@MsMorrisine said:
when did the mint start lubricating its dies?
My coin press (Denver Mint surplus, circa 1986) has oil mist spray to lubricate the planchets as they are being fed into the coining chamber.
How in the heck do your coins come out so perfect if the planchets have oil on them?
Coins and medals can be de-greased after they are struck. In 1981 I was on a tour of the Denver Mint's Mint Set packaging room and I discovered that they were de-oiling the coins before packaging them by dipping them, in quantity, in liquid freon and then drying them by tumbling them in a hand-cranked cement mixer along with dried crushed corn cobs. The coins looked like hell, but they were oil free!!!
Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
@MsMorrisine said:
when did the mint start lubricating its dies?
My coin press (Denver Mint surplus, circa 1986) has oil mist spray to lubricate the planchets as they are being fed into the coining chamber.
How in the heck do your coins come out so perfect if the planchets have oil on them?
.
The oil misting is only for rapid automatic feeding during a large production run at high speed.
I only feed with tongs, one at a time, and no oil is involved.
@jacrispies said:
Here is one that stumps me! Is this double struck or a dramatic double profile? If a double profile, it is unique in location and displacement to my knowledge. Clear separation in the eyes and mouth demonstrate double striking qualities. Something going on at the breast line as well. A sight to see nonetheless!
How much in unrecoverable coins and currency are there in the ocean and other places that put them beyond human reach or economic advantage in doing so?
@BustDMs
I studied these photos for a long time, cannot find anything particular on the reverse.
"But seek ye first the kingdom of God and His righteousness and all these things shall be added unto you" Matthew 6:33. Young fellow suffering from Bust Half fever.
BHNC #AN-10
JRCS #1606
@jacrispies said: @BustDMs
I studied these photos for a long time, cannot find anything particular on the reverse.
Thank you.
Since the reverse does not appear to show any doubling, I think I am going to have to go with extreme machine doubling on the obverse.
TD
Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
@CaptHenway I think so too. Has to be the most radical machine doubling I've seen.
We'll consider this question answered!!
"But seek ye first the kingdom of God and His righteousness and all these things shall be added unto you" Matthew 6:33. Young fellow suffering from Bust Half fever.
BHNC #AN-10
JRCS #1606
@logger7 said:
How much in unrecoverable coins and currency are there in the ocean and other places that put them beyond human reach or economic advantage in doing so?
About tree fiddy (including that Stella that was thrown away by accident)
I’ve been staring at the obverse image for the last 10 minutes and just can not go with the “extreme double profile” strike doubling. There is “notching” in the eye area typical from a double striking. Yes, I know there is no other evidence obverse or reverse of doubling. I typically look closely for doubled dentils for confirmation but non here. So, why am I still searching for an answer? Because it just doesn’t look like ANY strike doubling I have ever seen.
My ONLY thought is that the first strike was part of an interrupted strike where the press was SOFTLY cycled maybe due to a feeding problem and they attempted to stop the press but it still lightly cycled creating a slightly off centered strike at VERY LOW PRESSURE. They then used the “spoiled” planchet to make the final product we see.
Why nothing on the reverse do you say? Well, there are numerous instances of bust halves double struck on one side only. There were two planchets fed into the press together making a pair of “one sided coins” which were then reused as planchets for the second strike. Remember, they didn’t want to spend more time and money to remelt the spoiled planchets when essentially striking bullion. Students of the series will recall that MOST of the 1827 O148 die marriages were made from “spoiled planchets” and demonstrate evidence of the earlier strikes.
Getting back to why only that portion of the coin exhibits doubling. Russ Logan did research and used an Ike dollar that was used as a press setup striking that was clearly done either from an extremely low pressure strike or an extreme setup error creating too much space between the dies. The study coin only showed a ghost outline of the front of Ike’s profile proving that was the FIRST part of the design to be imparted during striking. That is the area of first metallic displacement when the dies meet the planchet.
So, food for thought. Eat all you want. Line up and convince me otherwise.
Respectfully submitted for your thoughts.
Brad
Q: When does a collector become a numismatist?
A: The year they spend more on their library than their coin collection.
A numismatist is judged more on the content of their library than the content of their cabinet.
If it was just the nose I could see that, but the doubling on the eyebrow means that the hypothetical first strike was deep enough to raise up the part of the face containing the eyebrow, and a strike that deep should have left more of the design, including part of the incused LIBERTY. Incused lettering tends to not strike out during a second strike.
It's a weird one, and I would not bet the farm on anything I say about it, but if you accept the theory put forward by the great detective, Sherlock Holmes, "When you have eliminated everything else, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the answer," what remains is extreme machine doubling of an already raided face.
(A thought: Is the term "machine doubling" appropriate for a coin struck on a screw press? Is that a "machine?" The brain cries out for more coffee!)
Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
Comments
Coins and medals can be de-greased after they are struck. In 1981 I was on a tour of the Denver Mint's Mint Set packaging room and I discovered that they were de-oiling the coins before packaging them by dipping them, in quantity, in liquid freon and then drying them by tumbling them in a hand-cranked cement mixer along with dried crushed corn cobs. The coins looked like hell, but they were oil free!!!
.
The oil misting is only for rapid automatic feeding during a large production run at high speed.
I only feed with tongs, one at a time, and no oil is involved.
.
Can you post reverse images?
A: The year they spend more on their library than their coin collection.
A numismatist is judged more on the content of their library than the content of their cabinet.
How much in unrecoverable coins and currency are there in the ocean and other places that put them beyond human reach or economic advantage in doing so?
@BustDMs
I studied these photos for a long time, cannot find anything particular on the reverse.
"But seek ye first the kingdom of God and His righteousness and all these things shall be added unto you" Matthew 6:33. Young fellow suffering from Bust Half fever.
BHNC #AN-10
JRCS #1606
Thank you.
Since the reverse does not appear to show any doubling, I think I am going to have to go with extreme machine doubling on the obverse.
TD
@CaptHenway I think so too. Has to be the most radical machine doubling I've seen.
We'll consider this question answered!!
"But seek ye first the kingdom of God and His righteousness and all these things shall be added unto you" Matthew 6:33. Young fellow suffering from Bust Half fever.
BHNC #AN-10
JRCS #1606
https://www.autismforums.com/media/albums/acrylic-colors-by-rocco.291/
I’ve been staring at the obverse image for the last 10 minutes and just can not go with the “extreme double profile” strike doubling. There is “notching” in the eye area typical from a double striking. Yes, I know there is no other evidence obverse or reverse of doubling. I typically look closely for doubled dentils for confirmation but non here. So, why am I still searching for an answer? Because it just doesn’t look like ANY strike doubling I have ever seen.
My ONLY thought is that the first strike was part of an interrupted strike where the press was SOFTLY cycled maybe due to a feeding problem and they attempted to stop the press but it still lightly cycled creating a slightly off centered strike at VERY LOW PRESSURE. They then used the “spoiled” planchet to make the final product we see.
Why nothing on the reverse do you say? Well, there are numerous instances of bust halves double struck on one side only. There were two planchets fed into the press together making a pair of “one sided coins” which were then reused as planchets for the second strike. Remember, they didn’t want to spend more time and money to remelt the spoiled planchets when essentially striking bullion. Students of the series will recall that MOST of the 1827 O148 die marriages were made from “spoiled planchets” and demonstrate evidence of the earlier strikes.
Getting back to why only that portion of the coin exhibits doubling. Russ Logan did research and used an Ike dollar that was used as a press setup striking that was clearly done either from an extremely low pressure strike or an extreme setup error creating too much space between the dies. The study coin only showed a ghost outline of the front of Ike’s profile proving that was the FIRST part of the design to be imparted during striking. That is the area of first metallic displacement when the dies meet the planchet.
So, food for thought. Eat all you want. Line up and convince me otherwise.
Respectfully submitted for your thoughts.
Brad
A: The year they spend more on their library than their coin collection.
A numismatist is judged more on the content of their library than the content of their cabinet.
If it was just the nose I could see that, but the doubling on the eyebrow means that the hypothetical first strike was deep enough to raise up the part of the face containing the eyebrow, and a strike that deep should have left more of the design, including part of the incused LIBERTY. Incused lettering tends to not strike out during a second strike.
It's a weird one, and I would not bet the farm on anything I say about it, but if you accept the theory put forward by the great detective, Sherlock Holmes, "When you have eliminated everything else, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the answer," what remains is extreme machine doubling of an already raided face.
(A thought: Is the term "machine doubling" appropriate for a coin struck on a screw press? Is that a "machine?" The brain cries out for more coffee!)
Capt:
Of course a screw press is a machine.
I considered your point but still have reservations.
Reach for the espresso!
A: The year they spend more on their library than their coin collection.
A numismatist is judged more on the content of their library than the content of their cabinet.