$1 1796 Large Date Small Letter (BB-65) - Reverse Die Chip Growth

lilolme

$1 1796 Large Date Small Letter (BB-65) - Reverse Die Chip and Die Rotation

I noticed this die chip on my $1 1796 (before I got it) and kind of wondered about it. This might be in one of the early dollar books but since I don't have any I decided to check out the reverse die chip. I checked Heritage auction archives (and looked at coinfacts) to check the die chip variance. I thought the search was at least a little interesting and so here it is.

I did not find an example without a small die chip between the letters I and C on the reverse. However, there might be one out there. Also there could have been some but they didn't survive to today. Or maybe these started with a die chip. Also there are some issues with the letter E and then some of the photos will show the small chips or pitting in the field and as the die chip grows this area also shows more issues. I am thinking this die metal was not properly 'made'.

I found that the die chip grows but also the rotation of the reverse die changes with it to some degree (two different things). The small die chips have more CCW rotation of the reverse die and then the dies are aligned for the larger chips. I did spot check that the obverse was properly aligned in the holder (one I note as slightly CW rotated obverse in the holder). I showed the reverse holder below to show the rotation. The Heritage link to the auction lot is provided for each.

First this is the Heritage sort that I used.

https://coins.ha.com/c/search/results.zx?term=BB-65&si=2&dept=1909&archive_state=5327&sold_status=1526~1524&coin_category=3838&us_coin_year=~~1796t1796&sb=5&mode=archive&page=50~1&layout=list

The first two are the small die chip (between I and C) and note the letter E. The amount of reverse die rotation is about the most that I found.
Note: there are some with a similar small die chip but the lump like area below (inward) is not as defined (photo thing or not).

https://coins.ha.com/itm/early-dollars/1796-1-large-date-small-letters-cleaned-anacs-xf45-details-pcgs-6861-/a/442-1151.s?ic4=ListView-Thumbnail-071515#

Slight chip growth.
Note: The obverse of this coin is rotated slightly CW in the holder.

https://coins.ha.com/itm/early-dollars/1796-1-large-date-small-letters-b-5-bb-65-r2-vf30-pcgs-pcgs-40002-/a/1272-3955.s?ic4=ListView-Thumbnail-071515#

The die chip has grown in length inwards. The letter E and rotation appear about the same.

https://coins.ha.com/itm/early-dollars/1796-1-large-date-small-letters-b-5-bb-65-r2-xf40-pcgs-pcgs-40002-/a/1271-3824.s?ic4=ListView-Thumbnail-071515#

The die chip is wider and touching the letter I. The letter E and surrounding area is messed up a little bit more. The reverse die rotation had gone down.

https://coins.ha.com/itm/early-dollars/1796-1-large-date-small-letters-b-5-bb-65-r2-reverse-repaired-ngc-details-xf-pcgs-40002-/a/1371-3610.s?ic4=ListView-Thumbnail-071515#

The chip had grown some more with additional contact with the letter I. Letter E and field area a little more messy. The reverse die rotation is now essentially gone but slightly rotated.

https://coins.ha.com/itm/early-dollars/1796-1-large-date-small-letters-b-5-bb-65-r2-xf45-pcgs-pcgs-40002-/a/1373-3047.s?ic4=ListView-Thumbnail-071515#

More die chip growth but a 'bar' connecting to the letter C is present. No die rotation.
Note: For the remaining larger die chips I did not see any die rotation and therefore did not include the reverse holder photo.

https://coins.ha.com/itm/early-dollars/1796-1-large-date-small-letters-b-5-bb-65-r2-vf35-pcgs-bowers-die-state-iii-the-diagnostic-die-lump-between-i-and-c-of-america/a/60338-53271.s?ic4=ListView-Thumbnail-071515#

The 'bar' to the letter C has grown and just part of the larger chip. Letter E and surroundings also has more stuff / deterioration. (no die rotation)

https://coins.ha.com/itm/early-dollars/1796-1-large-date-small-letters-b-5-bb-65-r2-xf40-pcgs-cac-pcgs-40002-/a/1347-3126.s?ic4=ListView-Thumbnail-071515#

This is about the largest chip that I found. Did not find one that overlapped the letter C (like it does for the letter I) or that connected to the rim. Letter E and surrounding area has some more deterioration. (no die rotation)

https://coins.ha.com/itm/early-dollars/1796-1-large-date-small-letters-b-5-bb-65-r2-vf20-pcgs-pcgs-40002-/a/1316-3557.s?ic4=ListView-Thumbnail-071515#

RobertScotLover

Why wouldn't that be considered an internal cud?

lilolme

@RobertScotLover said:
Why wouldn't that be considered an internal cud?

I am not an error wizard but I am not familiar with an internal cud terminology.. I might do some checking and see if I can find it.

I called the above a die chip. Perhaps too large for a chip and is a die break or a die gouge? - does that depend on how it was created? (enlarged chipping, cracking versus impact). This one is clearly growing from striking. Also not sure when a die chip might become a die break (or gouge). Another one I might do some checking on.

The CUD is a die break that starts at the rim and ends at the rim (rim to rim ).
Don't know if there is a size limit to a CUD - if it is a really small die chip but rim to rim, is it still a CUD? Example: just removes part of a dentil at the edge.

I found one answer fairly quickly - It is a CUD if it extends into the design of the coin including the dentils and field. If it is only on the rim (not into dentils or field) then it is not a CUD and a rim die break. At least that was one definition.

yosclimber

Some people use the terminology "internal cud" for large die chips that join letters, etc. but do not reach the rim.
Either way, they are interesting.

carabonnair

Thanks for sharing your research - really interesting.