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Stacks rant or not? Or Great collections positive

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  • jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 34,247 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 27, 2024 6:59AM

    @lermish said:

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @Coinscratch said:

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @Coinscratch said:
    It’s like every thread I open up there he is spewing wisdom again. I mean where does he get all this knowledge? Apparently I’m confined to using less than 10% of my brain matter :D

    I'm not sure what your point is. Maybe I'm not using enough.

    My point is legitimate. No actual sale has taken place until payment is made. I find it unlikely that an auction house wants to pay for lots that haven't actually sold. The reductio ad absurdum argument exaggerates the point, but that is the nature of the rhetorical device.

    It was just an honest observation and nothing to do with the subject matter no reason to over think it.
    Something tells me you didn’t do so well with the ladies. 😁

    It's interesting that so many people feel free to sinply toss insults. Whatever you think my flaws may be, that's not one of them.

    Oddly, no one has even bothered to try to refute the point I made. I guess you just don't like that I'm the one who made it. There is an "ignore" function if you're bothered by my presence.

    Not a refutation, and you make a good point, but from HA or SB's view, they may be willing to pay out non-paying smaller sales. Both of those firms have enormous wholesale operations and often auction their own inventory. They may be happy to pay out $400 hammer on a coin and then keep the full $500 when they re-list it in a month.

    Obviously there's a breaking point at some limit where they would not likely do that. I have no idea where that is though.

    I agree. Most companies would part with a few bucks to keep their customers/consignors happy. But I also doubt that any auction company has a policy that dictates blanket payouts of consignors whether the item actually sells or not. This would especially be true for things like tokens and world coins where the wholesale markets aren't as liquid.

    Different issue, but I had a case a few months ago where I bought a bunch of NGC certified dies from Heritage. Several of the NGC capsules popped open in shipping. Heritage gave me 100% refund and didn't even ask for return of the merchandise. [Anyone want a semi-certified coin die?]

  • jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 34,247 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Old_Collector said:
    Naive question on auctions, if the winning bid doesn't pay is the coin offered to the next bidder down by GC, Heritage, and Stacks?
    I for one, would be happy to pick up some of the things that I have bid on and just lost out to one final bid (at least as far as I can tell).

    Yes, that sometimes happens. I think it is generally the wish of the consignor: offer to underbidder, list in future auction, or receive return of the item.

    By the way, this has been discussed on this forum previously. It is worth noting that some people are skeptical of such offers believing that they may indicate some kind of shenanigans in the original auction.

  • seatedlib3991seatedlib3991 Posts: 720 ✭✭✭✭✭

    This happened back in the late 1990s so may no longer be relevant. @Old_Collector but I bid on a coin at Heritage and lost. 2 days later I got an e-mail from Heritage telling me the winning bid had been dis- qualified. I was under no obligation, but if I wanted to they would award me the coin. I wanted. James

  • CoinscratchCoinscratch Posts: 8,663 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @Coinscratch said:

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @Coinscratch said:

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @Coinscratch said:
    It’s like every thread I open up there he is spewing wisdom again. I mean where does he get all this knowledge? Apparently I’m confined to using less than 10% of my brain matter :D

    I'm not sure what your point is. Maybe I'm not using enough.

    My point is legitimate. No actual sale has taken place until payment is made. I find it unlikely that an auction house wants to pay for lots that haven't actually sold. The reductio ad absurdum argument exaggerates the point, but that is the nature of the rhetorical device.

    It was just an honest observation and nothing to do with the subject matter no reason to over think it.
    Something tells me you didn’t do so well with the ladies. 😁

    It's interesting that so many people feel free to sinply toss insults. Whatever you think my flaws may be, that's not one of them.

    Oddly, no one has even bothered to try to refute the point I made. I guess you just don't like that I'm the one who made it. There is an "ignore" function if you're bothered by my presence.

    I thought you had a sense of humor, my bad.

    I do. You don't think that reads as insulting?

    But, don't worry, we're okay.

    I was only reinforcing my compliment with a joke. My apologies as it was meant to be funny not serious.

  • Old_CollectorOld_Collector Posts: 137 ✭✭✭

    @seatedlib3991 said:
    This happened back in the late 1990s so may no longer be relevant. @Old_Collector but I bid on a coin at Heritage and lost. 2 days later I got an e-mail from Heritage telling me the winning bid had been dis- qualified. I was under no obligation, but if I wanted to they would award me the coin. I wanted. James

    Thank you! Good to know, there is always hope. ;)

  • ProofCollectionProofCollection Posts: 6,162 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @ianrussell said:
    Speaking from GC's standpoint, we really don't have any issue with non-payments by bidders. We do everything we can ahead of time to vet/approve bidders to stop issues occurring. We also offer flexible payment terms (our extended payment plan, for example), which helps if someone wins more than they had planned.

    The last time we had to cancel something, was actually a mechanical error (which I consider a different situation) - this was 12-18 months ago.

    • Ian

    I'm curious if a buyer uses the EPP, does that delay the seller getting their funds or do you front it?

  • wondercoinwondercoin Posts: 16,911 ✭✭✭✭✭

    ‘’We fund the extended terms with our own capital.’’

    You’ve actually got “capital” too! 😮

    Wondercoin.

    Please visit my website at www.wondercoins.com and my ebay auctions under my user name www.wondercoin.com.
  • DisneyFanDisneyFan Posts: 2,069 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @skier07 said:

    I recently had a mid four figure coin on HA “sell” and the buyer didn’t pay. The coin was relisted and sold a few months later and I took a $600 haircut. This was the first time this ever happened to me.

    Possibly the coin was returned?

  • skier07skier07 Posts: 3,973 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @DisneyFan said:

    @skier07 said:

    I recently had a mid four figure coin on HA “sell” and the buyer didn’t pay. The coin was relisted and sold a few months later and I took a $600 haircut. This was the first time this ever happened to me.

    Possibly the coin was returned?

    I don’t think HA allows returns. The buyer did not pay for the coin.

  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 46,144 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @skier07 said:

    @DisneyFan said:

    @skier07 said:

    I recently had a mid four figure coin on HA “sell” and the buyer didn’t pay. The coin was relisted and sold a few months later and I took a $600 haircut. This was the first time this ever happened to me.

    Possibly the coin was returned?

    I don’t think HA allows returns. The buyer did not pay for the coin.

    I thought most auction houses allowed returns unless it was examined and bought at the auction venue.

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
    "Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
    "Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire

  • jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 34,247 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 28, 2024 8:51AM

    @PerryHall said:

    @skier07 said:

    @DisneyFan said:

    @skier07 said:

    I recently had a mid four figure coin on HA “sell” and the buyer didn’t pay. The coin was relisted and sold a few months later and I took a $600 haircut. This was the first time this ever happened to me.

    Possibly the coin was returned?

    I don’t think HA allows returns. The buyer did not pay for the coin.

    I thought most auction houses allowed returns unless it was examined and bought at the auction venue.

    Heritage allows returns. You know how I know? They sometimes designate lots as "as is, no returns". :)

    If you read their terms and conditions pdf (it's long), they grant a 3 day return privilege on all internet only auctions. There are, allegedly, no returns on in person items except for issues of authenticity.

  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 46,144 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I can certainly understand a "no return" policy for coins that are essentially bullion such as those two raw 10P Bogota Mint coins.

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
    "Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
    "Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire

  • DocBenjaminDocBenjamin Posts: 1,452 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 28, 2024 4:38AM

    @PerryHall said:

    @skier07 said:

    @DisneyFan said:

    @skier07 said:

    I recently had a mid four figure coin on HA “sell” and the buyer didn’t pay. The coin was relisted and sold a few months later and I took a $600 haircut. This was the first time this ever happened to me.

    Possibly the coin was returned?

    I don’t think HA allows returns. The buyer did not pay for the coin.

    I thought most auction houses allowed returns unless it was examined and bought at the auction venue.

    Nope, not on the Heritage Signature auctions. As the coins are available for viewing, it is up to the buyer to either inspect the coin or have a representative do so/ In the past, Heritage if time were available, send a desired lot to the interested bidder for viewing and a quick return to the auctioneer. Don't know if that is still available and the terms if it is, but nonetheless, major auctions are not for tire kickers.

  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 46,144 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @DocBenjamin said:

    @PerryHall said:

    @skier07 said:

    @DisneyFan said:

    @skier07 said:

    I recently had a mid four figure coin on HA “sell” and the buyer didn’t pay. The coin was relisted and sold a few months later and I took a $600 haircut. This was the first time this ever happened to me.

    Possibly the coin was returned?

    I don’t think HA allows returns. The buyer did not pay for the coin.

    I thought most auction houses allowed returns unless it was examined and bought at the auction venue.

    Nope, not on the Heritage Signature auctions. As the coins are available for viewing, it is up to the buyer to either inspect the coin or have a representative do so/ In the past, Heritage if time were available, send a desired lot to the interested bidder for viewing and a quick return to the auctioneer. Don't know if that is still available and the terms if it is, but nonetheless, major auctions are not for tire kickers.

    Are you saying that someone who buys a coin based only on the seller's pics and wants a return privilege must be a "tire kicker"?

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
    "Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
    "Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire

  • DocBenjaminDocBenjamin Posts: 1,452 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @PerryHall said:

    @DocBenjamin said:

    @PerryHall said:

    @skier07 said:

    @DisneyFan said:

    @skier07 said:

    I recently had a mid four figure coin on HA “sell” and the buyer didn’t pay. The coin was relisted and sold a few months later and I took a $600 haircut. This was the first time this ever happened to me.

    Possibly the coin was returned?

    I don’t think HA allows returns. The buyer did not pay for the coin.

    I thought most auction houses allowed returns unless it was examined and bought at the auction venue.

    Nope, not on the Heritage Signature auctions. As the coins are available for viewing, it is up to the buyer to either inspect the coin or have a representative do so/ In the past, Heritage if time were available, send a desired lot to the interested bidder for viewing and a quick return to the auctioneer. Don't know if that is still available and the terms if it is, but nonetheless, major auctions are not for tire kickers.

    Are you saying that someone who buys a coin based only on the seller's pics and wants a return privilege must be a "tire kicker"?

    More than a few times I politely informed particularly discriminating Ebay customers that they would be better served to shop for coins in person and not over the net. Very short margins on properly graded PCGS holdered coins, limit the services that can be offered.

    Have always accepted returns, but the second one generally results in a block.

  • tcollectstcollects Posts: 1,058 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I've seen some coins on foreign auctions "sell" and then reappear and sell again every 6 months for years, I don't know if it's in-house shilling or deadbeat buyers. I think if you had a well-established client list, you wouldn't have to let unknowns bid, so I suspect the ones I saw were shilling, but who knows?

  • jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 34,247 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @tcollects said:

    @Coinscratch said:

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @Coinscratch said:

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @Coinscratch said:
    It’s like every thread I open up there he is spewing wisdom again. I mean where does he get all this knowledge? Apparently I’m confined to using less than 10% of my brain matter :D

    I'm not sure what your point is. Maybe I'm not using enough.

    My point is legitimate. No actual sale has taken place until payment is made. I find it unlikely that an auction house wants to pay for lots that haven't actually sold. The reductio ad absurdum argument exaggerates the point, but that is the nature of the rhetorical device.

    It was just an honest observation and nothing to do with the subject matter no reason to over think it.
    Something tells me you didn’t do so well with the ladies. 😁

    It's interesting that so many people feel free to sinply toss insults. Whatever you think my flaws may be, that's not one of them.

    Oddly, no one has even bothered to try to refute the point I made. I guess you just don't like that I'm the one who made it. There is an "ignore" function if you're bothered by my presence.

    I thought you had a sense of humor, my bad.

    for what it's worth, the ignore jmlanzaf button has saved me at least 10 minutes this week, I still see most of what he writes in the quotes but I don't have to read it twice, it's worth a try, heck, ignore me too, all I do here is cut up, I rarely provide substantial contributions

    How much do I owe you for the space in your head?

  • jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 34,247 ✭✭✭✭✭

    How much do I owe you for the space> @tcollects said:

    I've seen some coins on foreign auctions "sell" and then reappear and sell again every 6 months for years, I don't know if it's in-house shilling or deadbeat buyers. I think if you had a well-established client list, you wouldn't have to let unknowns bid, so I suspect the ones I saw were shilling, but who knows?

    Most auction houses globally have a relative simple registration requirement (email and credit card).

  • CoinscratchCoinscratch Posts: 8,663 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @tcollects said:

    @Coinscratch said:

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @Coinscratch said:

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @Coinscratch said:
    It’s like every thread I open up there he is spewing wisdom again. I mean where does he get all this knowledge? Apparently I’m confined to using less than 10% of my brain matter :D

    I'm not sure what your point is. Maybe I'm not using enough.

    My point is legitimate. No actual sale has taken place until payment is made. I find it unlikely that an auction house wants to pay for lots that haven't actually sold. The reductio ad absurdum argument exaggerates the point, but that is the nature of the rhetorical device.

    It was just an honest observation and nothing to do with the subject matter no reason to over think it.
    Something tells me you didn’t do so well with the ladies. 😁

    It's interesting that so many people feel free to sinply toss insults. Whatever you think my flaws may be, that's not one of them.

    Oddly, no one has even bothered to try to refute the point I made. I guess you just don't like that I'm the one who made it. There is an "ignore" function if you're bothered by my presence.

    I thought you had a sense of humor, my bad.

    for what it's worth, the ignore jmlanzaf button has saved me at least 10 minutes this week, I still see most of what he writes in the quotes but I don't have to read it twice, it's worth a try, heck, ignore me too, all I do here is cut up, I rarely provide substantial contributions

    I’ve used all of my ignore options for the moderators. Jokes! I keep all lines open never wanna miss an opportunity to level the playing field. 😁

  • jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 34,247 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Coinscratch said:

    @tcollects said:

    @Coinscratch said:

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @Coinscratch said:

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @Coinscratch said:
    It’s like every thread I open up there he is spewing wisdom again. I mean where does he get all this knowledge? Apparently I’m confined to using less than 10% of my brain matter :D

    I'm not sure what your point is. Maybe I'm not using enough.

    My point is legitimate. No actual sale has taken place until payment is made. I find it unlikely that an auction house wants to pay for lots that haven't actually sold. The reductio ad absurdum argument exaggerates the point, but that is the nature of the rhetorical device.

    It was just an honest observation and nothing to do with the subject matter no reason to over think it.
    Something tells me you didn’t do so well with the ladies. 😁

    It's interesting that so many people feel free to sinply toss insults. Whatever you think my flaws may be, that's not one of them.

    Oddly, no one has even bothered to try to refute the point I made. I guess you just don't like that I'm the one who made it. There is an "ignore" function if you're bothered by my presence.

    I thought you had a sense of humor, my bad.

    for what it's worth, the ignore jmlanzaf button has saved me at least 10 minutes this week, I still see most of what he writes in the quotes but I don't have to read it twice, it's worth a try, heck, ignore me too, all I do here is cut up, I rarely provide substantial contributions

    I’ve used all of my ignore options for the moderators. Jokes! I keep all lines open never wanna miss an opportunity to level the playing field. 😁

    What we need is a button that blocks other people from seeing our posts.

  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 46,144 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 28, 2024 11:07AM

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @tcollects said:

    @Coinscratch said:

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @Coinscratch said:

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @Coinscratch said:
    It’s like every thread I open up there he is spewing wisdom again. I mean where does he get all this knowledge? Apparently I’m confined to using less than 10% of my brain matter :D

    I'm not sure what your point is. Maybe I'm not using enough.

    My point is legitimate. No actual sale has taken place until payment is made. I find it unlikely that an auction house wants to pay for lots that haven't actually sold. The reductio ad absurdum argument exaggerates the point, but that is the nature of the rhetorical device.

    It was just an honest observation and nothing to do with the subject matter no reason to over think it.
    Something tells me you didn’t do so well with the ladies. 😁

    It's interesting that so many people feel free to sinply toss insults. Whatever you think my flaws may be, that's not one of them.

    Oddly, no one has even bothered to try to refute the point I made. I guess you just don't like that I'm the one who made it. There is an "ignore" function if you're bothered by my presence.

    I thought you had a sense of humor, my bad.

    for what it's worth, the ignore jmlanzaf button has saved me at least 10 minutes this week, I still see most of what he writes in the quotes but I don't have to read it twice, it's worth a try, heck, ignore me too, all I do here is cut up, I rarely provide substantial contributions

    How much do I owe you for the space in your head?

    I don't think you owe him anything since he evicted you from his head when he put you on ignore. :D

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
    "Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
    "Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire

  • jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 34,247 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @PerryHall said:

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @tcollects said:

    @Coinscratch said:

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @Coinscratch said:

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @Coinscratch said:
    It’s like every thread I open up there he is spewing wisdom again. I mean where does he get all this knowledge? Apparently I’m confined to using less than 10% of my brain matter :D

    I'm not sure what your point is. Maybe I'm not using enough.

    My point is legitimate. No actual sale has taken place until payment is made. I find it unlikely that an auction house wants to pay for lots that haven't actually sold. The reductio ad absurdum argument exaggerates the point, but that is the nature of the rhetorical device.

    It was just an honest observation and nothing to do with the subject matter no reason to over think it.
    Something tells me you didn’t do so well with the ladies. 😁

    It's interesting that so many people feel free to sinply toss insults. Whatever you think my flaws may be, that's not one of them.

    Oddly, no one has even bothered to try to refute the point I made. I guess you just don't like that I'm the one who made it. There is an "ignore" function if you're bothered by my presence.

    I thought you had a sense of humor, my bad.

    for what it's worth, the ignore jmlanzaf button has saved me at least 10 minutes this week, I still see most of what he writes in the quotes but I don't have to read it twice, it's worth a try, heck, ignore me too, all I do here is cut up, I rarely provide substantial contributions

    How much do I owe you for the space in your head?

    I don't think you owe him anything since he evicted you from his head when he put you on ignore. :D

    Actually, if you read what he wrote, he's still reading me in the quotes of others. And since he took the time to call me by name, I'm clearly still in his head.

    I'd hate to get evicted for non-payment.

  • logger7logger7 Posts: 8,522 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @PerryHall said:

    @skier07 said:

    @DisneyFan said:

    @skier07 said:

    I recently had a mid four figure coin on HA “sell” and the buyer didn’t pay. The coin was relisted and sold a few months later and I took a $600 haircut. This was the first time this ever happened to me.

    Possibly the coin was returned?

    I don’t think HA allows returns. The buyer did not pay for the coin.

    I thought most auction houses allowed returns unless it was examined and bought at the auction venue.

    Returns are a part of business on ebay for example, probably higher than the numismatic auctions.

    I know a dealer who has not done business again with Heritage after he bought a 1936 proof set with an issue not described at that time, where they later told him "no returns" on the lot.

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