CSNS Report - New Dealer Perspective
spacehayduke
Posts: 5,751 ✭✭✭✭✭
Hi Folks,
This year in retirement I switched seats. For the past 20 years in numismatics, I've been a collector. To 'rebalance' my holdings, I would sell back to dealers at the big shows for coins that were not fitting my current goals. This year, I decided I was going to switch teams as part of my evolution in numismatics. My collection simply got too big and the best way to sell the extra pieces is being on the other side of the table. Also, one of my main passions is coin photography. To grow as a photographer I need to image not only bust, seated, and barber quarters which I am collecting, but all kinds of coins. So to me it makes sense to move to the other side despite all of the non-numismatic tasks of running a buis (yikes).
So CSNS was my first show as a dealer. Here is my brief perspective on this experience. I will show some cool coin images below that were on my table, some sold, some did not, but no other pics from the floor. This transition also forced me to switch from the good old reliable and not too invasive flip phone to the latest tech with an iphone, and I have not learned yet how to get images taken from the phone to the computer (LOL). So here goes.
On Day 1, PNG day, I did not set up but just walked the floor. I was able to buy a few coins for inventory from my dealer friends who did set up. I also picked up 4 coins from CRO EB's that John brought for me instead of mailing (better way any day). These were for my few targeting and smaller collections I am keeping/building. For inventory, I picked up a P45/CAC 1834 half dime and this 3 cent piece to die for:
The tables were around 10% filled during PNG day, not too many people walking around so I had time to have good chats with some of my dealer friends. All were welcoming me to the fold and happy I made the transition. I also had some dealers pick through my inventory, which then shrunk from 91 to 85 coins and dangit if these guys didn't pick out some of my best ones that then never made it to my table. 
At 5 pm non PNG dealers were allowed to set up. Suddenly the room became full of people and hyperactivity ensued as everyone was busy getting the tables presentable. It took me about an hour, the lamps were all new and boxes and fully taped, they actually took a while to open bc I did not have a sharp tool (planes you know, not allowed). We all had to scramble for elec hookups, all of the tables around me were connected to the same outlet with a couple of multiple outlet extension cords so that took some coordination by the collective. Lucky for me I was prepped by a dealer friend and had two extension cords to connect from the outlet to my lamps. While I was setting up dealers and early birds were already active peering into my cases as I pulled coins from boxes. That 3 cent piece above? Gone in 10 minutes, held it for 2 hours and never got to image it! Dealer setup was over pretty quickly, by 7 pm everyone started to cover their cases and put the chairs over them and the room began to empty. I was also able to buy a drop dead gorgeous 1877 IC for inventory. Hey I never collected one, but now I can have the key date IC for inventory, this is cool being a dealer:
Dealer set up activity was brisk, lots of people at the table and I was busy the whole time interacting. At the end I was ready for the big show in the am.
In Day 2, first day for public, dealers and Early Bird's were let in at 8 am. The vibrant activity started right away and a flood of people washed over the floor at 10 am when the 'public' were let in. I had 20 minutes to myself over 9 hours, non-stop showing coins, selling coins, talking coins, more people than I can count at my table. Several dealers walking the floor came by to show me their wares, and I ended up buying some great coins for inventory. By the time closing came around, I was toasted but full of adrenaline with all of the activity buying, selling, and showing. Here is an @ldhair coin that he auctioned at GC that I won and sold in the morning of Day 2:
The 20s something young guy who got this was stoked. He loves colorful indian cents. He got one here.
At my table I had a range of coins at different price points. Interestingly, I think from the collectors, there was more interest in my VF barber quarters than my strongly priced gold. I was literally cleaned out of VF barbers by the end of the day, I was happy to see so much enthusiasm for these, as I still collect them and they are frankly, a total bargain in the world of numismatics.
While Day 2 was crazy, Day 3 was the opposite. The room was quieter, and dealers had mostly settled down at their tables leaving the floor for collectors. And at this show, the majority that day were tire kickers. I did have some serious collectors come by to look at different things, but only one pulled the trigger and got a great coin (old pic sorry):
The young numismatist that bought this was part of the new group of youngin's that A, seem to have money, and B, are smart as heck about numismatics. This was his second visit to see this gorgeous seated quarter, the previous day he had astutely talked me down in price below my net, but left when we were still at $150 difference for price. When he came back, I held firm at my new lower price, but darned if he didn't talk me down to his price over 10 minutes of banter between us. I still made out very well, and was glad I placed a coin with a young guy who had a passion for coins. But I think at future shows I am going to hold the line better.
I had alot of folks come by that wanted to get my super high end for the grade coins, at somewhere between wholesale and retail guides. When I could not come down that far, they walked. I was left thinking, what the heck are they thinking. do they want cool coins or not? Dealers can't sell these kinds of coins at those prices bc we can't get them ourselves at those prices. Dealers gotta make 10-20% to make a living folks. When I was in full collect mode in the past, if I found a super coin at a table, they were always for strong money as they should be, and I paid the dealer his price. You can't be cheap and think you need to get a deal if you want the best coins. Simple as that. So folks keep that in mind when you are walking the floor, there won't be any dealers left for you to buy from if they can't make a living and I can verify that from that side of the table now.
My plane is about to board so gotta go, but what a great time making this transition, I had an absolute blast, and thank all of the dealers who welcomed me and had my back over the years. Gonna be alot more fun coming.
Best, SH
Comments
Thanks for a great show report.
That was an enjoyable and insightful read, SHD. I’m looking forward to being a customer of yours because I know you recognize and appreciate great coins! Congrats on making the transition!
"Got a flaming heart, can't get my fill"
Your post confirmed three things for me:
1) You really know how to write excellent show reports.
2) You handle very nice coins.
3) You had way too much fun.😉 Keep doing that.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
Enjoyed the report. Thank you for sharing
Really cool SH. I'm happy for you. I know you have been wanting to take this step for some time. Looks like you have a great start.
Fantastic report! Not surprised those barbers disappeared to quickly!
You clearly have a great eye - love that trime!
That last paragraph was succinct and summed up the dichotomy of being a dealer/collector. It is super fun, rewarding, socially a blast, and teaches a huge amount about the market. But . .
You are exactly on target . . . you CAN'T have it both ways in numismatics!!! Either coins trade on a wholesale/retail price structure . . .or they DON'T. I see the same things. I search for the nicer pieces from Rochester NY to San Mateo, CA, but always have to 'pay up' for good quality. I pay (well, let's call it what it is) CAC guide for the best, CAC coins, or (approaching) PCGS Guide for a lot of other (nice) pieces . . . but the starting point for negotiations is always 10-20% back of Bid.
I guess if I was part of the numismatic literati I could just sit back, let schmucks like me sift through all the detritus, and then just cherry them off during the first 10 minutes of a show, take the inventory back to eBay or my own website, jack the price up to 15% over CAC Guide, hype the coin as premium beyond belief and a rare find, and sit back drinking my champagne and nibbling on fine French cheeses. A good gig if you can do it!
Hard to have it both ways guys . . . . . . . but that is the nature of the business.
Superb report . . . .and quite fun to read!
Drunner
Great write up. Any dealer that has the collector mindset is who I would love to buy coins from. Why not set up a little web page to display and sell coins. Collectors will pay those higher prices closer to retail because they are looking for quality coins, not for resale.
You will get higher prices on a website, than at a show.
Great report!
Chopmarked Trade Dollar Registry Set --- US & World Gold Showcase --- World Chopmark Showcase
An enjoyable report to read! Congrats on a great start on your journey as a coin dealer.
Love this! I can't imagine how tired I would be at the end of one of these bigger shows. I never thought about that when I was younger, but as I get older, each year mother nature makes it harder and harder.
Great report
Excellent report and thanks.
Let us know when you have a website.
Thanks for your show report.
So glad that you had a positive result becoming a dealer.
Wayne
Kennedys are my quest...
I saw a pic from your table! Great selection of bust quarters. Will you be set up at the Ana in August?
Are you a PNG dealer ?
If not how did you gain admission to PNG day ?
I give away money. I collect money.
I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.
Sorry to hear that you have been seduced by the dark side.
Thanks for your thoughts on the show.
My Collection of Old Holders
Never a slave to one plastic brand will I ever be.
I was at this show for one day and brought only dark side coins to show a few dealer
I myself am not a dealer ( but could be ) .
One coin I showed a young ( under age 21) full time dealer was very scarce high grade 8 reales from the Tilalpam Mexico mint . ( EO MO LF )
It is a monster nicely toned NGC AU 58 .
He wanted it bad. Offered me 20-25% less than I paid .
Being a young dealer I did not want to hurt his feelings so I told him it’s not for sale at this time .
He needs to learn the difference between coins for inventory and GREAT coins for investment!
One thing I’ve learned in my coin collecting journey is that GREAT coins come up infrequently….and when they do you have to be willing to pay up .
Another thing I’ve learned as a collector is holding great coins for years is the best way to insure your positive result when you get ready to sell .
I give away money. I collect money.
I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.
I'm glad you enjoyed your first show. For coins that are truly high end, you have to have your price and stick to it. I guess I've learned that over time as well (as many here have said). 10-20% back of your price or sheet = they are selling it for their price (10-20% above sheet)
Keep on truckin'!
Great write up! Thanks for sharing your experience as a new dealer.
Thanks folks for all of the nice comments, honestly I don't even know what 'back of bid' means. I've been buying cool coins at over retail guide for a decade.
I wanted to also give a shoutout to @DeplorableDan. Double D (maybe give him the nickname Double Dime, or Twenty Cents? LOL) came over to my table to say hello. At that time I was in the middle of a discussion on a bust dollar with a nice gentleman. He had great taste it was one of those 'over retail' types of gorgeous CACed bust dollars that are so hard to get. We settled on a price right at CAC retail. He then asked if he could make a trade with 2 Saints for it, a P63 and P64 (or was it a P62 and 3, I already forget). I honestly had to tell him that I could not because I have no knowledge of the Saint market - I knew that common ones in those grades weren't much more than melt but that was it. And what would I do with them after all? So it looked like the deal was not going to happen and the gentleman visually dropped his shoulders several inches in disappointment! But wait - DD came to the rescue - he advised the gentleman that indeed he could get melt or maybe $50 above for each, and where in the room he could do that. That gave the gentleman confidence on buying the bust dollar and the deal was done. Thanks DD (or TC? LOL) for helping out. It was like a scene from Pawn Stars where Rick calls in the expert to advise on value in order to do the deal with the customer!
Best, SH
Mr. Perkins was over to get the pic to entice you
I will be set up at ANA. Remarkably, my whole run of P45/CAC, perfect XF small bust quarters were barely even looked at. Just a few years back I couldn't find even a single CBQ CACed on the floor. Got to get the right crowd I guess.........
Great seeing you @spacehayduke !
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Hey Spacehayduke - great report and congrats to your first show. I wanted to be there but I was under the weather. Catch you at the next show. Best of luck.
Thanks for a really interesting and entertaining report. Look forward to more in the future! Enjoy "retirement!"
Likewise, great times, CU@ANA
No worries, we will see you soon and do bust dimes, UHR sold me some great stuff.................
Congrats on the new endeavor. I do miss it. You'll find that both the hunt and the sell are equally thrilling. Your new challenge will be educating yourself as quickly as possible on the series you aren't as intimately familiar with as those you had a passion for as a collector.. GL! You've entered a whole new world.. And nice 77!!
Congrats on a successful show as a dealer!
Sounds like it was A great time.
BHNC #248 … 130 and counting.
Enjoyable read. You have the demeanor that customers will gravitate to your table once word gets around more. Should serve you well going forward. Best of luck to you in your future shows.
@spacehayduke, congrats on taking it to the next level! I'm happy for you... and appreciate your well-written show report!
New website: Groovycoins.com Capped Bust Half Dime registry set: Bikergeek CBHD LM Set
Thanks for your great report.
Congratulations on taking the leap. I can imagine the emotion you went though on your first set-up. It must have been somewhat exhausting and exhilarating at the same time. I also assume that trying to maintain a decent inventory at a price that makes continuing setting up at shows your next hurdle. Good luck on your future endeavors.
Mark
Dealers with a table for CSNS had two options, set up their table on dealer day for a fee, or pay 1/3 of the price of a table for the day and be able to walk the floor. I chose the latter, then waited to 5 pm for the official dealer set up time to set up. Worked out fine.
Another bourse story. One 20s-ish guy came by with a double row box of Morgans to sell, ranging from blast white to stunning Aurora Borealis colors. Really a nice focus. Most of them were not CAC and that is my focus for new purchases. But a really nice group with wide range of prices scaling with eye appeal. Problem was as I told him, I don't understand at all the 'color' market for Morgans, so I really could not buy his best. He is clearly a specialist in this field. l had around 10 Morgans in fattys and rattlers, all CACed, ranging from blast white to nicely toned and two with strong color. Looking at the auctions on GC I tried to value mine in line with the prices there vs. level of toning/color. So I did not buy from him given my limited knowledge. But, he liked my two toned ones and he added that to his group. I bought these old holdered Morgans a decade ago, hand picking 64's from boxes and boxes on the bourse, at pretty much wholesale or just above. None were CAC but every one I picked beaned. I am able now to let them go for a good price to buyers given the increase on common ones, and he cherry picked the best 2, hope he scores strongly with them in his market. Always happy to help out the young dealers..............
Best, SH