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Grading Whimsey: Put into words a good definition of the MS-70 Grade.

I have been posting in the "Commercial Grading" discussion. Perfessional members say that a grade cannot be defined p[recisely enough to have a standard, I disagree, Let's start out with another easy grade, MS-70. I'd like to read what you think the characteristics of an MS-70 coin are (general, no particular coin type). Hopefully, I'll bet we can agree on this one. LOL, I'd lose.
Describe its luster, marks, and eye appeal. does the strike matter for an MS-70? What about tiny Mint-made imperfections. Everyone welcome especially grading seminar students/instructors, Professional graders and dealers and these members posting in that discussion:

@FlyingAl
@MarkFeld
@jmlanzaf
@Rexford
@CaptHenway
@Catbert
@1nsider3
@Goldfinger
@PerryHall

Comments

  • jacrispiesjacrispies Posts: 711 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 29, 2024 12:22PM

    Duplicate Thread!!!

    Edit: Just kidding!

    "For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord" Romans 6:23. Young fellow suffering from Bust Half fever.

  • FrazFraz Posts: 1,796 ✭✭✭✭✭

    This is one-fourth of your semester grade; due today.

  • jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 31,828 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 20, 2024 6:16AM

    Most people can't tell the difference between a 69 and a 70. But even if you can define 70 as "flawless" how does that help you with the other 40 grades?

  • BillJonesBillJones Posts: 33,472 ✭✭✭✭✭

    MS or PR-70 = Perfect

    There are no marks of spots of any kind. Furthermore the coin is perfectly struck. There are no weak spots in the design. For example a Jefferson Nickel without full steps cannot be an MS-70. This means that many coin design types do not exist in MS-70. Virtually no examples were perfectly stuck, and the few that were have since been damaged in a way that disqualifies them.

    I have one PR-70 coin in my collection. I bought it to say that I have one, and it was not excessively expensive. I paid $35 for a $5 coin.

    Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
  • oldabeintxoldabeintx Posts: 1,621 ✭✭✭✭✭

    A chimera. Seven parts reality, 3 parts promotion.

  • NeophyteNumismatistNeophyteNumismatist Posts: 871 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Indecipherable from MS69

    I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.

  • @jmlanzaf said:
    Most people can't tell the difference between a 69 and a 70. But even if you can define 70 as "flawless" how does that help you with the other 40 grades?

    One grade at a time. I started at the highest and lowest. Flawless is a good answer. And that means flawless, not with tiny strike through lint marks and not with only 5X or naked eyes.

  • @jacrispies said:
    Duplicate Thread!!!

    Actually not. Read the large print in the title.

  • humanssuckhumanssuck Posts: 316 ✭✭✭✭✭

    No imperfections found, even with a neutron microscope.

  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 45,382 ✭✭✭✭✭

    At one time the grade of MS70 was never used because it was a theoretical grade for a coin that is totally perfect which of course doesn't exist in the real world. Later, the slabbing companies changed the definition of MS70 to coins without any visible flaws under 5X magnification.

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.

  • jacrispiesjacrispies Posts: 711 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Married2Coins said:

    @jacrispies said:
    Duplicate Thread!!!

    Actually not. Read the large print in the title.

    Oops! My bad😢

    "For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord" Romans 6:23. Young fellow suffering from Bust Half fever.

  • MFeldMFeld Posts: 12,007 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I think 70 is the only grade of 60 or higher that lends itself to a workable written definition. But such a definition (like "perfect" or "flawless") would essentially render the grade useless in this industry. Because if the definition were to be honored, there wouldn't be nearly enough coins to make use of it.

    Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.

  • Married2CoinsMarried2Coins Posts: 211 ✭✭✭

    @MFeld said:
    I think 70 is the only grade of 60 or higher that lends itself to a workable written definition. But such a definition (like "perfect" or "flawless") would essentially render the grade useless in this industry. Because if the definition were to be honored, there wouldn't be nearly enough coins to make use of it.

    I appreciate that you are postinhg with me and I think you just revealed to everyone one of the problems with grading.

    The fact that MS-70 is the easiest grade to define (if we consider it's "as made" so strike is not involved) so that the coin is "perfect" or "flawless," then the number of coins that actually make that grade SHOULD HAVE NO BERING ON THAT GRADE at all! That way imperfect coins would not be called MS-70 to fill a demand. There is a rumor that dealers expext a certain number of MS-70 SE to come out of an unopened "Monsrer Box" when it is graded. I'd like to know what it is. I do know that I will not buy an MS-70 graded SE sight unseen for that reason.

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