White Sox on pace for historic season

craig44

Currently on place for 36 wins. that would place them as the worst team since 1900.

ughhh. they are so bad.

DocBenjamin

Terrible is way better than mediocrity.

DocBenjamin

When Trammell managed the Tigers a bunch of years ago, they played .250 ball.

Alan pulled some of the starters from the rotation at the end cause he didn't want them to lose 20 games.

perkdog

I hope they break the record, always fun to see records broken lol

erikthredd

There was a Youtube Shorts clip from a recent double header showing how few actual fans were at the game and it was like right around 100. Supposedly the paid attendance was a little over 11K for the two games combined but this is what it actually looked like that day.

That must have been great for the fans that did turn out though, you could move up to the first row and probably had a much better chance of grabbing a few autos.

ElMagoStrikeZone

So bad that their walk-off homers get shtupped.

Basebal21

Most insane stat Ive ever seen, even more insane that Othani. The White Sox are 39 games out of 4th place

It wont happen, but they should be forced to sell the team

bgr

That’s what I keep saying about Burger King.

stevek

The White Sox should invest in cardboard fans, and place a good number of those in the empty seats. Make things look a little better?

Tabe

@DocBenjamin said:
When Trammell managed the Tigers a bunch of years ago, they played .250 ball.

Alan pulled some of the starters from the rotation at the end cause he didn't want them to lose 20 games.

Yeah, he pulled Jeremy Bonderman because he was a rookie. Bonderman still lost 19 though, LOL.

Mike Maroth wasn't so lucky and he ended up losing 21 becoming the first guy to lose 20 in two decades.

Steven59

Not even one run scored yesterday - newest losing streak is up to 12......

bgr

I don't know what happened to Reinsdorf, but I don't think he will ever sell the team. I guess give him credit for making the Bulls and the White Sox winners, if only for a brief moment for the Sox. Past that he seems stuck in his own head regarding the economics of sports.

DocBenjamin

@bgr said:
I don't know what happened to Reinsdorf, but I don't think he will ever sell the team. I guess give him credit for making the Bulls and the White Sox winners, if only for a brief moment for the Sox. Past that he seems stuck in his own head regarding the economics of sports.

Maybe a reflection of the downturn of the city. Recall that the park was not on the best side of town, and that was a few decades ago.

Basebal21

Reinsdorf has always been cheap and more focused on the Bulls. The White Sox had a magical season in 2005 where a lot of average players had one of their best seasons all at the same time. Other than that they dont make the playoffs very often since he bought the team and they usually lose in the first round when they do.

The As and White Sox are the only two teams in MLB that have never given out a 9 figure contract

Steven59

Time to bring back the shorts............

Steven59

After today's loss: "Chicago dropped a franchise-record 15th straight at home, lost its 17th in 19 overall and was swept for the 24th time. At 33-114, the White Sox are closing in on the post-1900 record for losses — 120 by the 1962 New York Mets in their inaugural season."

craig44

how do you even fix it???

1948_Swell_Robinson

@craig44 said:
how do you even fix it???

Full house cleaning starting from the owner.

They are terrible at developing players and you need to do that especially when you are cheap.

Reinsdorf inherited Jordan with the Bulls, so lets not start going crazy on giving him credit for any of that run. He actually helped dismantle that dynasty because he thought the organization could do it on their own.

Even a blind squirrel finds a few nuts once in a while. Reinsdorf found two; inheriting Jordan, and the 2005 White Sox playing above their head all year and in the playoffs. Thats it.

Basebal21

@craig44 said:
how do you even fix it???

Make the owner sell the team and get one thats actually interested in winning instead of keeping the payroll down lol

GroceryRackPack

I know...I know...
GRP typing on a baseball topic...

DocBenjamin

Maybe they can import Steve Bartman from the Cubs.

ElMagoStrikeZone

Kinda appropriate that their home park is called Guaranteed Rate, as they will be etched in history as the team rated WORST EVER.

MsMorrisine

36-120 today

is watching this happen morbid?

Basebal21

@MsMorrisine said:
36-120 today

is watching this happen morbid?

Watching them play seems like youre just punishing yourself lol

Estil

As Tammy Wynette would say, those Good Guys (as WGN liked to call them) have really gone bad! Like, what exactly went so wrong in this season that did not happen in other bad but not THIS bad teams/seasons?

Basebal21

@Estil said:
As Tammy Wynette would say, those Good Guys (as WGN liked to call them) have really gone bad! Like, what exactly went so wrong in this season that did not happen in other bad but not THIS bad teams/seasons?

Pretty much the last few seasons coming to a head. Guys have been traded away, Abreu got old and left, some of the young guys didnt end up as good as they were supposed to be. Its just a terrible roster with too many guys that should be bench players at best starting. That teams been waiting for the season to end for a couple months now

lanemyer85

@Basebal21 said:
Reinsdorf has always been cheap and more focused on the Bulls. The White Sox had a magical season in 2005 where a lot of average players had one of their best seasons all at the same time. Other than that they dont make the playoffs very often since he bought the team and they usually lose in the first round when they do.

The As and White Sox are the only two teams in MLB that have never given out a 9 figure contract

that's not really true. He's always been a baseball first guy. But he's also from NY and grew up a Yankee fan so not that it necessarily matters, but that's a narrative some Sox fans have of him locally - the carpetbagger who threatened to move the team to Tampa unless the city bought him a new park, which turned out to be a concrete disaster in a poor location - instead of the south loop area which is where it should have been built. It's also much easier to run an NBA franchise than a baseball franchise when you don't have the minor league system, a spring training complex, an academy/Summer League in the Dominican that all teams pretty much have now, and you're sharing a barn with the local hockey team that pays half of the bills.

The real problem is Jerry is the most loyal guy in the world. See Kenny Williams spending 11 years as GM, and then another 11 years as President of Baseball Ops with pretty much free reign over the on-field product. Yes you can argue he's cheap, the Benintendi 5 year $75m contract is the Sox's largest ever. They did take a run at signing Machado a few years ago - reportedly 10 years at $250m depending on who you believe. You can say the same thing about Jerry keeping John Paxson in charge of the Bulls with minimal success for way too long too. Not to mention, Jerry Krause, who was Reinsdorf's right arm for the Bulls, and is the reason Jordan and Phil Jackson left town, then eventually Pippen too. You know, the guy who once proudly declared that "players don't win championships, organizations (meaning front offices) do".

Then move on to the scouting/drafting which has been really terrible. If there was a "5 tool prospect" available in the first round, particularly if he was CFer, Kenny was going to draft him - guys everyone has already forgotten like Trayce Thompson, Jared Mitchell, Brian Anderson, Keenyn Walker, and Courtney Hawkins among others. Just look at his first round picks - pretty much just Gio Gonzalez in 2004, Sale in 2010, Tim Anderson (sorta) in 2013, Rodon in 2014 (sorta, he was always hurt with the Sox until his first pillow free agent contract) are pretty much his only first round or supplemental first round hits with a ton of complete busts who never played in the majors - that's 22 years worth of futility and he kept his job and got promoted on top of it. Then add in his unwillingness to deal with Boras (they spent years avoiding drafting Boras clients and never signing his free agents) among some other weird things.

Yes you'd like to see a guy who bought the team for $19 million which is somehow now worth $2.5 billion go all out in his latter years like Mike Illitch did with the Tigers during the Verlander era, that's where I think you can hammer him, You can at least understand why newer owners who are paying off debt from buying the team are cheap, like the Pirates, because every team, even the Rays and Pirates could roll a $180 million dollar payroll and still make money, but obviously, not all teams are actually owned by their owners, they're owned by the banks. But Jerry owns the team, it's all profit and he made his money back decades ago and he could have easily gone all out at times in the last 10 years, and didn't. Fair to hammer him for that.

Basebal21

@lanemyer85 said:

@Basebal21 said:
Reinsdorf has always been cheap and more focused on the Bulls. The White Sox had a magical season in 2005 where a lot of average players had one of their best seasons all at the same time. Other than that they dont make the playoffs very often since he bought the team and they usually lose in the first round when they do.

The As and White Sox are the only two teams in MLB that have never given out a 9 figure contract

that's not really true. He's always been a baseball first guy. But he's also from NY and grew up a Yankee fan so not that it necessarily matters, but that's a narrative some Sox fans have of him locally - the carpetbagger who threatened to move the team to Tampa unless the city bought him a new park, which turned out to be a concrete disaster in a poor location - instead of the south loop area which is where it should have been built. It's also much easier to run an NBA franchise than a baseball franchise when you don't have the minor league system, a spring training complex, an academy/Summer League in the Dominican that all teams pretty much have now, and you're sharing a barn with the local hockey team that pays half of the bills.

The real problem is Jerry is the most loyal guy in the world. See Kenny Williams spending 11 years as GM, and then another 11 years as President of Baseball Ops with pretty much free reign over the on-field product. Yes you can argue he's cheap, the Benintendi 5 year $75m contract is the Sox's largest ever. They did take a run at signing Machado a few years ago - reportedly 10 years at $250m depending on who you believe. You can say the same thing about Jerry keeping John Paxson in charge of the Bulls with minimal success for way too long too. Not to mention, Jerry Krause, who was Reinsdorf's right arm for the Bulls, and is the reason Jordan and Phil Jackson left town, then eventually Pippen too. You know, the guy who once proudly declared that "players don't win championships, organizations (meaning front offices) do".

Then move on to the scouting/drafting which has been really terrible. If there was a "5 tool prospect" available in the first round, particularly if he was CFer, Kenny was going to draft him - guys everyone has already forgotten like Trayce Thompson, Jared Mitchell, Brian Anderson, Keenyn Walker, and Courtney Hawkins among others. Just look at his first round picks - pretty much just Gio Gonzalez in 2004, Sale in 2010, Tim Anderson (sorta) in 2013, Rodon in 2014 (sorta, he was always hurt with the Sox until his first pillow free agent contract) are pretty much his only first round or supplemental first round hits with a ton of complete busts who never played in the majors - that's 22 years worth of futility and he kept his job and got promoted on top of it. Then add in his unwillingness to deal with Boras (they spent years avoiding drafting Boras clients and never signing his free agents) among some other weird things.

Yes you'd like to see a guy who bought the team for $19 million which is somehow now worth $2.5 billion go all out in his latter years like Mike Illitch did with the Tigers during the Verlander era, that's where I think you can hammer him, You can at least understand why newer owners who are paying off debt from buying the team are cheap, like the Pirates, because every team, even the Rays and Pirates could roll a $180 million dollar payroll and still make money, but obviously, not all teams are actually owned by their owners, they're owned by the banks. But Jerry owns the team, it's all profit and he made his money back decades ago and he could have easily gone all out at times in the last 10 years, and didn't. Fair to hammer him for that.

The Machado thing it was really more like a 7 year 175 offer and they got Yonder Alonso thinking that would make him cheaper being his brother in law with incentives. The minors and the academies really dont cost teams much especially for the majority of his time owning the team. Even now with the the massive increase in pay you have to get to AAA for a living wage and the wage increases just happened recently from guys in the minors making nothing and its still not much

https://www.baseballamerica.com/stories/how-much-are-minor-league-baseball-players-paid-in-2024/

Williams certainly wasnt a good GM and had his job longer than he should have. Hiring LaRussa was a wild move as well. A lot of GMs miss on their first round picks even the ones considered great GMs. Most picks in baseball really dont amount to anything even the first rounders. Every now and then a generational talent comes along that is a cant miss guy but its rare. I dont blame any of them unless they just go cheap with the pick and make more of a value pick. Losing Tatis in the Shields trade certainly hurt but he was mostly a no body at the time of the trade.

Reinsdorf has owned the team for almost 40 years. I wouldnt call him a baseball first guy in terms of how hes run the team. The Pirates have had the same owner since 2009 and are still acting poor. Everything came together at the right moment to get the White Sox their WS win

Wrigley is definitely the more iconic stadium in a better location, but the White Sox have the better food and should be a better atmosphere than it is.

I would certainly prefer owners to act like Illich and respect that he wanted to win like Seidler did with the Padres when he was battling cancer that no one really knew about until it took his life, but there is a middle ground too. They really didnt even try to put anything good on the field this year. Theres really just no excuse to be in late September with under 40 wins

DocBenjamin

36-120

DocBenjamin

Sox sweep the Angels.

Well this is no fun.

Tabe

@DocBenjamin said:
36-120

39-121. They now own the loss record, post-1900.

Steven59

@Tabe said:
39-121. They now own the loss record, post-1900.

Congrats to the White Sox!

BillJones

I remember Cleveland was close a season like this some years ago, but they really got their game together and avoided a “memorable season of futility”. The White Sox are the modern Cleveland Spiders. The Spiders stopping playing at home because they couldn’t draw enough fans to make it pay. By the looks of the White Sox stadium, they might be close to that.

DocBenjamin

White Sox close with an impressive 5-1 in the final 6 games.

Basebal21

Actually disappointed they broke 40 wins

coinkat

Bob Uecker could have added so much to season that could not end soon enough…