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1804 13 Stars 10C . ANACS VS NGC grading .

ANACS graded coin this way .......................

NGC graded coin this way ..................

Comments

  • wow what a difference

  • erwindocerwindoc Posts: 4,894 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Im not convinced that is the same coin.

  • ManorcourtmanManorcourtman Posts: 7,883 ✭✭✭✭

    Here's the NGC glamour shot.....

  • FredFFredF Posts: 526 ✭✭✭

    @erwindoc said:
    Im not convinced that is the same coin.

    Parmellee is mentioned in the original auction description and cited on the NGC holder.

    Successful BST (me as buyer) with: Collectorcoins, PipestonePete, JasonRiffeRareCoins

  • DeplorableDanDeplorableDan Posts: 2,474 ✭✭✭✭✭

    It’s the same coin. You can tell by the staining? In the left obverse field when you look closely.

  • @erwindoc said:
    Im not convinced that is the same coin.

    It's 100% the EXACT same coin . I have followed the sale of this coins through several auctions .

  • Walkerguy21DWalkerguy21D Posts: 11,051 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @1peter1223 said:

    @erwindoc said:
    Im not convinced that is the same coin.

    It's 100% the EXACT same coin . I have followed the sale of this coins through several auctions .

    It looks like it was smoothed or something, prior to sending to NGC.
    The ANACS coin looks more detailed and the scratches more prominent.

    Successful BST transactions with 170 members. Recent: Tonedeaf, Shane6596, Piano1, Ikenefic, RG, PCGSPhoto, stman, Don'tTelltheWife, Boosibri, Ron1968, snowequities, VTchaser, jrt103, SurfinxHI, 78saen, bp777, FHC, RYK, JTHawaii, Opportunity, Kliao, bigtime36, skanderbeg, split37, thebigeng, acloco, Toninginthblood, OKCC, braddick, Coinflip, robcool, fastfreddie, tightbudget, DBSTrader2, nickelsciolist, relaxn, Eagle eye, soldi, silverman68, ElKevvo, sawyerjosh, Schmitz7, talkingwalnut2, konsole, sharkman987, sniocsu, comma, jesbroken, David1234, biosolar, Sullykerry, Moldnut, erwindoc, MichaelDixon, GotTheBug
  • oih82w8oih82w8 Posts: 11,796 ✭✭✭✭✭

    But, will it sell on ebay? Doubtful, at least not at that asking price.

    oih82w8 = Oh I Hate To Wait _defectus patientia_aka...Dr. Defecto - Curator of RMO's

    BST transactions: dbldie55, jayPem, 78saen, UltraHighRelief, nibanny, liefgold, FallGuy, lkeigwin, mbogoman, Sandman70gt, keets, joeykoins, ianrussell (@GC), EagleEye, ThePennyLady, GRANDAM, Ilikecolor, Gluggo, okiedude, Voyageur, LJenkins11, fastfreddie, ms70, pursuitofliberty, ZoidMeister,...
  • DeplorableDanDeplorableDan Posts: 2,474 ✭✭✭✭✭

    You can't polish a .... hmmm 🤔.....I guess you can 😂.

  • RichieURichRichieURich Posts: 8,346 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Big markup just for resubmitting the coin!

    An authorized PCGS dealer, and a contributor to the Red Book.

  • BillJonesBillJones Posts: 33,364 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @RichieURich said:
    Big markup just for resubmitting the coin!

    That what can happen when you lose the "details" grade.

    The thing that amazes me is what people are paying from scarce coins with the details grade. They'll pay $50,000 or more. If I show up with that kind of money, I don't want problems.

    Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
  • slider23slider23 Posts: 634 ✭✭✭✭

    Here are some Heritage photos taken in 2013 and it sold for over 30K at that time. My opinion the coin has not been messed with looking at the photos from Heritage. NGC simple put the coin into a straight grade holder.

    NGC Photo



  • DeplorableDanDeplorableDan Posts: 2,474 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @slider23 said:
    Here are some Heritage photos taken in 2013 and it sold for over 30K at that time. My opinion the coin has not been messed with looking at the photos from Heritage. NGC simple put the coin into a straight grade holder.

    NGC Photo



    In my opinion, it looks cleaned and scratched. I agree with ANACS.

  • slider23slider23 Posts: 634 ✭✭✭✭

    @DeplorableDan said:
    In my opinion, it looks cleaned and scratched. I agree with ANACS.

    I also agree with ANACS. My point was it does not appear to be messed with to smooth over the scratches between the crack out of the ANACS holder and regrade at NGC.

  • DeplorableDanDeplorableDan Posts: 2,474 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @slider23 said:

    @DeplorableDan said:
    In my opinion, it looks cleaned and scratched. I agree with ANACS.

    I also agree with ANACS. My point was it does not appear to be messed with to smooth over the scratches between the crack out of the ANACS holder and regrade at NGC.

    Ahh I see now, thanks for the clarity.

  • COINS MAKE CENTSCOINS MAKE CENTS Posts: 1,786 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Sorry, that coin should be in a details holder.

    New inventory added daily at Coins Make Cents
    HAPPY COLLECTING


  • Walkerguy21DWalkerguy21D Posts: 11,051 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @slider23 said:

    @DeplorableDan said:
    In my opinion, it looks cleaned and scratched. I agree with ANACS.

    I also agree with ANACS. My point was it does not appear to be messed with to smooth over the scratches between the crack out of the ANACS holder and regrade at NGC.

    I still contend it was. Compare the hair details and ear, they look sharper and more rounded in the old photos.
    The ends of the hair curls are readily apparent in the old pic, and totally missing in the new pics.

    Successful BST transactions with 170 members. Recent: Tonedeaf, Shane6596, Piano1, Ikenefic, RG, PCGSPhoto, stman, Don'tTelltheWife, Boosibri, Ron1968, snowequities, VTchaser, jrt103, SurfinxHI, 78saen, bp777, FHC, RYK, JTHawaii, Opportunity, Kliao, bigtime36, skanderbeg, split37, thebigeng, acloco, Toninginthblood, OKCC, braddick, Coinflip, robcool, fastfreddie, tightbudget, DBSTrader2, nickelsciolist, relaxn, Eagle eye, soldi, silverman68, ElKevvo, sawyerjosh, Schmitz7, talkingwalnut2, konsole, sharkman987, sniocsu, comma, jesbroken, David1234, biosolar, Sullykerry, Moldnut, erwindoc, MichaelDixon, GotTheBug
  • slider23slider23 Posts: 634 ✭✭✭✭

    @Walkerguy21D said:

    @slider23 said:

    @DeplorableDan said:
    In my opinion, it looks cleaned and scratched. I agree with ANACS.

    I also agree with ANACS. My point was it does not appear to be messed with to smooth over the scratches between the crack out of the ANACS holder and regrade at NGC.

    I still contend it was. Compare the hair details and ear, they look sharper and more rounded in the old photos.
    The ends of the hair curls are readily apparent in the old pic, and totally missing in the new pics.

    I can not argue with you on the hair detail as there is a difference between the 2013 photo and the NGC photo. You may be correct that the coin was smoothed, but how photos are taken plays such a large part on what we see in the image.

  • scubafuelscubafuel Posts: 1,713 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I would think a coin like this is less likely to be messed with, for practical reasons. It’s a well known coin with a long pedigree where the damage has been repeatedly catalogued.
    If you are a skilled coin doc, this is a bad bet and will be quickly noticed. Better to take a more “anonymous” damaged coin (there are many) and work on it instead.

    That said, the later photos are definitely more favorable to the coin.

  • NysotoNysoto Posts: 3,751 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I won't speculate if the coin was doctored without seeing it. There are two 1804 dimes on eBay in graded NGC slabs that were previously in genuine or details slabs. All circulated coins have scratches, some draped bust coins are far worse than OP that are toned over, graded, slabbed, and stickered (could show examples). The 1804 dime is more rare than a 1794 dollar or 1796/97 half dollars. I liked the old net grading of ANACS, and EAC grading, as some, or most early US coins have an issue that could use a net grade to some extent, without casting off the coin to a one point details slab.

    Robert Scot: Engraving Liberty - biography of US Mint's first chief engraver

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