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My Turn At "Guess The Grade" With A Twist

M4MadnessM4Madness Posts: 314 ✭✭✭✭

Vote for what you think it should grade, not what PCGS graded it at

My Turn At "Guess The Grade" With A Twist

This is a private poll: no-one will see what you voted for.

Comments

  • M4MadnessM4Madness Posts: 314 ✭✭✭✭

    Thanks for the votes. Please keep them coming.

  • LuxorLuxor Posts: 466 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Not enough luster remaining for an AU grade IMO.

    Your hobby is supposed to be your therapy, not the reason you need it.

  • lermishlermish Posts: 2,864 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Luxor said:
    Not enough luster remaining for an AU grade IMO.

    +1

  • M4MadnessM4Madness Posts: 314 ✭✭✭✭

    Here's a photo of the coin when it was still in the ANACS holder.

  • braddickbraddick Posts: 23,946 ✭✭✭✭✭

    The reverse is often weakly struck.
    I stated AU50- keeping in mind that is ten points away from mintstate.

    peacockcoins

  • fluffy155fluffy155 Posts: 261 ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 6, 2024 10:22AM

    I'd grade it AU50. I'm an early federal collector so maybe my standards are looser, but AU50 to me has always meant AU detail but without luster. PCGS seems to be much stricter on late 19th Century issues so I'd guess they graded it 45.

  • M4MadnessM4Madness Posts: 314 ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 6, 2024 2:44PM

    Looks like we're split about 50/50 on the votes, which doesn't ease my mind any. Lol

    PCGS graded it AU50

    My Carson City Morgan set is completely XF45 except for this coin. I cannot find an XF45 1884-CC anywhere, so I was thinking of cracking this one out and hoping it'd downgrade from 50 to 45.

    I feel that it is right on the line between the two grades.

  • alaura22alaura22 Posts: 3,159 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @M4Madness said:
    Looks like we're split about 50/50 on the votes, which doesn't ease my mind any. Lol

    PCGS graded it AU50

    My Carson City Morgan set is completely XF45 except for this coin. I cannot find an XF45 1884-CC anywhere, so I was thinking of cracking this one out and hoping it'd downgrade from 50 to 45.

    There are 31 of them out there, I would just keep looking
    I'll keep my eyes open too :)

  • M4MadnessM4Madness Posts: 314 ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 6, 2024 1:39PM

    @alaura22 said:
    There are 31 of them out there, I would just keep looking
    I'll keep my eyes open too :)

    Thanks. My research shows that these don't show up on auction sites every year. Heritage shows numerous years between the ones sold there. I missed one there back in March, but at the time, my goal wasn't all XF45's and I was content with my AU50.

    After I decided I wanted an XF45, I started watching all the auction sites and some of the coin websites I'd bought from before on a daily basis. For some reason, I'd missed a day or two, and as luck would have it, I missed the second one of the year when it had popped into inventory on a dealer's site and sold very quickly.

  • PeakRaritiesPeakRarities Posts: 3,700 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I think there’s a decent chance of that coming back as a 45, and it would very likely sticker. PCGS has been tight lately, based on my observations.

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  • AtcarrollAtcarroll Posts: 399 ✭✭✭✭

    @M4Madness said:
    Looks like we're split about 50/50 on the votes, which doesn't ease my mind any. Lol

    PCGS graded it AU50

    My Carson City Morgan set is completely XF45 except for this coin. I cannot find an XF45 1884-CC anywhere, so I was thinking of cracking this one out and hoping it'd downgrade from 50 to 45.

    I feel that it is right on the line between the two grades.

    Send it to CACG

  • M4MadnessM4Madness Posts: 314 ✭✭✭✭

    @Atcarroll said:
    Send it to CACG

    I understand where you're coming from, buy I need it in a PCGS holder for my registry set.

  • WalkerfanWalkerfan Posts: 9,287 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Looks more XF than AU.

    Sometimes, it’s better to be LUCKY than good. 🍀 🍺👍

    My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947):

    https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/

  • oldabeintxoldabeintx Posts: 1,895 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Is the coin different in appearance from your other coins or are you simply hung up on the grade? If the former, then sell it and continue your search. If the latter, probably do the same unless you enjoy spending money and time with an uncertain result. Time that could be spent finding a coin that fits your criteria.

  • M4MadnessM4Madness Posts: 314 ✭✭✭✭

    @oldabeintx said:
    Is the coin different in appearance from your other coins or are you simply hung up on the grade? If the former, then sell it and continue your search. If the latter, probably do the same unless you enjoy spending money and time with an uncertain result. Time that could be spent finding a coin that fits your criteria.

    My entire set is the same grade (XF45) except for this one coin. Believe me, if I could find an 1884-CC Morgan in XF45 for sale, I'd jump right on it. PCGS population in this grade is 31, and years can pass between public sales of them.

    I own that coin in both XF40 and AU50 holders, and both have lower populations than the XF45. I feel very fortunate to have found those, but still want my entire set to match grade wise.

  • oldabeintxoldabeintx Posts: 1,895 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Seems like your best bet then would be to try to cross a coin that looks as close to your set as possible. Or find a raw coin. Find an NGC coin that grades higher, but appears XF and cross it with a 45 minimum, for example.

  • PeakRaritiesPeakRarities Posts: 3,700 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @oldabeintx said:
    Seems like your best bet then would be to try to cross a coin that looks as close to your set as possible. Or find a raw coin. Find an NGC coin that grades higher, but appears XF and cross it with a 45 minimum, for example.

    All he has to do is send in the OP coin, perhaps a couple times if necessary, until it comes back as a 45. It's a nice looking coin but not super strong as a 50, imo.

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  • braddickbraddick Posts: 23,946 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @PeakRarities said:

    @oldabeintx said:
    Seems like your best bet then would be to try to cross a coin that looks as close to your set as possible. Or find a raw coin. Find an NGC coin that grades higher, but appears XF and cross it with a 45 minimum, for example.

    All he has to do is send in the OP coin, perhaps a couple times if necessary, until it comes back as a 45. It's a nice looking coin but not super strong as a 50, imo.

    I'd speculate the OP could send this Morgan a half a dozen times over the course of a couple of years and not once would it be returned as an XF45.

    peacockcoins

  • PeakRaritiesPeakRarities Posts: 3,700 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @braddick said:

    @PeakRarities said:

    @oldabeintx said:
    Seems like your best bet then would be to try to cross a coin that looks as close to your set as possible. Or find a raw coin. Find an NGC coin that grades higher, but appears XF and cross it with a 45 minimum, for example.

    All he has to do is send in the OP coin, perhaps a couple times if necessary, until it comes back as a 45. It's a nice looking coin but not super strong as a 50, imo.

    I'd speculate the OP could send this Morgan a half a dozen times over the course of a couple of years and not once would it be returned as an XF45.

    I'll take that action. Loser has to compensate the cost of the submissions? 😇

    Founder- Peak Rarities
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  • braddickbraddick Posts: 23,946 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @PeakRarities said:

    @braddick said:

    @PeakRarities said:

    @oldabeintx said:
    Seems like your best bet then would be to try to cross a coin that looks as close to your set as possible. Or find a raw coin. Find an NGC coin that grades higher, but appears XF and cross it with a 45 minimum, for example.

    All he has to do is send in the OP coin, perhaps a couple times if necessary, until it comes back as a 45. It's a nice looking coin but not super strong as a 50, imo.

    I'd speculate the OP could send this Morgan a half a dozen times over the course of a couple of years and not once would it be returned as an XF45.

    I'll take that action. Loser has to compensate the cost of the submissions? 😇

    It's a speculation on my part.
    But your answer did put me in my place.

    peacockcoins

  • PeakRaritiesPeakRarities Posts: 3,700 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @braddick said:

    @PeakRarities said:

    @braddick said:

    @PeakRarities said:

    @oldabeintx said:
    Seems like your best bet then would be to try to cross a coin that looks as close to your set as possible. Or find a raw coin. Find an NGC coin that grades higher, but appears XF and cross it with a 45 minimum, for example.

    All he has to do is send in the OP coin, perhaps a couple times if necessary, until it comes back as a 45. It's a nice looking coin but not super strong as a 50, imo.

    I'd speculate the OP could send this Morgan a half a dozen times over the course of a couple of years and not once would it be returned as an XF45.

    I'll take that action. Loser has to compensate the cost of the submissions? 😇

    It's a speculation on my part.
    But your answer did put me in my place.

    Lol, I'm just messing around. Though my "GTG" answer would have been 45, based on the TV. Based on the second phot, I probably would have said 50 or 53. If it sits on the line where I think it does, I predict that the coin would come back as a 45 at least 25% of the time. A quality video would be necessary to solidify my opinion and double down, however.

    I actually have a similar experiement in the works that should be insightful for all of us. Sadly, there are no Morgans, but I would appreciate if the OP keeps us informed if he resubmits.

    Founder- Peak Rarities
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  • braddickbraddick Posts: 23,946 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @PeakRarities said:

    @braddick said:

    @PeakRarities said:

    @braddick said:

    @PeakRarities said:

    @oldabeintx said:
    Seems like your best bet then would be to try to cross a coin that looks as close to your set as possible. Or find a raw coin. Find an NGC coin that grades higher, but appears XF and cross it with a 45 minimum, for example.

    All he has to do is send in the OP coin, perhaps a couple times if necessary, until it comes back as a 45. It's a nice looking coin but not super strong as a 50, imo.

    I'd speculate the OP could send this Morgan a half a dozen times over the course of a couple of years and not once would it be returned as an XF45.

    I'll take that action. Loser has to compensate the cost of the submissions? 😇

    It's a speculation on my part.
    But your answer did put me in my place.

    Lol, I'm just messing around. Though my "GTG" answer would have been 45, based on the TV. Based on the second phot, I probably would have said 50 or 53. If it sits on the line where I think it does, I predict that the coin would come back as a 45 at least 25% of the time. A quality video would be necessary to solidify my opinion and double down, however.

    I actually have a similar experiement in the works that should be insightful for all of us. Sadly, there are no Morgans, but I would appreciate if the OP keeps us informed if he resubmits.

    I enjoy and appreciate your tenacity and wish you success!

    peacockcoins

  • M4MadnessM4Madness Posts: 314 ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 9, 2024 2:24AM

    @oldabeintx said:
    Seems like your best bet then would be to try to cross a coin that looks as close to your set as possible. Or find a raw coin. Find an NGC coin that grades higher, but appears XF and cross it with a 45 minimum, for example.

    Here's an NGC AU50, but again, it's too close to call as well:

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/116339502435

    Here's a raw one that I personally think will fall short and grade XF40 (and which I fear may end up in a details holder):

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/365157556921

  • Namvet69Namvet69 Posts: 8,949 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I used my magic 8 ball on this one.

    BST: endeavor1967, synchr, kliao, Outhaul, Donttellthewife, U1Chicago, ajaan, mCarney1173, SurfinHi, MWallace, Sandman70gt, mustanggt, Pittstate03, Lazybones, Walkerguy21D, coinandcurrency242 , thebigeng, Collectorcoins, JimTyler, USMarine6, Elkevvo, Coll3ctor, Yorkshireman, CUKevin, ranshdow, CoinHunter4, bennybravo, Centsearcher, braddick, Windycity, ZoidMeister, mirabela, JJM, RichURich, Bullsitter, jmski52, LukeMarshall, coinsarefun, MichaelDixon, NickPatton, ProfLiz, Twobitcollector,Jesbroken oih82w8

  • coinkatcoinkat Posts: 23,066 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I would be happy with it and move on. It looks original instead of some dipped out pos so it likely received the benefit of the doubt…that is if there was doubt.

    Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.

  • clarkbar04clarkbar04 Posts: 4,936 ✭✭✭✭✭

    The more amazing thing is you found a circulated 84-CC.

    MS66 taste on an MS63 budget.
  • oldabeintxoldabeintx Posts: 1,895 ✭✭✭✭✭

    If I were doing an XF set, I wouldn’t want the subject coin in my set, based on the SECOND photo. If the TV is accurate, the first photo, then I would like it in such a set and would ignore the numeric grade on the plastic. Does a registry participant get points for matching grades or something? (I have plenty of my own collecting obsessions and eccentricities, so I’m not being at all critical.)

  • oldabeintxoldabeintx Posts: 1,895 ✭✭✭✭✭

    BTW I like the raw coin’s overall look, you might discuss with L&C. But does look shy of 45. I don’t like the 50, based on the photo provided. I didn’t look it up on NGC.

  • M4MadnessM4Madness Posts: 314 ✭✭✭✭

    The coin IS brighter than most of the others in the set. The TrueView is WAY darker than the coin in hand. The in-slab photo earlier in this thread gets close to how it actually looks, but I still think it looks even more shiny in person. ANACS straight graded it, and PCGS did as well when I crossed it over. Both gave it AU50. If it's been cleaned, it must be market acceptable in their eyes.

  • M4MadnessM4Madness Posts: 314 ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 9, 2024 7:44AM

    Here's my XF40:

    I'D LOVE AN XF45 THAT LOOKS LIKE IT.

  • oldabeintxoldabeintx Posts: 1,895 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I have to admit to a bias when it comes to the 50 grade. I my LIMITED experience, many seem sort of “washed out”. Same with 53.

  • CopperindianCopperindian Posts: 1,395 ✭✭✭✭✭

    As it’s the only 50 in your set, why not wait? I agree with others, though, that targeting a NGC50 when one comes along might be a better idea. PCGS may end up keeping this a 50 several times over.

    “The thrill of the hunt never gets old”

    PCGS Registry: Screaming Eagles
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    Retired sets: Soaring Eagles
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  • BillJonesBillJones Posts: 33,944 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited October 9, 2024 9:22AM

    The coin has a lot of dull luster remaining, but it has no “pizzaz.” I would guess that this was lightly cleaned with fine baking soda many years ago. It killed the strong luster, leaving the dull luster you see now.

    As such, I can't give it an AU grade. This is an unnatural look.

    Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
  • I voted the AU, but if you gave me a 3rd choice of AU Details, I would have chosen that. Muchisimo hairlines on the obverse.

    "Next year we could have an 8 cent nickel. Think what that would mean. You could go to a newsstand, buy a 3 cent newspaper, and get the same nickel back again. One nickel carefully used could last a family a lifetime." - Capt. Jeffrey T. Spaulding

  • coinkatcoinkat Posts: 23,066 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Seems the real takeaway is coin photography… and how difficult it is to really handicap what the coin looks like in hand based on an image… or multiple images.

    Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.

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