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Chaim Bloom Red Sox GM fired

craig44craig44 Posts: 10,267 ✭✭✭✭✭

Title says it all. lasted 4 years. Maybe the empty seats at Fenway during a Yankees series has ownership thinking a change needs to happen.

George Brett, Bobby Orr and Terry Bradshaw.

Comments

  • BillJonesBillJones Posts: 33,373 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Empty seats? That would do it.

    When I moved from Massachusetts, you couldn’t get a seat in Fenway. Now they are going begging for a Yankees - Red Sox series. Unbelievable, even if both teams are vying for last place and out of the play-offs.

    I would think that the Yankees and Mets GMs won’t be far behind. They got the least out of a lot this year. I couldn’t believe it when I heard the Mets’ payroll was larger than the Yankees.

    Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
  • erikthredderikthredd Posts: 7,897 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I don't follow the Sox like I used to but this really isn't a surprise when they've been letting go of to much talent in recent years. IIRC the only players still on the roster from that 2018 championship winning roster are Sale & Devers. Its one thing to turnover the roster but they let a lot of high end talent walk out the door in Betts,Benintendi,Bradley Jr,Martinez & Boegarts not to mention numerous pitchers who played pivotal roles in winning that WS.

    At some point in recent years the Sox ownership decided to play it out as if they're a small market team and this is the result of that.

  • Basebal21Basebal21 Posts: 1,861 ✭✭✭✭

    @erikthredd said:
    I don't follow the Sox like I used to but this really isn't a surprise when they've been letting go of to much talent in recent years. IIRC the only players still on the roster from that 2018 championship winning roster are Sale & Devers. Its one thing to turnover the roster but they let a lot of high end talent walk out the door in Betts,Benintendi,Bradley Jr,Martinez & Boegarts not to mention numerous pitchers who played pivotal roles in winning that WS.

    At some point in recent years the Sox ownership decided to play it out as if they're a small market team and this is the result of that.

    Bradley Jr is a below average talent and not even close to high end. Benintendi is average at best.

    Its not entirely his fault as he was brought in to cut payroll. I did see this coming, he just got fired sooner than I expected. His trades were mostly bad and really there best players were all there before he got there.

    Hopefully SD learns a lesson from this and does the same thing

  • erikthredderikthredd Posts: 7,897 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Basebal21 said:

    @erikthredd said:
    I don't follow the Sox like I used to but this really isn't a surprise when they've been letting go of to much talent in recent years. IIRC the only players still on the roster from that 2018 championship winning roster are Sale & Devers. Its one thing to turnover the roster but they let a lot of high end talent walk out the door in Betts,Benintendi,Bradley Jr,Martinez & Boegarts not to mention numerous pitchers who played pivotal roles in winning that WS.

    At some point in recent years the Sox ownership decided to play it out as if they're a small market team and this is the result of that.

    Bradley Jr is a below average talent and not even close to high end. Benintendi is average at best.

    Its not entirely his fault as he was brought in to cut payroll. I did see this coming, he just got fired sooner than I expected. His trades were mostly bad and really there best players were all there before he got there.

    Hopefully SD learns a lesson from this and does the same thing

    I honeslty haven't watched them since that WS run in 2018 and just kept up with the team since then thru fans comments online & STR and most complaints about how the team moved on from all these players that helped them win a WS. Bradley Jr (Defense) & Benintendi (offense) both played their role well at the time placed around the better hitters in their lineup.

    It really all started when they decided that Mookie Betts wasn't worth extending then from there it seems like all of their best players are now long except Devers,who just signed a longterm deal here, and Chris Sale,who they're pretty much stuck with at his salary.

    Boston fans are fical,we know when teams are half-assing it and when they're actually trying to put a contender out there and with the Sox,especially their ownership, it seems like they're more interested in keeping payroll down more than anything. I don't blame Bloom for that,its all John Henry.

  • Basebal21Basebal21 Posts: 1,861 ✭✭✭✭

    @erikthredd said:

    @Basebal21 said:

    @erikthredd said:
    I don't follow the Sox like I used to but this really isn't a surprise when they've been letting go of to much talent in recent years. IIRC the only players still on the roster from that 2018 championship winning roster are Sale & Devers. Its one thing to turnover the roster but they let a lot of high end talent walk out the door in Betts,Benintendi,Bradley Jr,Martinez & Boegarts not to mention numerous pitchers who played pivotal roles in winning that WS.

    At some point in recent years the Sox ownership decided to play it out as if they're a small market team and this is the result of that.

    Bradley Jr is a below average talent and not even close to high end. Benintendi is average at best.

    Its not entirely his fault as he was brought in to cut payroll. I did see this coming, he just got fired sooner than I expected. His trades were mostly bad and really there best players were all there before he got there.

    Hopefully SD learns a lesson from this and does the same thing

    I honeslty haven't watched them since that WS run in 2018 and just kept up with the team since then thru fans comments online & STR and most complaints about how the team moved on from all these players that helped them win a WS. Bradley Jr (Defense) & Benintendi (offense) both played their role well at the time placed around the better hitters in their lineup.

    It really all started when they decided that Mookie Betts wasn't worth extending then from there it seems like all of their best players are now long except Devers,who just signed a longterm deal here, and Chris Sale,who they're pretty much stuck with at his salary.

    Boston fans are fical,we know when teams are half-assing it and when they're actually trying to put a contender out there and with the Sox,especially their ownership, it seems like they're more interested in keeping payroll down more than anything. I don't blame Bloom for that,its all John Henry.

    Bloom does deserve blame. Its not entirely his fault with the Henry group being more focused on buying the Penguins, a Nascar team, and focusing on the Premier league for soccer, but he still has blame. Tampa let him go because they knew he wasnt the guy and Boston wanted him thinking he could run a lower payroll team.

    Mookie was used as a trading chip to unload Price. Without Price they could have gotten a better return, but they valued getting rid of Price more than getting the best return.

    Benintendi was a flash in the pan. He had one good year in 2017 and an average year in 2018 with a very quick decline. He was never a guy you build a team around and was basically a role player. Hes hitting .266 slugging .365 in a 138 games for the White Sox this year.

    Bradly Jr is one of the most over hyped players maybe ever from Boston fans. Hes a career .225/.303/.397 hitter who stole more than 8 bases in a season once. His defense is like the fishing stories of someone actually catching a 3 pound fish and the story turns into a 20 pounder. CF in Boston is insanely easy to play, theres very little ground to cover. The monster kicks balls back to CF and RF and LF are so short they both pinch the gaps giving even less room to cover. The only thing to worry about is where the bullpen in right center pops out but other than that its the smallest outfield to cover in MLB. Theres hundreds of guys in the minors and college that could play defense just as well as him if not better that also cant hit.

    A team has serious issues if Benintendi or Brady Jr is a significant part of it

  • perkdogperkdog Posts: 29,210 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Make sure the door hits you in the rear end when you leave Mr Bloom

  • stevekstevek Posts: 27,470 ✭✭✭✭✭

    See if Billy Beane is available.

  • MCMLVToppsMCMLVTopps Posts: 4,565 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Predicted long ago that the Bloomer was on thin ice. His decisions were ill conceived, and he allowed key players to leave the team. I agree that JBJ was way over-hyped, no loss there. When the team ends up in the cellar on a consistent basis, the sabermetric decisions made by Bloom sealed his fate. I would only hope that Cora is not far behind. Keep in mind that half the season is played in Fenway, where in left field under the monster is the American League East scoreboard. Having to look at those standings while sitting directly across from it are demoralizing to say the leastc seeing the team 18-20 games back has to have an impact. While John Henry may have his focus elsewhere, it is his team and his decisions. Probably enough blame to go around, but the Bloomer gets the lion's share of poor decisions.

  • TabeTabe Posts: 5,905 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Basebal21 said:

    Bradly Jr is one of the most over hyped players maybe ever from Boston fans. Hes a career .225/.303/.397 hitter who stole more than 8 bases in a season once.

    Hey, hey, hey - he got to 9 once besides the 17 in 2018. That makes ALL the difference.

  • daltexdaltex Posts: 3,461 ✭✭✭✭✭

    People really misunderstand the Bloom era in Boston. It's not like he's sliced payroll all that much. I mean any consideration about making a run for the third wild card by bringing on payroll was tempered by the thought of going back into the luxury tax. I mean he brought in at eight figures the likes of Corey Kluber and Garrett Richards, as well as the underwhelming Trevor Story, Kenley Jansen, and Matsuzaka Yoshida, and the inexplicable Jackie Bradley trade where, after having had him leave as a free agent, they brought him back along with a 23-year-old corner infielder who is yet to spend a day in AAA and David Hamilton whose 22 OPS+ MUST be a typo in exchange for Hunter Renfroe who was at least competent offensively. Bradley, you may recall, was paid $9.5m to play 91 games for the Sox and another $8m to go away. Oh, and Bradley was 32 at the time of the trade while there has been exactly one CF in history who has been good defensively after age 30, Willie Mays, though Kiermaier may become the second.

    My diagnosis is that Bloom was hired with the idea that his genius (assumed genius) for developing young talent and finding diamonds in the rough (such as Garrett Whitlock appeared to be his first year and part of the second combined with a sizeable payroll opportunity to go after the talent he couldn't have dreamed of with the Rays would cause the Sox to do even better than the Rays have. I suppose we can all have our hypotheses as to why it's been a miserable failure.

    It's not unreasonable to expect Kluber and Paxton to make up for what he sacrificed in Eovaldi, or that Jansen might have been ever than circa 2021 Barnes. Didn't happen. Not because he didn't have money to spend.

  • MCMLVToppsMCMLVTopps Posts: 4,565 ✭✭✭✭✭

    There's a book titled "Francona" The Red Sox Years, by Terry Francona and Dan Shaughnessy.

    Its a great and easy read and allows the reader to experience behind the scenes of everyday life he experienced as a Red Sox manager. Francona put up with a ton of crap from management, but his bond with Theo Epstein helped him keep his sanity. Juggling the nuances of players, especially Manny Ramirez and Pedro Martinez is an eye opener. He was always putting out fires.

  • tommyrusty7tommyrusty7 Posts: 1,708 ✭✭✭✭

    Management has always been a problem from the time Yawkey owned them to the present day.
    There are too many people involved in the decision making process and they all want to be the one that thinks his or her way is the way to go.
    Put that together with players attitudes and you have a big problem for any manager to deal with.

  • Basebal21Basebal21 Posts: 1,861 ✭✭✭✭

    @stevek said:
    See if Billy Beane is available.

    Billy Bean is highly overrated as well. They didnt win because of money ball, they won because they had Tejada, Chavez, Mulder, Hudson, Zito, Jermaine Dye etc. If anything those loaded rosters under performed.

    That said he legally cant work for anyone but the As. He owns something like 4% of the team (maybe more by now) and would have to sell his stake in the team before another team could hire him even if he were to get fired

  • Basebal21Basebal21 Posts: 1,861 ✭✭✭✭

    @Tabe said:

    @Basebal21 said:

    Bradly Jr is one of the most over hyped players maybe ever from Boston fans. Hes a career .225/.303/.397 hitter who stole more than 8 bases in a season once.

    Hey, hey, hey - he got to 9 once besides the 17 in 2018. That makes ALL the difference.

    Haha you sold me on the hype lol

  • tommyrusty7tommyrusty7 Posts: 1,708 ✭✭✭✭

    What is Ohtani doing at Logan airport after cleaning out his locker in California?

  • MCMLVToppsMCMLVTopps Posts: 4,565 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @tommyrusty7 said:
    What is Ohtani doing at Logan airport after cleaning out his locker in California?

    Why do you bite on such nonsense? Can you post a reference? Furthermore, who cares? I suspect he's in Japan, NOT Boston.

    Another pathetic and dismal performance by the Red Sox team and Cora. As predicited long ago, the season was lost somewhere in June. Bloom was over his skis and the handwriting was on the wall when Bogaerts, etal departed for the West coast. The milk toast manager must go as well, but I know he has another year on his contract. Almost every phase of Red Sox team play this year has been lacking, 2024 will be equally as bad.

  • Basebal21Basebal21 Posts: 1,861 ✭✭✭✭

    @MCMLVTopps said:

    @tommyrusty7 said:
    What is Ohtani doing at Logan airport after cleaning out his locker in California?

    Why do you bite on such nonsense? Can you post a reference? Furthermore, who cares? I suspect he's in Japan, NOT Boston.

    Hes likely in LA, Neil ElAttache is there who did his TJ surgery and hes planning on getting his elbow surgery done soon. Theres only like 3 or 4 guys the MLB players use for UCL surgeries. It may or may not need to be a full TJ we dont know yet but he plans on being ready to hit by opening day. The oblique injury just made it an easy decision to shut it down.

  • craig44craig44 Posts: 10,267 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I think it is usually better for these guys to just hurry up and get the surgery. half of them spend 6 months trying to rehab their way out of it, but it never works and they just end up losing another season

    George Brett, Bobby Orr and Terry Bradshaw.

  • BillJonesBillJones Posts: 33,373 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @craig44 said:
    I think it is usually better for these guys to just hurry up and get the surgery. half of them spend 6 months trying to rehab their way out of it, but it never works and they just end up losing another season

    Look at it this way. They can’t play, but they still get paid.

    Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
  • Basebal21Basebal21 Posts: 1,861 ✭✭✭✭

    @BillJones said:

    @craig44 said:
    I think it is usually better for these guys to just hurry up and get the surgery. half of them spend 6 months trying to rehab their way out of it, but it never works and they just end up losing another season

    Look at it this way. They can’t play, but they still get paid.

    Whether they get surgery or rehab they get paid the same. Baseball contracts are guaranteed

  • Basebal21Basebal21 Posts: 1,861 ✭✭✭✭

    @craig44 said:
    I think it is usually better for these guys to just hurry up and get the surgery. half of them spend 6 months trying to rehab their way out of it, but it never works and they just end up losing another season

    It was a tough spot for Othani. He had 44 Hrs and his last game was 9-3. He had a shot at cracking 50 or maybe even 60 if he got hot. The Japanese players also grew up much more as team first guys so theres some cultural aspect to it. Money as well. Japan would broadcast every single Angels game he is so big over there, now that hes out they stopped showing them. But yea in terms of performance just shutting it down when the MRI came back and worrying about next year would have been the best move

  • BillJonesBillJones Posts: 33,373 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I get sense from those who follow the Red Sox regularly that owner John Henry has decided to thrown in the competitive towel and put a run of the mill product on the field. The Red Sox have had other eras like this. Tom Yawkey was that way after he spent millions on the team in the late 1930s. The 1950s through the mid ‘60s were pretty dreadful.

    Fans from the ‘80s remember when the let Carlton Fisk walk citing some nonsense about how they couldn’t mail his contract on time. The real answer was the management didn’t want to pay him and figured the fans would still come if they went out and got Andre Dawson who had two bad knees.

    I guess the Red Sox are going to be a dull “small market team” until they get a new owner.

    Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
  • craig44craig44 Posts: 10,267 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @BillJones said:
    I get sense from those who follow the Red Sox regularly that owner John Henry has decided to thrown in the competitive towel and put a run of the mill product on the field. The Red Sox have had other eras like this. Tom Yawkey was that way after he spent millions on the team in the late 1930s. The 1950s through the mid ‘60s were pretty dreadful.

    Fans from the ‘80s remember when the let Carlton Fisk walk citing some nonsense about how they couldn’t mail his contract on time. The real answer was the management didn’t want to pay him and figured the fans would still come if they went out and got Andre Dawson who had two bad knees.

    I guess the Red Sox are going to be a dull “small market team” until they get a new owner.

    I dont know. The local talk radio guys I listen to are thinking that firing Bloom and the horrible attendance figures are going to push Henry into the free agent market. Big time. We shall see. I say, spend it all. The owner is a billionaire.

    George Brett, Bobby Orr and Terry Bradshaw.

  • Basebal21Basebal21 Posts: 1,861 ✭✭✭✭

    @craig44 said:

    @BillJones said:
    I get sense from those who follow the Red Sox regularly that owner John Henry has decided to thrown in the competitive towel and put a run of the mill product on the field. The Red Sox have had other eras like this. Tom Yawkey was that way after he spent millions on the team in the late 1930s. The 1950s through the mid ‘60s were pretty dreadful.

    Fans from the ‘80s remember when the let Carlton Fisk walk citing some nonsense about how they couldn’t mail his contract on time. The real answer was the management didn’t want to pay him and figured the fans would still come if they went out and got Andre Dawson who had two bad knees.

    I guess the Red Sox are going to be a dull “small market team” until they get a new owner.

    I dont know. The local talk radio guys I listen to are thinking that firing Bloom and the horrible attendance figures are going to push Henry into the free agent market. Big time. We shall see. I say, spend it all. The owner is a billionaire.

    Hes more than a billionaire. The Fenway Sports group is one of the richest ownership groups in the world also owning the Penguins, Liverpool, a Nascar team and others. Henry has a 40% stake so he cant act unilaterally but usually gets what he wants. I'm not sure they will be willing to give the keys to the kingdom to a new GM in the first year given the state of the team

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