eBay auction: $20.00 for the counterfeit 1804 $, Hundreds of $$'s for the "story".

braddick

These replicas generally sell for $20.00 or so. Here's your chance to buy the counterfeit, but you'll pay a few extra hundred for the "story" this seller is adding with the 1804 Copy.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1376311266

dbldie55

He is claiming this to be a Type III restrike, not a fake.

Russ

I don't see where he says it's a counterfeit. But then, I don't know anything about these. Are there parts in that description that tell us that? "Restrike" maybe?

Russ, NCNE

dbldie55

None of the 1804's were made in 1804. They were minted in the 1830's. Because of the popularity, the mint (or people at the mint) started to make restrikes in the 1850's (the type II, of which the only one is in the Smithsonian, and Type III an example that was graded PCGS XF45 and now PCGS AU58 the Flannagan coin). The last type 3 sold for nearly $1,000,000. I am "sure" this is one!

It sounds like he is claiming this to be one of the Type III restrikes. There is a book about these (have it in front of me), and many auction catalogs with the sales (have the Eliasberg in front of me, and 3 or 4 others on my shelves). I have a "fake" that does not say copy, it is pretty neat (not silver though).

TWQG

I have a counterfeit merc that I wish could talk.

goyankeez

If this is a type III, shouldn't it be slabbed and authenticated. There's 8 days left, what will the final price be on this coin.

Conder101

The scans clearly show that this piece has a reeded edge All of the restrikes except the unique Class II piece in the Smithsonian have lettered edges. Modern fake.

braddick

<< <i>The scans clearly show that this piece has a reeded edge All of the restrikes except the unique Class II piece in the Smithsonian have lettered edges. Modern fake. >>



Yep. That's the "cool" part. $20.00 or so for the Fake coin (reeded edge and all!) and $360.00 (right now) for the bedtime story that accompanies the auction.

dorkkarl

there are die-struck copies of the 1804 dollar struck decades ago for museums, and they are bona-fide collectibles. heritage sold one about a year ago w/ provenance - valued at about $10,000. however, the 1 in that auction is NOT such a coin.

K s

lordmarcovan

Idiocy. They never learn, do they? I wish I had a dollar (a plain old paper one) for every time somebody came to the eBay chatboards to ask about their "1804 dollar". And every time they refused to believe the truth when they got it, straight up with no sugarcoating.

I'll never understand what all the hoopla is about even the $1M+ "originals", all of which are "restrikes" to my eye. Except for the association of one with the King of Siam proof set, they really don't impress me much. All pricing aside, I would rather have a Mint State "original" piece from the 1790's, maybe a nice Small Eagle or Flowing Hair coin.

If I claimed that the paint-by-numbers sunflower picture I find at a flea market is a Van Gogh, there would be at least a handful of morons that would bid on it as if it were an original. In fact, I could claim to have the Mona Lisa (there are plenty of copies of that)- even the fact that that the real one is in the Louvre wouldn't stop some dweeb from bidding a coupla hundred bucks. I could shout in all caps:

"THIS IS THE ORIGINAL STUDY THAT DA VINCI USED FOR HIS FAMOUS PAINTING OF THE MONA LISA. HE USED IT FOR PRACTICE TO GET THE COLORS RIGHT. THIS WAS PAINTED BEFORE THE ONE THAT IS IN THE LOUVRE. I WILL OFFER A CERTIFICATE OF AUTHENTICITY SIGNED BY THE FLEA MARKET DEALER I BOUGHT IT FROM."

And I would get at least a few bidders. I might even get $100-500 for my $2 flea market knockoff, just because some cretin is willing to take a long shot. What P. T. Barnum said is true: there is one born every minute.

I've seen that seller around before.

UncleJoe

Doesn't the Certificate of Authenticity resolve everything? All those CC "Morgans" come with one and they seem to be doing just fine!!!

Joe.

BillJones

This "coin" is a pure fabrication. Just look at the date! It's nothing like any of the 1804 dollars. The "4" is crooked and was punched in crudely. It's just a crude conversation piece that's worth less than $50. Why not buy a Gallery Mint copy for less? It will look better.

If I were the seller, I'd be ashamed to offer something like this with a trumped up story. But consider the source. It's Ebay were "buyer beware" should be a motto emblazened at the top of every page.

dorkkarl

agreed w/ lord marcovan. an 1794 dollar in true, original unc is worth way more to me than any 1804, which is a bogus coin to begin with. in fact, if someone gave me a $1M 1804, i would immedately sell it and use the proceeds to buy as many real bust dollars as i could find.

K S

nwcs

But I'd take both an 1804 and any MS 1700s dollar coin. But I would really like the first year issue dollar in MS. *THAT* would be a coin that would cause any collector to drooooooool!

jhar

I concur with Bill Jones. The date should curve slightly with the edge of the coin. The date on this "coin" is almost straight across. A sure sign of a fake. Besides the fact that this is supposidly an undocumented 1804 Silver Dollar!!!!




HA HA I said Concur!!!!

Russ

Okay, now I understand. This guy is selling a bogus coin, and deliberately trying to pass it off as genuine by including the story about how the real coins came about. Not sure, but I think that makes him a fraud and a thief.

Russ, NCNE

lathmach

Hard to believe what this piece of junk is up to. The high bidder sells a lot on Ebay, so this won't be the last we see of this.
I wonder what his storyline will be when he sells it ?

Ray

braddick

Here's the same "coin" but discounted (without the story!):
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1376689577

lordmarcovan

HERE is what we always showed the dummies who asked about their 1804 dollars on the eBay chatboard. Of course, it only covers the really poor fakes.

Conder101

And here is an interesting site that shows many different styles of counterfeit bust dollars including one from the same mold/dies as the 1804 in the auction except that it is dated 1803. (Placement of the lettering and dateis the same on botht the 1803 and the 1804.) Counterfeit bust dollars The other pages of the site are interesting too.

ScarsdaleCoin

I can not in good faith let this auction go on and not report it...I filed with ebay to see if they wish to do something on it...I have people getting ripped like this! Jon

BlueCole

Just seeing the caps makes me want to not bid. . . .it makes me feel like i'm at a used coin lot, with a guy in polyester and muttonchops . . .. .

B.

Russ

I see the current high bidder (0 rating) is loved by at least one seller:



<< <i>This Dirty DEADBEAT DOG is a Discrace to Ebay and Humanity, GET EM OUTTA HERE! >>



Shill?

Russ, NCNE

Russ

Seller ended the auction early. Another potential ripoff averted.

Russ, NCNE