Toning on Morgan reverse question

Luvdawgs · August 12, 2002 12:34PM

Received a gorgeous Morgan (see attachment) from a trade from mrpaseo (have his permission to metion that

) . My question is, even though my scan isn't that great, can you tell me if this toning is real or AT? If it is real, what type of toning do you think it is? Thanks

Susan

Dog97 · August 12, 2002 12:39PM

How bout a obv pict & I can tell you more.

Luvdawgs · August 12, 2002 12:45PM

Obverse

Dog97 · August 12, 2002 1:00PM

It looks like somebody had it in an envelope on their windowsill and forgot to flip it. I have one almost identical even with a brilliant obv and I don't think it would pass muster at PCGS.

Luvdawgs · August 12, 2002 1:03PM

Thanks for your valued opinion, Dog

FlyTooHigh · August 12, 2002 3:08PM

Susan: I think it looks like natural toning. On most all of the toned Morgans, only one side gets toned as they have been laying around for long periods of time in a bag or .....(who knows?). Look at the bag-toned ones. One side only. I reviewed the AT video and don't see evidence of AT here. My opinion. You need more opinions. The scan doesn't tell it all.

Tony

morganbarber · August 12, 2002 7:23PM

For what it's worth, the toning looks real to me.

IrishMike · August 12, 2002 8:25PM

Susan, and I qualify this, because I dislike voicing opinions based on a scan, I have sold several Morgans like yours that were slabbed by either NGC or PCGS. It's very common to see only toning on the reverse. Since collectors prefer toned obverses, it would not make a lot of economical sense to AT the reverse only. The colors also look like a Morgan that has toned over time. I certainly don't qualify as an expert, but it compares nicely to those that I have seen slabbed and that is about the only guideline that I truly trust.

FC57Coins · August 12, 2002 8:55PM

I agree with the above comments except for Dog (sorry Dog - first time for everything) I've seen several morgans that look very much like yours. Another explanation that I've heard is that the side that has the toning was the side exposed to the bag when the coin resided in a bank bag.

Regards,

Frank

mrpaseo · August 12, 2002 10:28PM

Susan, Please let me chime in for a moment. This Morgan was pulled from a 2X2 box on the coin shops shelf. The two owners of the coin shop are oblivious to the value of toned coins. When I mentioned "I'll take this one, it's kind of pretty" he said something like "Really?" with a cringed up face. I bet he had more in there but I was in a bit of a rush to get back to school. If this coin was AT, it was not done by these guys. I purchased a few Rossies that were toned for another fellow and they too were pulled from the boxes. (Meaning, the owners were not trying to capitalize on the tones).

It looks to me like there may be a bit of textile toning on the Eagles wing, then again it could be a mild finger print. I'm not sure. If I still had it, I would try to slab it and see what the experts say.

Just my opinion, and than you all for the info,
Ray

Luvdawgs · August 12, 2002 11:10PM

Thanks for all of your opinions, everyone. I may try to get it slabbed when I get the time

Susan

CalGold · August 13, 2002 12:40AM

Looks like either album toning or toning from storage in a kraft envelope. This is a common date dollar and I do not believe that this kind of toning adds a lot of value to a Morgan, though I would like to hear other opinions on that. I would not pay to have it slabbed, unless you plan to sell it. Just put it in an airtite.

Dog97 · August 13, 2002 9:31AM

Ok, so you guys that say it's natural; where are you drawing the line between natural/AT? If you are saying it's natural because it was in a kraft envelope or album you may very well be right, I'll go with kraft myself. But I don't think you could get it into a PCGS slab therefore you can call it AT and may very well be right. Maybe it's natural AT. heehe
I bet you could get it into an ICG slab no problem, they seem to like that kind of blue. Maybe into an NGC slab, but not into a PCGS slab. The blue is too dark bluegreen to be traditional bag tone and you know PCGS is conservative as heck and the least little doubt is reason for an NG. Again, where do you draw the line?
This all leads back to IrishMike's quote: "it would not make a lot of economical sense to AT the reverse only." It probably wasn't done for economical reasons, probably no reason at all other than a place to store it.
You're gonna have to slab it now Luvdawgs. Inquiring minds want to know............

IrishMike · August 13, 2002 9:37AM

Hey Dog97 you might be interested in this little ditty I picked up from a dealer Saturday. He had a proof Franklin that he laid on his dresser in an envelope, he didn't know that his wife had just polished it with Old English. A couple of weeks later he spotted the coin, took it out of its envelope and it had devolped some nice rainbow toning, my question is, would the services consider it polished?

Bear · August 13, 2002 9:40AM

Remember children, It doesnt pay to argue with the big doggie, thats how you get your assets bitten. Bear

Dog97 · August 13, 2002 10:17AM

Nobody is arguing. Nobody knows where the line is between real & AT. Back in the goodle days you could say that's a ms65, that one is an AU, that one is AT etc. Now days you have to say that's a ms 66 by NGC standards, ms65 by PCGS. That one is an AU at NGC but PCGS will market grade it ms63. PCGS will say AT, NGC will slab it as real. ANACS will call it Questionable Toning. ACG will label it ms67 rainbow tone. Aint nuthin simple no more!

Bear · August 13, 2002 10:25AM

Dog 97 - All these standards are giving me a big headache. I think I will eat some pine cones and get a big drink of water. Bear

Nic · August 13, 2002 10:36AM

The coin is not AT. It will slab at any service. People who prefer white seem to slam anything. They would dip it and then feel at ease. You can only conserve them so many times. K

Elcontador · August 13, 2002 10:40AM

I have a slabbed Morgan with a cobalt blue slash on the reverse near the rim. That color is common in the toned Morgans that I've seen, and you typically see it near / around the coin's rim. I've seen some Morgans with a golden tone turning into the cobalt blue as you get closer to its rim & maybe even a reddish color going to cobalt. However, the blue-green looks a bit peculiar, though.

Dog97 · August 13, 2002 10:42AM

So who's slamming it Nic?

Russ · August 13, 2002 11:03AM

<< <i>The coin is not AT. It will slab at any service. >>

The fact that a coin is not AT does not guarantee it will get slabbed. I had a 1964 proof Kennedy body bagged that I pulled from a proof set myself. Nothing AT about it, but PCGS NG'd it for questionable color. When I sent it back and asked for a second look they came back with, "uh, well, we should have said environmental damage."

Russ, NCNE

Nic · August 13, 2002 11:45AM

Sorry I touched a nerve Russ. Please notice you quoted two different sentences. Thanks for starting a new topic?? K

Dog97 · August 13, 2002 11:53AM

So who's slamming it? Talk about starting new topics!

Russ · August 13, 2002 11:54AM

Nic,

You didn't touch any nerve. I simply corrected your fallacious statement.

Russ, NCNE

Nic · August 13, 2002 12:21PM

Russ,
Thanks, but I did not try to imply or state all coins not AT would slab. I apologize for the "flame" sound of my last post. Based on the pic, do you feel this won't slab? Why? K

Toning on Morgan reverse question

Comments

Leave a Comment