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Is it possible to ask PCGS to regrade a coin from MS64+ to MS64?

Herb_THerb_T Posts: 1,754 ✭✭✭✭✭
in U.S. Coin Forum

Asking for a friend…

Comments

  • 1madman1madman Posts: 1,515 ✭✭✭✭✭

    You’re either gonna have to submit under the guarantee service and see if they downgrade it, or crack it out and submit raw. Best chance will be to submit raw, because plus grades are tough to get. Downside might be the coin actually upgrades to a ms65.

  • JerseyBJerseyB Posts: 130 ✭✭✭

    Why?

  • ConnecticoinConnecticoin Posts: 12,949 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Mint State Everyman Set?

    *For Sale on Numismy* *For Sale on Ebay*
  • oih82w8oih82w8 Posts: 12,351 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I would trade/sell for a MS64...unless it had tremendous eye appeal.

    oih82w8 = Oh I Hate To Wait _defectus patientia_aka...Dr. Defecto - Curator of RMO's

    BST transactions: dbldie55, jayPem, 78saen, UltraHighRelief, nibanny, liefgold, FallGuy, lkeigwin, mbogoman, Sandman70gt, keets, joeykoins, ianrussell (@GC), EagleEye, ThePennyLady, GRANDAM, Ilikecolor, Gluggo, okiedude, Voyageur, LJenkins11, fastfreddie, ms70, pursuitofliberty, ZoidMeister,Coin Finder, GotTheBug, edwardjulio, Coinnmore, Nickpatton, Namvet69,...
  • JerseyBJerseyB Posts: 130 ✭✭✭

    @Connecticoin said:
    Mint State Everyman Set?

    64+ doesn't qualify for everyman sets?

  • TrampTramp Posts: 704 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited June 27, 2023 6:41PM

    @JerseyB said:

    @Connecticoin said:
    Mint State Everyman Set?

    64+ doesn't qualify for everyman sets?

    Correct! More correctly, they don't qualify for the Everyman Mint State.

    USAF (Ret.) 1985 - 2005. E-4B Aircraft Maintenance Crew Chief and Contracting Officer.
    My current Registry sets:
    ✓ Everyman Mint State Carson City Morgan Dollars (1878 – 1893)
    ✓ Everyman Mint State Lincoln Cents (1909 – 1958)
    ✓ Morgan Dollar GSA Hoard (1878 – 1891)

  • jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 35,135 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Tramp said:

    @JerseyB said:

    @Connecticoin said:
    Mint State Everyman Set?

    64+ doesn't qualify for everyman sets?

    Correct! More correctly, they don't qualify for the Everyman Mint State.

    If this is the reason for the OP downgrade...smh.

  • maymay Posts: 1,590 ✭✭✭✭✭

    They’re probably trying to sticker it.

    Type collector, mainly into Seated. -formerly Ownerofawheatiehorde. Good BST transactions with: mirabela, OKCC, MICHAELDIXON, Gerard

  • david3142david3142 Posts: 3,562 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Ownerofawheatiehorde said:
    They’re probably trying to sticker it.

    That would make sense going from 64 to 63+ but CAC ignores the plus so a 64 doesn’t have a better chance than a 64+ (and it’s probably worse).

  • ZoinsZoins Posts: 34,353 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited June 27, 2023 7:16PM

    @DeplorableDan said:

    @Ownerofawheatiehorde said:
    They’re probably trying to sticker it.

    A + grade by PCGS or NGC has no bearing on CAC's decision to sticker the coin, they ignore that and treat the coin as a 64.

    Agree. The sticker would be the same for a MS64 and MS64+ since it doesn't take the + into consideration.

    Private Mint News | 2010 Lincoln Reverse Finalists
  • maymay Posts: 1,590 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Wow, lots of ping at once. :D

    Type collector, mainly into Seated. -formerly Ownerofawheatiehorde. Good BST transactions with: mirabela, OKCC, MICHAELDIXON, Gerard

  • maymay Posts: 1,590 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Zoins said:

    @DeplorableDan said:

    @Ownerofawheatiehorde said:
    They’re probably trying to sticker it.

    A + grade by PCGS or NGC has no bearing on CAC's decision to sticker the coin, they ignore that and treat the coin as a 64.

    Agree. The sticker would be the same for a MS64 and MS64+ since it doesn't take the + into consideration.

    Thank you, had no idea. :)

    Type collector, mainly into Seated. -formerly Ownerofawheatiehorde. Good BST transactions with: mirabela, OKCC, MICHAELDIXON, Gerard

  • ZoinsZoins Posts: 34,353 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Che_Grapes said:
    What could possibly go wrong?

    (asking for a friend)

    Genuine ;)

    Private Mint News | 2010 Lincoln Reverse Finalists
  • Cougar1978Cougar1978 Posts: 8,403 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited June 27, 2023 9:13PM

    Why would you want downgrade? Like taking points off board.

    Just go buy a 64 off ebay or win one off GC.

    Coins & Currency
  • WaterSportWaterSport Posts: 6,838 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Why not sell it, and buy a nice 64 example for the set. Your friend will end up with money in his/her pocket rather than PCGS's pocket.

    WS

    Proud recipient of the coveted PCGS Forum "You Suck" Award Thursday July 19, 2007 11:33 PM and December 30th, 2011 at 8:50 PM.
  • oldabeintxoldabeintx Posts: 2,088 ✭✭✭✭✭

    This may be the most egregious result I've encountered related to registry participation, assuming that's the reasoning. Forget the $, just the effort. One born each minute.

  • Herb_THerb_T Posts: 1,754 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @JerseyB said:

    @Connecticoin said:
    Mint State Everyman Set?

    64+ doesn't qualify for everyman sets?

    No….

  • Herb_THerb_T Posts: 1,754 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Ownerofawheatiehorde said:
    They’re probably trying to sticker it.

    No…

  • Herb_THerb_T Posts: 1,754 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Cougar1978 said:
    Why would you want downgrade? Like taking points off board.

    Just go buy a 64 off ebay or win one off GC.

    It’s a 1912-D Liberty nickel…..hard to find a 1912-D in PCGS MS64 never mind one that looks good. I have this one in my hand…

  • Herb_THerb_T Posts: 1,754 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @oldabeintx said:
    This may be the most egregious result I've encountered related to registry participation, assuming that's the reasoning. Forget the $, just the effort. One born each minute.

    If you have nothing good to add to the discussion move along, you are making yourself look silly.

  • goldengolden Posts: 9,796 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Several years ago, I had a 1907 High Relief in NGC 61. I wanted a PCGS AU 58 for my Everyman Set. A dealer that I had known for over 40 years suggested that I try it at PCGS. I submitted it at a show and it came back 58!

  • ConnecticoinConnecticoin Posts: 12,949 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @EliteCollection said:
    The better question would be why would PCGS not allow MS 64+ coins in mint state everyman sets? Any coins less than 65 should be considered mint state everyman IMO. This is a problem PCGS introduced. The easy fix is to allow MS 64+ into mint state everyman sets.

    It also would spur interest in 64+ coins, just like the 58+ coins.

    *For Sale on Numismy* *For Sale on Ebay*
  • EliteCollectionEliteCollection Posts: 168 ✭✭✭✭
    edited July 11, 2023 6:36PM

    @Connecticoin said:
    It also would spur interest in 64+ coins, just like the 58+ coins.

    Nothing wrong with that, right?

    Follow me on MyCollect!

  • ConnecticoinConnecticoin Posts: 12,949 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @EliteCollection said:

    @Connecticoin said:
    It also would spur interest in 64+ coins, just like the 58+ coins.

    Nothing wrong with that, right?

    Not at all.

    *For Sale on Numismy* *For Sale on Ebay*
  • BryceMBryceM Posts: 11,818 ✭✭✭✭✭

    The only logical thing for a grading company to do is to put the grade on the holder they think the coin deserves. In the long run, this is the only option that keeps them in business.

  • jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 35,135 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @BryceM said:
    The only logical thing for a grading company to do is to put the grade on the holder they think the coin deserves. In the long run, this is the only option that keeps them in business.

    Yes and no. They can make a whole lot of money on people submitting and resubmitting coins for registry purposes. They now have people trying hard to get their 64s into 64+ and, apparently, some people trying to get 64+ back into 64.

  • 1madman1madman Posts: 1,515 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @golden said:
    Several years ago, I had a 1907 High Relief in NGC 61. I wanted a PCGS AU 58 for my Everyman Set. A dealer that I had known for over 40 years suggested that I try it at PCGS. I submitted it at a show and it came back 58!

    Posts like this make me tear up. So many unfortunate things about this scenario. Taking a ms coin and dropping it to au is somewhat heartbreaking. Paying show grading fees to accomplish this also stings. I’m hoping the silver lining to this story is the coin stickered at cac in the 58 holder?

    Interestingly enough, it’s the same coin you had in your collection, and you like it better now that it’s in a lower grade holder. Having a hard time grasping this.

  • BryceMBryceM Posts: 11,818 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @BryceM said:
    The only logical thing for a grading company to do is to put the grade on the holder they think the coin deserves. In the long run, this is the only option that keeps them in business.

    Yes and no. They can make a whole lot of money on people submitting and resubmitting coins for registry purposes. They now have people trying hard to get their 64s into 64+ and, apparently, some people trying to get 64+ back into 64.

    The two things aren’t mutually exclusive. :)

  • jkrkjkrk Posts: 987 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Only trying to facilitate...

    In the DE world, if any wishes to send me their graded 64+ De, I will be more than happy to send them back my graded 64, in exchange.

  • oldabeintxoldabeintx Posts: 2,088 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Herb_T said:

    @oldabeintx said:
    This may be the most egregious result I've encountered related to registry participation, assuming that's the reasoning. Forget the $, just the effort. One born each minute.

    If you have nothing good to add to the discussion move along, you are making yourself look silly.

    Bad mood. Apologize.

  • PeakRaritiesPeakRarities Posts: 4,050 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited June 29, 2023 6:48AM

    @1madman said:

    @golden said:
    Several years ago, I had a 1907 High Relief in NGC 61. I wanted a PCGS AU 58 for my Everyman Set. A dealer that I had known for over 40 years suggested that I try it at PCGS. I submitted it at a show and it came back 58!

    Posts like this make me tear up. So many unfortunate things about this scenario. Taking a ms coin and dropping it to au is somewhat heartbreaking. Paying show grading fees to accomplish this also stings. I’m hoping the silver lining to this story is the coin stickered at cac in the 58 holder?

    Interestingly enough, it’s the same coin you had in your collection, and you like it better now that it’s in a lower grade holder. Having a hard time grasping this.

    I don't see at as unfortunate as you do. NGC 61 isn't exactly the most appealing grade, nor is pcgs 61, but if I have a coin that shows some circulation wear, I don't want it in an uncirculated holder. With some coins, the value difference is somewhat negligible, and I just want them graded accurately (as possible) where they wouldn't be questioned.

    Edit- grammar

    Founder- Peak Rarities
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  • MFeldMFeld Posts: 13,902 ✭✭✭✭✭

    "Is it possible to ask PCGS to regrade a coin from MS64+ to MS64?"

    It's super-easy to ask, but far less likely to obtain.

    Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.

  • jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 35,135 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @MFeld said:
    "Is it possible to ask PCGS to regrade a coin from MS64+ to MS64?"

    It's super-easy to ask, but far less likely to obtain.

    PCGS should do it. Then the next owner will send it in for an upgrade.

  • coinkatcoinkat Posts: 23,399 ✭✭✭✭✭

    What could go right?

    Old Coinkat proverb...

    Optimism has a place in numismatics as long as someone does not piss in your glass only to tell you it is half full...

    Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.

  • ZoinsZoins Posts: 34,353 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @MFeld said:
    "Is it possible to ask PCGS to regrade a coin from MS64+ to MS64?"

    It's super-easy to ask, but far less likely to obtain.

    It seems more likely to add MS64+ to the Every MS set, which I'm surprised it's not part of already.

    Private Mint News | 2010 Lincoln Reverse Finalists
  • ProofCollectionProofCollection Posts: 6,411 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @MFeld said:
    "Is it possible to ask PCGS to regrade a coin from MS64+ to MS64?"

    It's super-easy to ask, but far less likely to obtain.

    PCGS should do it. Then the next owner will send it in for an upgrade.

    PCGS should NOT do it. They should stand by their opinion. While one could argue that misrepresenting a grade at a higher number is more egregious than the reverse, any purposeful misrepresentation of a grade is a risk to their reputation and credibility, which is their most valuable asset.

    http://ProofCollection.Net

  • jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 35,135 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @ProofCollection said:

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @MFeld said:
    "Is it possible to ask PCGS to regrade a coin from MS64+ to MS64?"

    It's super-easy to ask, but far less likely to obtain.

    PCGS should do it. Then the next owner will send it in for an upgrade.

    PCGS should NOT do it. They should stand by their opinion. While one could argue that misrepresenting a grade at a higher number is more egregious than the reverse, any purposeful misrepresentation of a grade is a risk to their reputation and credibility, which is their most valuable asset.

    It was a joke.

  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭

    The TPG grades the coin, it is subjected to review, and final agreement reached. Label made, coin encapsulated. To ask for a downgrade specifically, would be to put the integrity of the TPG in question. You can submit raw, or for reconsideration - but do not request the TPG falsify what was a grading decision. Cheers, RickO

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