When does a modern coin become a classic coin
HalfDime
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I looked up what AI thinks of classic vs modern coins, as this is the definition it came up with.:
The transition from a modern coin to a classic coin is not strictly defined and has shifted over time. Generally, coins are considered "modern" for several decades after their minting before potentially being classified as "classic." Here are some key points about this transition:
The definition of "modern" coins has changed over the years:
In the 1960s, coins minted after 1934 were considered modern.
By the 1970s, the cutoff had moved to 1950.
In the 1980s, coins minted after 1965 were often considered modern.
Currently, many numismatists consider coins minted after 1964 or 1971 as modern.
Some specific years that have been used to differentiate modern from classic coins include:
1965: Marking the removal of silver from most circulating U.S. coins.
1971: The final year of any silver in circulating U.S. coins.
1986: The introduction of American Eagle silver and gold coins.
The transition to "classic" status can depend on factors such as:
Age: As coins become older, they may gradually be viewed as classics.
Historical significance: Coins associated with important events or changes in minting practices may become classics sooner.
Rarity or unique features: Some modern coins with special characteristics may be considered classics earlier.
Some modern coins are already becoming recognized as future classics, such as:
The Proof 1990-S Lincoln, No S cent
The Reverse Proof 2006-W American Eagle gold coin
The 2000-P Sacagawea dollar/Washington quarter dollar mule error
The perception of what constitutes a "classic" coin can vary among collectors and may continue to evolve as new generations enter the hobby.
In conclusion, it generally takes several decades. The transition is gradual and influenced by factors such as age, historical significance, and numismatic interest.
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We might be evolving to where 2000 is seen by the younger generation as the cutoff date for modern vs classic coins. Many may not like that, but I am seeing this with movies, where before 2000 is now considered a classic movie. It may happen in coins for younger collectors.
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No clear answer of course. For me, a geezer, I like 1965 for $.10-$1.00, 1946 for $.05 and 1959 for $.01 as the beginning of the modern era. Could also make a case for Jeff’s, Roosies, Washington, Franklin, Ike and beyond all being modern, with 1959 being the cutoff for Lincoln.
Agree 100%
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It's not a matter of "when" it's a matter of "who".
When I started collecting buffalo nickels from pocket change in 1957 anything after 1954 was considered 'modern" and everything before was 'classic". But time stopped in 1965 because everybody hated the new coins and wrote them off as 'debased junk". They were all poorly made in huge numbers and nobody wanted anything to do with any of them. Nickel collections ended at 1964 just like every other denomination except some collectors believed 1958 was the last one cent coin.
Nothing has changed. Those collectors still collecting from that era don't collect anything from after 1965 and generally don't even consider them to be "coins". This attitude has been passed down to subsequent generations to a large extent. People don't collect later coins so no matter how scarce they are they have very nominal value.
Nothing lasts forever and young collectors today usually consider these "coins" even if they have no interest in collecting them. As such it's quite apparent that the few surviving worn out and beaten up 1965 dimes are anything but "modern". It doesn't matter if you call the rest of the mintage because they are gone and most of them have been gone for decades. 1965 dimes are old. So are 1985 cents. Even Oregon quarters are getting a little long in the tooth.
So the real question isn't when the coins are old enough. The real question is when do the youngsters take over the hobby.
The youngest baby boomers (1965) will be retiring starting in the next couple years. It can't be too long now. Since time don't fly but bounds and leaps we'll all wake up some morning and discover all moderns are classic except a few made after some arbitrary date such as, perhaps, 1999. Imagine billions upon countless billions of coins becoming old overnight!!!
I still think of clads as 'new fangled" but I bet I won't age as much when they finally get old as some people.
I think that a binary division is ludicrous. Lumping everything into the two categories is especially silly if you look at Europe. Does classic start at 1000? 1500? 1800?
Why would pine tree shillings be in the samr classification as steam press made coins?
I think this is supposed to be a fun thread, not a serious topic for analysis. But yes, one could, for example, make a case for hammered coins being classic, etc.
Don't ask me, I call Morgan dollars modern.
I collect the REAL classics
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Long after I'm dead and gone they become classic.
But why would they be in the same category as 19th century steam powered press coins? It would make more sense to put them in separate categories. I think categories based either on technology or historical period makes more sense.
Or something like that
Or maybe split modern into pre-digital and digital periods.
One day when we no longer exchange money by hand moderns will be considered classic but still referred to as moderns so never.
When I'm selling it.
Perhaps a decent yard stick is to look at mint production methods and quality. I don't know much about this subject but sometime in the 60's and 70's for example, almost all proof coins produced started coming out of the mint consistently as PR69's and PR70's. There were probably other leaps of quality and methodology before that which could be identified and used to mark another era.
http://ProofCollection.Net
I feel like classic coins are kind of like classic cars. When does something cross over into being collectible? Some stuff is just old, and thus junk, and some stuff is old (and maybe in the same condition as the junk) but is collectible due to something that gives it a “cool” factor.
Mentally, I’m probably with the pre-65 silver, etc. crowd on what comes to mind when I hear “classic” coins brought up. With that said, even though I have a nice collection of Franklins, I don’t really consider them modern or classic. They’re whatever is in between. Maybe like me they’re just middle-age.
I'm gonna leave the useless stuff to the relatives 😈
It really depends if it is a classic modern or a modern classic!
AI's definition is very slippery,"not strictly defined and has shifted" "evolving, changing, gradual recognition" Sure, nothing is black and white and this is a really great grey definition.
I've tried to define MODERN and thought 1965 began the great Modern Era with the end of circulating silver...but as with all definitions I've seen, that is just at a viewpoint of right now and will change again in the future. Already with that definition, Moderns are already spanning almost 70 years.
The harder question is what defines a CLASSIC? Surely not everything before 1965 is classic.
Perhaps we need new terminology of our coins. Any suggestions? We seem to have no problem labeling each generation of people...Baby Boomers, Generation X, Millennials, Gen Z...
Modern is any easily recognized design still in use today.
I think this is about as close to how I see it as I’ve seen posted so far.
As mentioned in his last sentence, I believe the numbers 4 and 5 can probably be further split, but this gets to the point pretty well.
I don’t like the sliding times in what is classic versus modern, it’s just confusing, but there’s probably no one answer that everyone will accept.
It takes a lot less time in the automobile industry. Who would have thought muscle cars of the late sixties and seventies would be classics , at a time when clad coinage became modern ?
I consider any design that is still being minted as modern. Therefore modern for the penny started in 1909, the nickel in 1938, the dime in 1946, quarter in 1932 and the half in 1964. It's sad when the same design/theme has outlived all but a few living individuals today for several of our coin denominations.
To me, the 2 definitions of classic US coins that make sense are:
1) ones with lady Liberty on them instead of actual people
2) 1964 and earlier because of the change to clad in 65
Both of those definitions make total sense to me, with a slight preference for definition 1 because Cents and Nickels didn’t change composition after 64 and also because I like coins more that have depictions of Liberty on them more than ones with depictions of actual people on them.
Mr_Spud
I've been researching the great pyramids (2900 BC) for so long now (20 years) even ancient coins all seem very very modern to me.
Some of my friends study anthropology and the pyramids are modern to them.
It's not only beauty in the eye of the beholder.
When they are one day older than me.
Maybe Franklins should be “mid-century modern”?
Agree with Mr Spud's #1. When they went to presidents instead of Liberty (big mistake IMO) that's when they ceased being classic. So Indian penny, Buffalo nickel (OK, not technically Liberty), Liberty quarter/half, Peace dollar.
Speaking as an outside observer, it seems to me that there is no single date cutoff, but each denomination is different. And a working rule of thumb for spotting the boundary for each denomination is easy: if it's got a dead president on it, it's "modern". If it's got some version of Liberty, it's "classic". Franklin Halves are up for debate; they could go either way, but the consensus seems to be to push them into "classic".
I agree that it's a definition that only has use and meaning in the US context. It's a peculiarly American problem, because most other countries have reformed their currency at some time in the past hundred years or so and therefore the coinage naturally divides itself into "old" and "new" epochs based on the currency unit. Example: Australia, which has "predecimal" (1910-1964) and "decimal" (1966-present) coinage.
Roman emperor Marcus Aurelius, "Meditations"
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I like consistency especially in parameters.
For me the cut off date for US is 1965 which is when clad issues came out. So 1964 and before will always be Classic US coins imo. One guy in coin club collects slabbed wash qtr 1964 and before. Another collects slabbed Franks. These can be doable, affordable sets for many.
I call US coins 1965 and after mods.
It doesn’t.
well, when I'm buying it it is modern trash mate, but when I'm
selling it, oh man its a classic coin man!
Coins other than Morgan dollars started being saved in roll quantities in the 1930’s and their mintages have also skyrocketed. At least to me the true “classics” are coins minted before that time, before the masses started collecting them.
The only clear boundary I see is with commems. Anything 1954 and earlier is classic, anything 1982 and later is modern.
Maybe Gold Eagles 1986-1991 are also classic because of the Roman numerals.
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1999 is a good cutoff date with the start of the state quarters.
More precisely you can divide the history of US coins into specific eras. 1792-1838, 1838-1933, 1934-1965, 1965-1981, 1981-1998, 1999-present
I'm one of those 1965 guys. 1965 is the end of the "classic or collectible era" for all coins except nickels. Nickels remain the only "classic" coin in terms of its metal content not being debased to below face value. Today, they're even worth more than their face value.
That said, I enjoy @cladking and other modern dealers' fascinating discussions on rare or poorly preserved dates for clad coins since 1965. Ironically, by ignoring them, we've created some scarce moderns and perhaps have helped to sustain interest in the hobby.
Edited for grammar.
@Barberian . Never really thought about it that way; as I pursue Seated dimes and quarters that were ingored by the public at the time. James
Not sure. What does a precise delineation accomplish?
Or, how about when does a classic coin become modern?
When major dealers collectors and auction houses actively seek, promote and devote more and more attention?
Either way its positive for the market when they feed new and continued interest off each other.
There shouldn’t be a fixed definition of classic versus modern because there is an element of time involved. Like an old man isn’t a baby anymore even though he used to be a baby, but to someone who is twice the age as the same old man, then the old man is young. There also shouldn’t just be one definition either for the same reason. Our modern coins will be ancient to people 10000 years from now.
Mr_Spud
I have to wonder if at this point the term “modern” in regards to US coins has become relatively fixed, i.e. it no longer really means “contemporary,” and nothing currently considered modern will ever move into the classic category.
I’m thinking for instance of modern art, which is generally considered to span the late 1800s through the 1960s or 70s. So Picasso and Warhol are both modern, but no art being produced today is modern.
Only a few individual coins could make this grade (pardon the pun)
A blanket definition doesn't work
Off the top of my head...
Lincoln 1972 DDO
The "No S" coins
Lincoln 1983 DDR
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In my fifty years of collecting, those bearing an image of a former President were considered modern while those before classic. So in my opinion, this has not changed. In time I do see these being re-classified only in a different terminology other than classic. Just my thoughts.
Given the number of times that the mint has reused the design, I'm starting to think that the Walking Liberty Half Dollar is a "classic." It certainly is an excellent design.
The transition away from having non-historical figures on our coins was the beginning of the end of the classic era. I agree that the term "modern" is always upgraded as the years have gone by. I'd like to think that the introduction of the Anthony Dollar, the Modern Commemoratives, and the bullion coins solidified the so-called Modern era, with further concrete poured in by the State Quarter program.
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