Why are there pedigrees?

DesertLizard

Why are there "pedigree" coins? Do it really matter a coin was in the collection of Joe Blow of Bumpass, AK?

I suspect it is a marketing ploy from PCGS. I prefer my coins w/o someone else's name on them! Afterall they belong to me now.

airplanenut

They are just marketing ploys.. but not only by PCGS... NGC just did a huge Binion deal... sold coins WELL over their retail for a slab that said Binion on it...

steventheyn

I think some coins should be pedigreed like Bass, Eliasburg, Garrett, I think it would be cool to own a coin that famous collectors owned. But I also agree that sometimes they overdue it.

andy007

Also to signify previous ownership from a world class collection, such as Eliasberg, Bass, Benson, Pittman, and so on. Not trying to take up for all the stupid pedigrees that are out there that shouldn't be(and there are many IMO) but I think it's neat to know that a particular coin came from a famous collection. Now whether or not a premium should be based on this fact is in itself another subject.

ARCO

Perhaps because certain collectors rose head and shoulders above their numismatic peers enough to deserve adulation (at least in the minds of some).

If the Late David Lawrence had a primo Barber quarter, half or dime set auctioned off at his death, I am sure every hardcore Barber Collector would clamor for one of them to add to their collection. If Dave Lawrence felt after 30 years of being a barber specialist that it was the nicest he had come across for his set, it probably is one of the nicest in existance.

Certain collectors set standards in quality, original and choice pieces so consistently that the name adds marketing weight to the coin.
Marketing = money = beachside cottage = Oh you get the picture

I am still trying to gain some respect from my peers so that when my post 1930 VG Lincoln cent set is auctioned off I will realize stellar prices

Tyler

Blade

OK, let me throw my 2 cents in here. I think it is crazy to pedigree the top 5 sets in each of the PCGS registries. Think about how many different categories are out there. Also, how many times have we seen a new set pop up in the top 5? Pedigree for all time best ever sets makes sense. I'm talking multi-million dollar, not-to-ne contested, built over 30+ years kind of sets. I'm not sure PCGS's idea of pedigree cuts it.

Whew. That is the first critical note I have written. I hope I'm not straying into the dark corners of the forum here.

dorkkarl

pedigrees used to mean something, BEFORE they became commercialized by plastic companiues (not just pcgs either). the big ones, like eliasberg, garrett, etc still mean something, but when they starting putting crapp like "billy bob's" on them, it went downhill in a hurry.

K S

BillJones

Pedigrees are important for very rare coins (1804 Dollars, 1913 Liberty nickels etc), the finest known examples of early coin die varieties and the finest known examples of very rare die varieties. By maintaining those pedigrees researchers can trace the location of specific coins, keep up with how many are known and what the grades are for the finest known pieces. It’s also fun if you are collector to own some of these famous pieces, and it often enhances the price you will get for them when it comes time to sell.

I agree with those who say that pedigrees for fairly common and ordinary coins are rather foolish. It really doesn’t thrill me to know that Eliasberg owned a specific 1883 no cents nickel in MS-64. So what? I won’t pay a premium for that, but some collectors will pay one. It also dilutes the value of the concept when so many auctioned collections are marketed as “name” or pedigreed accumulations of some importance. After a while I think many collectors are going to say, “Who cares?”

Bustman

I have to agree with pretty much everyone else that a pedigree of someone truly significant to numismatics ( Eliasberg, Bass, Childs, etc.) is a wonderful thing. The only Pedigree of late that I thought was warranted is the Benson Pedigree. I own a few Eliasbergs, a Bass, and even a few Benson coins........they are beautiful coins to be treasured even without the pedigree, but I sure like knowing I own a few peices that some of the greatest collectors EVER had chosen for their cabinet. BUT, I would never buy the coin for the Pedigree alone....... the coin still has to be a correctly graded stunner!!

RLinn

<< <i>I am still trying to gain some respect from my peers so that when my post 1930 VG Lincoln cent set is auctioned off I will realize stellar prices >>



Hmmmmmmmm..........from "the ARCO Collection" Yopu know, it does have a VG ring to it.

Rotts

Egos...Thats all......My collection is as good or not better than those people,says me,lol....rotts

zenny

in many cases i believe it is justified as a historical link, as well as a tribute to a master collector.

one thing about pedigrees that i am watchful of, however, is that a piece could have been graded generously for a particular collector (or big $ submitter). i think it is probably less of a problem for something in an earlier generation slab, but, for instance, when something says "Mike Casper" on it i am wary that he could have submitted the dang thing upward of 10 times to get the number he wanted on that piece of plastic and pcgs did it just so they wouldn't have to look at the thing one more time. (this is just information i have gleaned from his ebay ms67 morgan auctions where he mentions the numerous failed attempts at upgrades to what was viewed as the rightful ms68 grade that have been made on the coins for sale, it is not meant as a personal slam. i am sure there are other dealers/collectors who make repeated upgrade attempts with the same coins.)

i guess i'm just saying they can be viewed as a double-edged sword.

shirohniichan

Pedigrees are important for very rare coins (1804 Dollars, 1913 Liberty nickels etc), the finest known examples of early coin die varieties and the finest known examples of very rare die varieties. By maintaining those pedigrees researchers can trace the location of specific coins, keep up with how many are known and what the grades are for the finest known pieces. It’s also fun if you are collector to own some of these famous pieces, and it often enhances the price you will get for them when it comes time to sell.

I agree with most of what Bill wrote. However, for even somewhat common coins in my collection I'd like to be able to trace them. If I have a $500 coin, I'd like to be able to trace it through past auctions and sales to see how it was described, graded, and priced in the past. It's interesting to see how much the hobby has changed. In a really old catalog it may have been called "very fine," but now it's "solid AU."

kieferscoins

My set is in the #5 set of the CNS Type set right now Link. A few of the coins are nice, but most are average with a few ones that have to be upgraded. I have a long way to go, and don't plan on pedigreeing my set till it has better coins and is more complete. A G-06 seated half with arrows in a "Kiefer" pedigree slab would be worthless to everyone except me and maybe Braddick for his worst know set (pedigree worst known??? funny idea). I plan on waiting a year to upgrade and add more coins before even thinking about having my name upon a set that I would feel funny showing to dedicated numismatists. My pedigree opinion.

Cameron Kiefer

Bear

Probably no one will really care about a pedigree named after Joe Schmoe. That name , however could be important to Mr Schmoes family if the collection is left to the estate. Also, every collector puts a great deal of effort and love into a collection, and if it gives Mr Schmoe a bit of pleasure and status in his own heart ,then what is the harm. I say hail to the Joe Schmoe Collection, long may it remain intact. Bear

shylock

pedigrees used to mean something, BEFORE they became commercialized by plastic companiues (not just pcgs either

That basically sums it up. For copper collectors there's also the comfort factor of knowing the coin isn't about to turn back into a pumpkin.

CalGold

Ditto to what has been said. One negative to the new attributions on slabs is that you will have to pay the $5 resholdering fee to get Joe Blow's name removed from your coin's holder.

Flash

My 20th Century type set is eligible for pedigree but, like Keifer's set, it doesn't contain any coins that are spectacular. As a matter of fact, it contains a few that aren't really worth much, like an AU53 Ty1 SLQ (woopeeee!). I have been planning on having the set pedigreed just because I think it would be cool to have my name on the slabs, but just lately I'm having second thoughts. The only person to whom the pedigree would mean anything is me.. and I already own the coins! To pedigree, or not to pedigree? That is the question.

dpoole

I went ahead and pedigreed my Washington MS and Franklin MS Registry Sets when they rose (temporarily) to the top five, simply because the idea was new, was available, was cheap, and I could (kind of like upgrading software).

I haven't really seen the advantage of the move since, on any level (and so haven't pedigreed other sets I have, and that actually are of better quality). There's no real emotional advantage that I can report because I pedigreed those two sets (in fact, it's a little embarrassing to have some of the weaker coins in the set have my name on them), and certainly no economic advantage to me to sell those coins with my "Joe Schmoe" name on the slab. It doesn't help a whole lot with the "tracking," either, if somebody reholders it (as they eventually are likely to do).

So, in answer to the question of why there are pedigrees for the Joe Schmoes of the world, I don't really know!