1885-O Morgan VAM question "Belly Button"?
Rollerman
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I've had this 1885-O Morgan for many years (40 or more) and always just thought it was a "Belly Button" Morgan, but I can't seem to find it in my big Morgan/Peace book and nor with the online version (unless I was doing something wrong?). Can anyone shed any light on this? I hope I got the image to take.
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Louis Armstrong
Louis Armstrong
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Louis Armstrong
That's a big belly button.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
LOL It runs in the family!
Louis Armstrong
"Mint State grades: The 1885-O is the most common of all New Orleans Mint silver dollars in Uncirculated grade and among certified coins from this mint is the most common issue at levels from MS-63 through MS-65. It is believed that 2.5 to 3.5 million exist at the MS-60 to 62 level, a staggering quantity. In MS-63 grade, the estimated population is 800,000 to 1,300,000, followed by 400,000 to 600,000 in MS-64, and 100,000 to 175,000 MS-65 or better coins."
"The strike of 1885-O dollars is average. Examples are seen weakly defined at the centers, while others are sharply struck. Certain flatly-struck coins have what Wayne Miller called a "belly button" or a recessed or dimpled area in the lowest portion of the eagle's breast, due to metal not filling the deepest portion of the die. Cherry-picking is easy to do for this issue and is advised."
Q David Bowers,
Silver Dollars & Trade Dollars of the United States: A Complete Encyclopedia" (Wolfeboro, NH: Bowers and Merena Galleries, Inc., 1993)
https://www.pcgs.com/coinfacts/coin/1885-o-1/7162
Had not heard of this one. I would have thought it was some type of struck through (which can vary as striking continues) but the information say Not. I found several of them in past auction listings or similar but no other information other than the VAM world.
Should verify it is VAM24 (I can only see that the O mint mark is about the correct position).
From the VAM world for VAM 24:
http://www.vamworld.com/wiki/1885-O_VAM-24
Following the links - The picture page for the belly button:
http://www.vamworld.com/wiki/File:1885_O_VAM-24_BellyButton.jpg
And the Belly button page:
http://www.vamworld.com/wiki/Belly_Button_Striking_Error
And following the links the thread with Notes and a screenshot of the applicable VAM24 notes:
http://www.vamworld.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=342&p=4024#p4024
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RLJ 1958 - 2023
Excellent info gentlemen and thank you both. I'm not sure why I was unable to run across it myself, but will try it again and see if I end up in the right places as you have.
Louis Armstrong
Here is my belly button eagle. I didn’t know it was a thing till I found this. Figured it was a strike thru
it's nicely colored, too
Interesting this thread resurfaced today. Some of us were looking into this variety, and that die crack from the left star to above the U is always there. Clearly something went rather wonky when they had this specific set of dies in the press.
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Very cool!
Student of numismatics and collector of Morgan dollars
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That is a great catch same die crack!
That is a huge belly button!
I’m back with another! This one actually has scratch marks like they were trying to remove the die chip
Not an expert, but to me it almost looks like the chest/belly area reveals remaining planchet roller marks or adjustment marks due to the lack of sufficient metal flow / strike error for this year?
At the risk of reviving an ancient debate, it makes no sense that the “belly button” was caused by insanely localized low striking pressure. Why did this not happen on any of the hundreds of millions of Morgan Dollars struck in other years and/or Mints? A strike through from something centered on the reverse die makes more sense.