Silver Set To Soar On Samsung’s Solid-State Battery Breakthrough
Mike59
Posts: 319 ✭✭✭
I think this will help boost silver prices but if the “key drivers to ramp up EV demand” are met even to 50%~75% then it would be a game changer to Silver prices. Key drivers like 600 mile range, 20 year battery lifespan and 9 minute charging. Who knows but very interesting.
MIKE B.
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Article states that each of the prospective new batteries which would power a typical car would contain about 1 kg, or 32.15 troy ounces, of pure silver. (That amount of pure silver corresponds to roughly $44.42 face value in pre-1964 junk silver coins). Wonder if this possibility has already been somewhat "priced in" by those in the know, as reflected in the rise in silver prices this year?
Coinlearner, Ahrensdad, Nolawyer, RG, coinlieutenant, Yorkshireman, lordmarcovan, Soldi, masscrew, JimTyler, Relaxn, jclovescoins
Now listen boy, I'm tryin' to teach you sumthin' . . . . that ain't an optical illusion, it only looks like an optical illusion.
My mind reader refuses to charge me....
Earlier today, Ford pushed out their EV plans 6-18 months due to lack of demand / affordability.
I know that i personally wouldn’t buy a EV with a 200-300 mile range that would take 45+ minutes to recharge. I might consider 1 if the range was over 500 miles that could be recharged in under 15 minutes. Although I don’t need to sell my PM’s to fund my retirement I’d really like to see my investment (enjoyable hobby) grow and help my kids or grandchildren.
According to the silver institute we have been running at almost 200 million ounce silver deficient for the last 3 years.
JMHO,
Mike
https://www.silverinstitute.org/silver-supply-demand/
MIKE B.
I don’t think you’re going to see a souring EV market until much more of the infrastructure is in place to support it AND the global uncertainty caused by the upcoming election in the U.S. is resolved.
Don't forget...Kitco is a bullion dealer, as such, take all of their PM articles with a "grain of salt."
Kinda reminds me of the cold fusion energy breakthrough news a decade? ago.... ......which never happened. At least we don't see any application that came out of it!
If I recall correctly when I glanced through the article, this new battery has recharge time of 9 MINUTES! Say what? That is a tremendous amount of energy.... not sure I want to be close when that takes place!
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In the past Kitco has also had news articles that were bearish on precious metals.
But realize that Kitco also needs people to sell to them, not just buy from them.
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Don't hold your breath. Been hearing about a gutter explosion due to new technology for several decades now. Same old story. Salesmen prey on the ignorant. Just sayin. RGDS!
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
im hearing theres no resale value on the ev auto. off topic yes, so sorry
(at least get the silver if you can)
Yes, certainly could just be hype. Especially in this day and age of manipulated news and AI. So we will just have to wait and see, for now I am skeptical. Even if it is true, it would likely require a massive NEW support infrastructure for recharging, etc. I doubt the charging stations that currently exist would be compatible with the technology (at least likely not for the 'fast' recharge rate). And.... the issue of not enough electrical production and infrastructure existing to support increasing growth in EVs.
BUT.... shine on you crazy silver!
buy the EV news, not the EV delivery
Natural forces of supply and demand are the best regulators on earth.
The kitco story was easy enough to find backing for online, just google: "samsung solid state battery"
The first search result from PC Mag mentioned several automakers are currently field testing the prototypes so they must be fairly well along. If this pans out it will be a game changer, EV resale value is the pits because current batteries only last about 10 years and cost around 10k to replace. These new solid state batteries claim to have a 20 year lifespan, charge3x faster give 2x range and may well be considerably cheaper, after all, gutter metal is the secret ingredient.
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It will be and interesting economic study to find the new price curve of silver vs. battery cost and battery cost vs. sales/profit. If this really would suck up 16/25 th's of annual silver production (in one of the articles), silver will add a way more significant industrial price vs. a pure PM play. I wonder if we are talking platinum like prices. I understand platinum is more rare but a use taking up 65% of current production is a big deal.
1 Car = 1 Kg of silver ~35.25 oz or as of friday $1002
I think the demand will be inelastic through $100 an oz. not platinum quite but not gutter either. That only would add $2000 to the cost of a car. All these things are is a battery, some electric motors and a Droid phone.
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I did some crude calculations and came up with an estimate of about 3 troy oz per car (1/10 of the article's 30+ estimate).
Still, that would be an important and significant consumption of silver.
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as much as five grams of silver per cell> @dcarr said:
That is a huge discrepancy and it seems like you are correct and the article is way overestimating the qty of silver that will be used.
At 20 million EVs produced annually (currently about 15 million), this would be a demand if about 60 million ounces. Total global demand for all uses is about 1.2 billion ounces so increase in demand of about 5%.
They say silver supply has been running a deficit for years, so this would add to that deficit sans increased production. Current deficits don't seem to have had much impact on price though.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
Not seeing a gutter deficit over here in The Commonwealth, there's tons of the junk everywhere. Much more than anyone even wants. RGDS!
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
It will be YEARS before this makes an impact, even if it does.
2 years, this is already in cars at manufacturers including Tesla. Tesla will be including them in the Model S and X so this is not like some mouse study for a drug, it is in stage 3 trials.
Even if initially 40oz per car is needed, this is just the first iteration of solid state battery tech. Industry will no doubt be looking to make this cheaper and while the proof of concept may have been easier to pull off using that much silver, Some MFRs will likely look for a cheaper compromise. This tech has much broader application than cars, all "green" energy lacks an efficient means of storing generated power while the sun shines, wind blows, etc.
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I was trying to find details out about the battery and found that they use the silver with a mixture of carbon as the anode. I bet there is a very specific electrical reaction going on that requires silver. I bet they cant just swap it our for copper, there is a dang good reason is my bet.
High-energy long-cycling all-solid-state lithium metal batteries_** enabled by silver–carbon**_ composite anodes. https://www.nature.com/articles/s41560-020-0575-z
"We show that the thin Ag–C layer can effectively regulate Li deposition, which leads to a genuinely long electrochemical cyclability"
"the silver-carbon (Ag-C) nanocomposite has been reported to significantly increase the energy density and cycle rate of solid-state lithium metal batteries. Ag-C interlayers serve as mixed ionic-electronic conductor that conducts both Li+ ions and electrons and lithium storage capacity."
I just hope they are reasonably priced, I'd seriously consider solar panels if the storage was cost-effective. May also be a good time to pick up some Samsung shares.
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LOL these batteries if ever developed will have about .0005ozt of gutter metal in them. Amazing what people will believe because they read it somewhere on the internet. De-evolution is in full swing. SMH!
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
The impact does not drive the price. It's is the news of a coming impact that drives markets
Natural forces of supply and demand are the best regulators on earth.
So far silver hasn't budged. The market clearly thinks differently than this thread.
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Do you have a degree in physics or engineering ?
Have you worked in electronics or electrical power generation and/or storage ?
Do you work for Samsung and/or have inside information ?
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I didn't think so.
Your made-up fantasy number isn't worth 0.0005 of a cent.
My estimate is about 3 troy oz per car.
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I didn't thing so either.
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
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As far as I can tell, you have never demonstrated any competency in science or engineering on this forum.
You apparently have no idea about the amount of silver that might be needed for a car battery.
So I have to doubt your claims about your education and experience.
Where did you get that 0.0005 troy ounce figure per car battery ?
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PS:
Here is my estimate calculation from another thread:
Current commonly-used EV batteries (which are not solid-state) are pretty expensive already.
A typical electric vehicle battery currently costs about $150 per kwh (kilowatt-hour).
Most such batteries are about 50 kwh, so $7,500 for a typical lithium-ion car battery.
Silver-carbon batteries might not cost a lot more than that. A Samsung article from 2020 indicates the anode might only require a silver-carbon layer that is 1/200th of a millimeter thick. To calculate how much silver that would be, the surface area of the anode must be known, as well as how many anodes does the battery pack have. An average-sized "medium" pouch cell might have an anode surface area of 4,000 square mm. That would be 20 cubic mm of silver-carbon per anode. If half of that is carbon and the other half silver, then the silver portion would be equivalent to 10 cubic mm or 0.01 cubic cm per cell.
However, a typical battery pack for an electric vehicle could have 1,000 or more cells. That would result in a silver volume of 10 cubic cm for the whole pack. So roughly 100 grams of silver (3 troy oz) per vehicle.
Note that a Tesla Model S battery contains 60 kilograms (60,000 grams) of lithium.
I pulled it out of my arsee just like all the other posts claiming 1Kg, 40ozt, etc. Even your estimate of 3ozt is high. Not that any of it matters because such a battery would never see the light of day.
Last I checked this was not an engineering forum, it's consisted primarily of anti-science bunker dwelling doomsday conspiracy theorists who hoard gutter metal and claim it to be a PM. Doubt all you want, doesn't bother me in the least. THKS!
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
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Wow.
So you pull a fake made-up number out of your arse, just to suit your narrative, and you expect people to believe it,
And in the very next sentence you complain about what people will believe that they read on the internet.
So who is the real disinformation agent here, the original article or you ?
The crazy part is, you don't even seem to realize that it is YOU .
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Silver doesn't need a car battery to make a good run higher. Solar panels and demand from India have already established the end game parameters for silver. Got silver?
If this battery gets proven in practice, you can expect silver to post another couple legs higher than it's already slated to do. In that case, I wouldn't rule out $100/oz.
I knew it would happen.
"If I have to create stories...." JD.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
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I laid out the reasoning and calculations for my estimate of 3 troy oz per car.
blitzedude wrote "3ozt is high", but gives no rationale or supporting information for yet another "out-of-the-arse" claim.
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.0005 troy oz? Hahahaha. That's a good one.
Every time blitzie badmouths silver (and the way he does that), it makes one wonder what he's being paid to come here.
I knew it would happen.
My SLV is sitting just fine but thanks for your concern there jim. RGDS!
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
It budged from $30 to $32 since this thread started. Market thinks it is worth more now than when the thread began. Up 4.75% so far for the day. I think it's budgin.
Natural forces of supply and demand are the best regulators on earth.
My SLV is sitting just fine but thanks for your concern there jim. RGDS!
Weren't you gonna sell it? Again, inquiring minds want to know why you would own silver or even SLV?
Don't be so conflicted - life is easier when you can think.
I knew it would happen.
I sold some SLV yes, still hold a small amount. ~1000 shares. Down to about ~2Kozt physical gutter. I'll dump the physical as soon as I find someone dumb enough to buy it.
The SLV I'll load back up once it dips back to the mid $20's. rinse lather repeat.
THKS!
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
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You changed your post after I quoted it the first time.
What do you mean by: "If I have to create stories...." ?
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Whatcha got? How much for it?
Natural forces of supply and demand are the best regulators on earth.
Hah! I knew it! Impeccable timing on the trigger finger. He still hasn't figured out what silver is.
I knew it would happen.
He sees the short term temporary high. What he doesn't see is the one-year new highs. It's what the market call short term vision.
Natural forces of supply and demand are the best regulators on earth.
I see groundhog day and you and jim moping around 5 years from now talking about how your $20 gutter metal is about to go to da moon. THKS!
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
well then, just keep stackin them dollars. As soon as your stack is 2 feet high it will gradually become 1 foot high.
Natural forces of supply and demand are the best regulators on earth.
Honestly, I prefer to mainly stack VOO, Physical Au and farmland. RGDS!
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
Yes I did. Because it was a better response to your comment about making stuff up to suit a narrative. I was quoting a potential VP.
I changed it before I saw you had already commented.
I think the revision is more comical. And who doesn't love a good laugh?
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
Cat converters, take two. Lock up those batteries.