first post. and for kripe sake, back off the attitude some.
i feel like i'm out in the woods trapping whenever i go back and forth with you----it's that easy to bait you into an angry reply, and i know you'll always bite!!!!!! go into the bathroom, and take a hard look at the character you're upset with. he's the one staring back at you from the glass.
Words acorrding to Keets there's absolutely nothing wrong with you having your opinion on this matter, operating your business in the manner you see fit and expressing that here. when you start coming onto a thread and telling the posters in no uncertain terms why they are wrong and in effect "the world according to agentjim" you have crossed over the line, my friend.
We are not friends you condescending piece of work. My opinion is my opinion and who are you "Lord Keets of SH*T" to say anyone has crossed a line for expressing it
agentjim, I keep reading responses that say the dealer has made an offer, and then someone in his shop tries to "secretly" outbid him. If this is the case, then I agree with you 100% that even if the dealer offers 1 cent on the dollar, it is completely unacceptable for someone to make any kind of other bid to the prospective seller.
But, if the dealer's response is "not interested" then that is quite a bit different than a lowball offer, and opens up a whole lot of other scenarios. That's how I interpreted the initial post in this thread.
Original post also says "sometimes the price doesn't interest the seller" is it OK to approach the seller outside. Thats why I said we are lumping too many senerio's. Any situation that would be appropriate for you to try to buy would be solve by offering the dealer a little money. Whats so hard about that? The whole argument defending this situation must also be arguing that the dealer doesn't deserve any money at all.
I haven't finished reading through this entire thread, so please forgive me if I get off-track a bit...
To those who think that this is a distinction among courtesy, ethics and morality -- I think we don't need to draw such distinctions. I'm no ethicist, but I would imagine that proper ethical behavior would revolve around actions that govern the smooth functioning of a particular system. For example, lawyer's ethics are there to ensure that the legal and judicial system works for everyone, including the accused and the guilty.
In any society, small business mercantilism would suffer seriously if it were ethically ok for sniping such as described to occur. I think this goes beyond mere courtesy. I'm no lawyer, but I wouldn't be surprised if this were illegal in most jurisdictions as well. The vast majority of our laws (or at least their interpretation) is deeply rooted in the practical. Common citizens and jurists understand the meaning of fair play, and it is these people who will judge and interpret the situation.
If a sniper were camped outside a storefront business, I'm sure the cops would come if the storeowner called them. Why? Because the cops are people too, and they depend on the community to survive. And, they'd come and try to find a way to get rid of the sniper. Perhaps the municipality has strict laws against panhandling or loitering...
As for the conduct of this thread, I find myself agreeing with AJim on sentiment but certainly not on language. AJim needs not resort to aggressive verbiage simply because not everyone agrees with every viewpoint that he expresses. No matter how articulate any individual can be, no way will everyone else ever 100% agree with him.
As for NWCS, I also applaud his sentiment. He was clearly trying to analyze this matter intellectually. But, I happen to think that he's over-analyzing things... But, that's simply my opinion.
But, to those who think this is a simple matter and everyone should simply come to the same conclusion... I think those folks need to be far more open-minded. For better or worse, our democratic and free society needs to continue to make room for a wide diversity of opinion.
EVP, I will agree with you. I am a Big City Boy and can tend to be rude and crude, Its me, live with it (not just you EVP, everyone). I say what I think knowing I am going to get an AS* chewing doesn't matter. Don't ask me what I think of your new purchase If you don't want to hear what I really think.
It's good to know that you're aware that you're a negative and unpleasant person. As for agreeing with me, I can't tell you how deeply flattered I am to know that.
BTW, I live in the biggest city in the world, and I am not generally rude and crude.
My wife would agree with you that I am not a nice guy. Probably unpleasant but I don't agree with negative. ( and I haven't forgotten your not a member of my fan club which makes your condescending remark As for agreeing with me, I can't tell you how deeply flattered I am to know that. quite obvious)
and I haven't forgotten your not a member of my fan club which makes your condescending remark As for agreeing with me, I can't tell you how deeply flattered I am to know that. quite obvious
I think you mean sarcastic because my remark was meant as sarcasm. The entire message, on the other hand, was meant as condescension. In fact, whenever I acknowledge you, you may safely assume some degree of condescension.
As for not being a member of your fan club, I didn't even know that one existed. Is the membership above ONE? Moreover, I don't know you well enough to want to join your fan club. And, from what little I know of you, I'd have to say that we wouldn't form a love connection.
You seem to have indicated that you're perfectly fine with your being rude and crude on the message boards. In the interests of fair play, I guess you would NOT expect others to be nice to you in return. Perhaps you will reap plenty of what you've sown.
Ok, I forgot about Tokyo. That's a mighty big city regardless of its being #1 or #2 in size or population. But, the folks there tend to be very polite.
Allow me to clarify, as I see this arguement has been redefined:
If the dealer flat out passes, I see no problem asking to see the merchandise. I would not go out and follow the guy, because, it's not my style. I would broach the question in the shop, in front of the dealer. To follow teh guy out gives the appearance of doing something underhanded and sneaky.
If the guy offers it at a price, and the dealer passes BASED ON PRICE, as opposed to the dealer offering a price and the guy saying he wants more, I would also pass.
The original comments which started this whole mess were "Guy walks in, offers stuff for sale, dealer says no thanks" In that scenario I have no problem blurting right out that I would like to see the stuff if I suspect there is something of interest to me.
Hopefully this elevates my status from scum sucking bottom feeder to just plain bottom feeding low life.
"I want to die peacefully in my sleep like my Grandfather did, as opposed to screaming in terror like his passengers."
> what am I missing here? A dealer says "no, I'm Not interested" and you people think its impolite to say maybe I > would be interested???????????? If a dealer is not interested, then he has no right to say anything. Yep, that's how I think about it. If the dealer said he wan't interested and I was I would say to the dealer right then, "You're not interested?" This would let him know that if he confirms his disinterest I'm going to talk to the seller.
> Same with those folks who drive drunk and smash into another car Truthteller, You're insane, why don't you compare these people to Hitler so we can end this thread?
> But, in the cases where I go in, and for whatever reason, elect to pass on that particular job, I couldn't care less > who comes in with a lower bid, because as I've already stated, I'm not interested HELLO! This seems obvious to me. If the dealers uses "I'm not interested" as a negotiating tactic to get a better price then he is the one I see as unethical.
> Going after a dealer's potential FUTURE customer is definately unethical and downright sleazy in my book Who's going after the dealer's future customers. This example said nothing about giving out your phone number and telling him and all this friends to always call you first for the best price.
> Do you honestly think it is ethical and "fair" to go to that customer after the dealer says "No", offer a higher price Who's offering a HIGHER price? I'm offering A price. The dealer said he didn't want it.
I have a funny story about this actually. When I started collecting I went to a coin store with my best friend. He had some 40% silver Kennedy halves he wanted to get a price on. The dealer low-balled him and I thought my friend would reject it (and I was thinking as soon as we got in the parking lot that I would tell him I would pay more) but he accept the dealer's offer. I bit my tongue and let the transaction happen. If the dealer said he wasn't interested however...
And of course on the show floor everything is game.
thanks for sharing a personal experience instead of stopping short with examples based on supposition such as "K-Mart" and "the traveling salesman" which may have a good intention but don't offer much in the way of a real life situation. it seems from your example and from mine on the first page that the far flung idea of "ambulance-chasing-a-la-coin-shop" probably doesn't happen very often. indeed, the originator of the thread stopped short of that type of action and sought advice. i guess that means for most of us, it doesn't seem like the thing to do.
in the movie "Jerry McGuire" there's a line about good manners which could be aptly applied here. when in doubt ask-----that's what i do and it's a good way to learn.
does anyone else have an example that really happened similar to the topic question, no matter what the outcome?? i think these would be more valuable than what the last 3-4 pages have offered.
thanks for sharing a personal experience instead of stopping short with examples based on supposition such as "K-Mart" and "the traveling salesman" which may have a good intention but don't offer much in the way of a real life situation.
So Keets, unless you own a coin shop, it's not possible to see the side of this story from a business owner's perspective and you shouldn't try to contribute to the topic?
not my point by any stretch. what i was trying to say is that personal experience bears more weight because it actually happened. imagined comparisons, no matter how closely matched, just aren't the equal of the real thing.
have ever had an experience such as what the the thread originator encountered? it would be good to hear it.
<< <i>As for NWCS, I also applaud his sentiment. He was clearly trying to analyze this matter intellectually. But, I happen to think that he's over-analyzing things... But, that's simply my opinion >>
It's what I do best. And, I did actually visit a coin shop and did ask a real person face to face what they thought. I've said all along here that I wasn't advocating anything. Just trying to make distinctions. And, I think we each have a different view as to the situation originally posted.
To me, the situation was a casual encounter (and not a systematic strategy) where the seller of coins goes into the store and the dealer doesn't want to buy them (and makes it clear), so my discussion was on the issue of the casual store customer talking to the seller of coins who could not complete a sale.
Anyway, I think this topic has run its course and it's time to let it go.
not my point by any stretch. what i was trying to say is that personal experience bears more weight because it actually happened. imagined comparisons, no matter how closely matched, just aren't the equal of the real thing.
OK, fair enough. I was sitting in a coin shop that was new to me when a lady came in asking the owner if he wanted to buy "some silver." Turns out it was jewelry instead of coins, and he told her he wasn't interested. She asked him if he could give her "anything" at all for it (I think she really needed the money.) He, again declined. I didn't say anything and actually couldn't have cared less because I was looking for buffalo nickels!
True story, and related (I guess) but not as relevant as the traveling salesman, IMHO.
.......and a good story it was. i really believe that the overwhelming majority of us here are close to one mind on this whole thing. all the ambulance chaser replies are alarmist. though there probably are incidents of that nature, i'd bet they are few and far between. that's why it's called common sense.
Comments
I am seeing all of this discussion about stealing business, and following people around and under-bidding.
The dealer said "I DON'T WWANT TO BUY THAT STUFF!!!!!"
I, in turn say "IF YOU DON'T WANT TO BUY IT, I WANT TO SEE IT IN CASE I WANT SOME OF IT"
The dealer passed. He could have put up his dough, and then sold it, or tried to sell it to me. HE DIDN'T WANT TO BUY IT!!!!
Goodness gracious, all of this unethical this and that is pure bs, topped only by the part about "The dealer, who gets the benefit of me buying thousands of dollars in goods in his shop, cussed me out good!"
I cannot believe this lunacy, particularly in light of the fact the dealer said - no thanks.
PS: If the dealer wants to black ball me, it's not my loss. If he wants to call everyone he knows and say - don't sell to this guy - he is welcome to do so. When I walk into a shop and want to buy a $500 or $700 coin another dealer has to sell, what will he tell me? - "Im not going to sell this $700.00 coin to you because so and so says you're a bad guy"
believe it or not, there are people who operate as you described. shortsighted ones who are probably not real confident.
this thread has really gone "out there" with all the comparisons being made. the picture i have had drawn by all the various replies is someone showing up at a shop they've never been in before and waiting for customers at the door as they exit or hovering like a vulture inside when a transaction is taking place. confusing.
common sense should dictate that a quick word with the dealer is prudent, but that was covered on page one.
al h.
It is the dealer's shop that brought the customer around you at that particular time and place. Do you honestly think it is ethical and "fair" to go to that customer after the dealer says "No", offer a higher price (with the added advantage of not having to pay business overhead of course), make a purchase, give the customer your phone number/business card, etc? I certainly don't.
Edited to add:
ps. After a few deals in the parking lot, one would probably realize the sleaziness...
and realize that their place of business is attracting both buyers and sellers, and that it may profitably be turned into a flea market.
I was at a very small club show today - eight tables. I did manage to find a number of fabulous coins, and bought too many of them.
While looking over some Peace Dollars, a fellow came up to me and told me he had several sets of Peace Dollars "in his van", and I was welcome to take a look at them after I was finished. He of course did this out of earshot of the dealer.
I politely gave a non-answer, as opposed to absolutely not, just so as not to make a scene. If he had coins and no table, I figured he either didn't want the coins shown to the group at large, or he was too cheap to buy a table.
He hung around me for a while, having seen me make a pretty large purchase at another table.
He then showed the very same dealer what he claimed to be a unc Morgan in some sort of holder - very heavily toned.
The dealer told him the coin was far from UNC and showed him why. He assured the dealer that by the time "he got done with it" it would be an MS63 minimum. He continued "there is plenty you can do to these"
I could not resist the temptation to blurt out "Thanks for letting me know that I should stay as far away as possible from the coins you've got out in the van"
He kind of slithered off quietly.
If you don't have an interest in the items offered, what difference does it make what happens to it? Or, maybe you are interested at a better price. Just say that.
Why shouldn't your customer be able to purchase, maybe get a decent deal from someone other than you?
It really sounds like the bottom line is, if you can't/don't want it on your terms, no one else can have it lest they suffer your ire.
If you truly have no interest, why should it bother you if one of your customers check it out. If you allow it in your facility, you still get the credit of facilitating a transaction, and if you expect compensation, it should be known in advance. As far as I am concerned, you get compensation from me everytime you make a profit off me.
You know. maybe you should consider how many times a customer could have gone elsewhere, could have recommended someone else, is going to continue doing business with you, DIDN'T jump every other person whose "junk" you didn't want, etc. etc.
Yes a local shop is convenient, enjoyable, and many other positive things, but the attitude that your customer must only purchase through you is bogus. You should be grateful that customer doesn't directly compete with you via a local coin club, that many dealers don't even bother with. You realize how much business comes your way because of your customers?????????OR maybe, do you realize how much business could be diverted away because of your customers? Or how, about tha many times I've purchased merely for taking up time. Despite all the "considerations" I and other customers give, I have yet to meet the dealer who has considered or compensated me for sending a customer their way, or for being a loyal a frequent customer. Sure, a reasonable price for something, but nothing that has come across a a true act of "gratitude" to be recognized as such. Anyway, ... how many "customers" really hang around chasing your rejects down? What does it say about you when you are offended because your customer is willing to buy something you won't? Is your business REALLY being threatened or are you just trying to squeeze the person(s) you rejected?
No, I have never gone out the door after someone, although, I've come to know that on some of those ocassions, that person did have something I would have gladly purchased. You think the dealer felt any kind of remorse for that? But, these are just the thoughts of a collector, and I grant you that the average dealer is no different that the average person, so I expect nothing different. It's just "enlightening" if you will, to hear how adamant some of you are at the THOUGHT of a customer doing something that in the scheme of things isn't really any more harmful than NOT making a purchase from the offended dealer.
I hate it when you see my post before I can edit the spelling.
Always looking for nice type coins
my local dealer
Gibert wants the dealer to tell him if he wanted the coins at a better price, why does this dealer answer to Gilbert?
There are too many senerio's being lumper together here.
1. Guy comes in asks what I'll pay. I quote him a price. He walks, you go in parking lot and say you'll pay it. Unacceptable.
2. guy walks in and asks a price. I quote him a price, he's about to take it, you kick his shin get him in the parking lot and say you'll pay more. Unacceptable
3. I Bid on a collection the seller has no intention of selling at that time, he's getting bids. You follow him in the parking lot give him your phone number and say I'll beat the dealers offers. Unacceptable.
4. guy walks in and wants too much for his coins dealer says do you want a shot. Acceptable.
You guy don't see the bigger picture.
And franlkly there are many more scenarios. Bottom line is that is not YOUR place of business.
Joe.
...............ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Guy comes in, dealer kicks him in shin, i walk to parking lot, get in car and go to other coin shop.
Acceptable.
al h.
..........your just an idiot you make no sense your replys are garbage hey, i couldn't resist!!!
you're not even worth argueing with. like this is the first time you've gone into attack mode because someone expressed an opinion other than yours. what i find comical is that i essentially AGREE with you. go read my first post. and for kripe sake, back off the attitude some.
i feel like i'm out in the woods trapping whenever i go back and forth with you----it's that easy to bait you into an angry reply, and i know you'll always bite!!!!!!
al h.
We are not friends you condescending piece of work.
My opinion is my opinion and who are you "Lord Keets of SH*T" to say anyone has crossed a line for expressing it
Just my opinion.
But, if the dealer's response is "not interested" then that is quite a bit different than a lowball offer, and opens up a whole lot of other scenarios. That's how I interpreted the initial post in this thread.
To those who think that this is a distinction among courtesy, ethics and morality -- I think we don't need to draw such distinctions. I'm no ethicist, but I would imagine that proper ethical behavior would revolve around actions that govern the smooth functioning of a particular system. For example, lawyer's ethics are there to ensure that the legal and judicial system works for everyone, including the accused and the guilty.
In any society, small business mercantilism would suffer seriously if it were ethically ok for sniping such as described to occur. I think this goes beyond mere courtesy. I'm no lawyer, but I wouldn't be surprised if this were illegal in most jurisdictions as well. The vast majority of our laws (or at least their interpretation) is deeply rooted in the practical. Common citizens and jurists understand the meaning of fair play, and it is these people who will judge and interpret the situation.
If a sniper were camped outside a storefront business, I'm sure the cops would come if the storeowner called them. Why? Because the cops are people too, and they depend on the community to survive. And, they'd come and try to find a way to get rid of the sniper. Perhaps the municipality has strict laws against panhandling or loitering...
As for the conduct of this thread, I find myself agreeing with AJim on sentiment but certainly not on language. AJim needs not resort to aggressive verbiage simply because not everyone agrees with every viewpoint that he expresses. No matter how articulate any individual can be, no way will everyone else ever 100% agree with him.
As for NWCS, I also applaud his sentiment. He was clearly trying to analyze this matter intellectually. But, I happen to think that he's over-analyzing things... But, that's simply my opinion.
But, to those who think this is a simple matter and everyone should simply come to the same conclusion... I think those folks need to be far more open-minded. For better or worse, our democratic and free society needs to continue to make room for a wide diversity of opinion.
My 1864 2c S/M PF in full mint red...
EVP
How does one get a hater to stop hating?
I can be reached at evillageprowler@gmail.com
I will agree with you. I am a Big City Boy and can tend to be rude and crude, Its me, live with it (not just you EVP, everyone). I say what I think knowing I am going to get an AS* chewing doesn't matter. Don't ask me what I think of your new purchase If you don't want to hear what I really think.
It's good to know that you're aware that you're a negative and unpleasant person. As for agreeing with me, I can't tell you how deeply flattered I am to know that.
BTW, I live in the biggest city in the world, and I am not generally rude and crude.
EVP
How does one get a hater to stop hating?
I can be reached at evillageprowler@gmail.com
edited for poor typing skills
You live in Tokyo, EVP?
I think you mean sarcastic because my remark was meant as sarcasm. The entire message, on the other hand, was meant as condescension. In fact, whenever I acknowledge you, you may safely assume some degree of condescension.
As for not being a member of your fan club, I didn't even know that one existed. Is the membership above ONE? Moreover, I don't know you well enough to want to join your fan club. And, from what little I know of you, I'd have to say that we wouldn't form a love connection.
You seem to have indicated that you're perfectly fine with your being rude and crude on the message boards. In the interests of fair play, I guess you would NOT expect others to be nice to you in return. Perhaps you will reap plenty of what you've sown.
EVP
How does one get a hater to stop hating?
I can be reached at evillageprowler@gmail.com
Ok, I forgot about Tokyo. That's a mighty big city regardless of its being #1 or #2 in size or population. But, the folks there tend to be very polite.
EVP
How does one get a hater to stop hating?
I can be reached at evillageprowler@gmail.com
Allow me to clarify, as I see this arguement has been redefined:
If the dealer flat out passes, I see no problem asking to see the merchandise. I would not go out and follow the guy, because, it's not my style. I would broach the question in the shop, in front of the dealer. To follow teh guy out gives the appearance of doing something underhanded and sneaky.
If the guy offers it at a price, and the dealer passes BASED ON PRICE, as opposed to the dealer offering a price and the guy saying he wants more, I would also pass.
The original comments which started this whole mess were "Guy walks in, offers stuff for sale, dealer says no thanks" In that scenario I have no problem blurting right out that I would like to see the stuff if I suspect there is something of interest to me.
Hopefully this elevates my status from scum sucking bottom feeder to just plain bottom feeding low life.
Lofty goals, Frank!
EVP
How does one get a hater to stop hating?
I can be reached at evillageprowler@gmail.com
> would be interested???????????? If a dealer is not interested, then he has no right to say anything.
Yep, that's how I think about it. If the dealer said he wan't interested and I was I would
say to the dealer right then, "You're not interested?" This would let him know that if he confirms
his disinterest I'm going to talk to the seller.
> Same with those folks who drive drunk and smash into another car
Truthteller,
You're insane, why don't you compare these people to Hitler so we can end this thread?
> But, in the cases where I go in, and for whatever reason, elect to pass on that particular job, I couldn't care less
> who comes in with a lower bid, because as I've already stated, I'm not interested
HELLO! This seems obvious to me. If the dealers uses "I'm not interested" as a negotiating
tactic to get a better price then he is the one I see as unethical.
> Going after a dealer's potential FUTURE customer is definately unethical and downright sleazy in my book
Who's going after the dealer's future customers. This example said nothing about giving out your phone
number and telling him and all this friends to always call you first for the best price.
> Do you honestly think it is ethical and "fair" to go to that customer after the dealer says "No", offer a higher price
Who's offering a HIGHER price? I'm offering A price. The dealer said he didn't want it.
I have a funny story about this actually. When I started collecting I went to a coin store with
my best friend. He had some 40% silver Kennedy halves he wanted to get a price on. The dealer
low-balled him and I thought my friend would reject it (and I was thinking as soon as we got in
the parking lot that I would tell him I would pay more) but he accept the dealer's offer. I bit my
tongue and let the transaction happen. If the dealer said he wasn't interested however...
And of course on the show floor everything is game.
-KHayse
thanks for sharing a personal experience instead of stopping short with examples based on supposition such as "K-Mart" and "the traveling salesman" which may have a good intention but don't offer much in the way of a real life situation. it seems from your example and from mine on the first page that the far flung idea of "ambulance-chasing-a-la-coin-shop" probably doesn't happen very often. indeed, the originator of the thread stopped short of that type of action and sought advice. i guess that means for most of us, it doesn't seem like the thing to do.
in the movie "Jerry McGuire" there's a line about good manners which could be aptly applied here. when in doubt ask-----that's what i do and it's a good way to learn.
does anyone else have an example that really happened similar to the topic question, no matter what the outcome?? i think these would be more valuable than what the last 3-4 pages have offered.
al h.
So Keets, unless you own a coin shop, it's not possible to see the side of this story from a business owner's perspective and you shouldn't try to contribute to the topic?
not my point by any stretch. what i was trying to say is that personal experience bears more weight because it actually happened. imagined comparisons, no matter how closely matched, just aren't the equal of the real thing.
have ever had an experience such as what the the thread originator encountered? it would be good to hear it.
al h.
<< <i>As for NWCS, I also applaud his sentiment. He was clearly trying to analyze this matter intellectually. But, I happen to think that he's over-analyzing things... But, that's simply my opinion >>
It's what I do best.
To me, the situation was a casual encounter (and not a systematic strategy) where the seller of coins goes into the store and the dealer doesn't want to buy them (and makes it clear), so my discussion was on the issue of the casual store customer talking to the seller of coins who could not complete a sale.
Anyway, I think this topic has run its course and it's time to let it go.
Neil
OK, fair enough. I was sitting in a coin shop that was new to me when a lady came in asking the owner if he wanted to buy "some silver." Turns out it was jewelry instead of coins, and he told her he wasn't interested. She asked him if he could give her "anything" at all for it (I think she really needed the money.) He, again declined. I didn't say anything and actually couldn't have cared less because I was looking for buffalo nickels!
True story, and related (I guess) but not as relevant as the traveling salesman, IMHO.
.......and a good story it was. i really believe that the overwhelming majority of us here are close to one mind on this whole thing. all the ambulance chaser replies are alarmist. though there probably are incidents of that nature, i'd bet they are few and far between. that's why it's called common sense.
al h.