Here's a Morgan from the dum dum tree!
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Man this coin is outstanding. I love it and I am so happy to own it. It's literally identical to a proof in every way. Like a little pocket mirror. This is one of those coins you can hold back as far as you want to and still see yourself.
I've got to get these into PCGS.
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We need better photos. That looks like it was messed with.
Worthy of a better attempt at imaging.
I was thinking the same thing. Frosted???
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Nice eye appeal but I do not think that would straight grade. The extra frosting around the letters and devices looks off to me. Return it if you still can.
Try different lighting for the photos and it helps if you remove it from the capsule.
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The frosting seems to flow off the devices on to the fields.
I have to agree, we need a photo with better lighting. In these pictures it is suspicious for Liberty to have so much frost and none of the lettering does. Same on reverse.
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Never mind these jealous trolls - your fake Morgan looks beautiful to me…!!!
I'm going to be pretty bummed out if it's fake. I'm hoping not because it's beautiful in my hand. It's not polished I've see plenty of them.
I'll work on pictures. This didn't come from ebay. It came from a collection. I thought it was pretty special. It's not easy being green!
I don't think for a minute that you guys are giving me a hard time. I know your looking out for me and I appreciate that.
That was a bit unnecessary. There is a genuine concern, and if proven false, I bet you those "trolls"
would gladly admit they were wrong and be grateful Watchtower owns a beautiful Morgan.
Raising a possible concern does not make a member here a troll.
peacockcoins
The scratch on the cheek is worrisome regardless of the other worries.
Why is it fake?
It's not really a scratch I looked it over pretty good. I don't hide anything in my imaging. It's more like a break In luster/frost but whatever.
I sure do like this coin.
Here's a couple more images anyway.
Unfortunately, it appears to have been polished and then re-frosted on the main devices.
Note that none of the letting, stars, or date is frosted since that is a lot harder to do.
The rims are also polished, which would not be the case, originally.
This is what has been called a "California Cameo".
…What’s the yum-yum tree?
Type collector, mainly into Seated. -formerly Ownerofawheatiehorde. Good BST transactions with: mirabela, OKCC, MICHAELDIXON, Gerard
Well that's a bummer!
The yum yum tree is where nice coins are supposed to come from. Unfortunately there are people who do things to coins to deceive people so I guess that's the case. It's a good thing this isn't my only Morgan. Moving right along......
I put it under the microscope to look at the surfaces. I could see the polishing lines you were talking about @dcarr. I got so pissed that on my way to pick up some take out I whipped it out the window on the highway.
So sick of thinking something is nice only to find out its a California Cameo. I don't even want it in my house. Look at this crap.
I would have still kept it. Still most likely a 90% silver bullion coin.
My Original Song Written to my late wife-"Plus other original music by me"
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They even polished the front of the denticles. Why would someone do this?
To make a couple of hundred bucks?
The polishing did not leave any "polishing lines". If you look at this picture above, what you see around the star is the original flow lines (mint luster) from striking the coin. However, what the polishing did do is remove all the luster (flow lines) that were out in the open and reachable by the polishing buffer. This is why the luster (flow lines) are gone in the areas away from the devices. I think this coin probably had a non-proof-like "cartwheel" luster pattern originally, and most of that luster was polished away. Only a little bit of the original luster remains, in low-lying areas adjacent to raised devices which protected these low areas from being polished.
Also note how shiny the top surfaces of the denticles and star are, because they are especially exposed to the buffing action. The main central devices (Liberty Head and Eagle) would have been just as shiny, if not for the artificial frosting applied to them.
It is the tuition we all pay at some point in our collecting endeavors. I learned a lot from this post about fake frost. Thanks for sharing and chin up....we all make mistakes....just don't make the same mistake twice.
My first suspicion would be., if the coin is so nice, why isn’t it already certified?
People do all kinds of things to try to make a few extra bucks unfortunately. You still could have sold it for its silver content thou.
Edit to add Or kept it for a reference as what not to buy in the future
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California proof. Look inside the letters and you can see where they missed polishing.
I was just kidding!!
Good grief —
My initial impression was that the coin didn't look right and after reading all the replies I see others feel the same. Some suggestions:
--- Look at as many PCGS/NGC encapsulated coins as possible, not online images but coins at shops/shows that you can hold in your hand and look at with a loupe for help.
--- Stop buying raw coins until you become more proficient at grading and identifying problems, encapsulated only till then.
--- Start a relationship with a knowledgeable dealer, someone you can talk to face-to-face to discuss coins.
--- Join a local coin club.
--- Books, buy some books to help educate yourself.
I purchased a collection of Morgan's from a friend's relative. The man was 79 years old. I'm not to worried about it. I am disappointed because I was deceived by the coin and the original doctor. The people I bought the coin from are good people. No deceit. I'm sure he had no idea. I'll sum it up by mentioning that I bought everything right and I will take no loss financially.
I got rid of the coin because I do not want to see anyone else go through this. I'm fine with learning another lesson. Whoever did that coin was good. I mean really good. You could not see any spots or areas on the coin where they missed polishing. I have had "done" coins before. This one was exceptional. Even under a microscope I could see nothing unnatural about this coin.
I trust the veterans here. When they talk I listen. The more mature veterans don't bust your balls they tell you the facts.
I can handle it!
Not everyone would know you were kidding. And that aside, although the coin appears to have been altered, it was incorrect to describe it as “fake”. Good grief.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
I believe there are thousand and thousand of raw coins just waiting to be slabbed. From my own experience just recently I mentioned I purchased part of a Morgan collection. Even though this coin wasn't right I am not even going to mention it to the folks I purchased it from. The other coins I purchased will more than make up for it. When you can buy PL or possibly DMPL coins for under $100 I won't complain. Some of them are approaching gem quality. I don't profess to be a very good grader but it's not hard to tell a nice looking morgan when you see one. I think this was an exception and if in a dealers hand they might be scratching there head. I am sure a dealer or two have been duped by this type of coin in the past.
Again I hope that if nothing else someone else will learn from this post.
I know I did.
As it was said tuition.
BTW I do have slabbed Morgan's. Pretty much what I need for comparison but I still need more experience. I'm not a weisenheimer.
I am going to join a coin club. I found one in my area surprisingly enough.
One last thing I need to say. I am not trying to prove anything to anybody. I am here for the hobby.
100% messed with. Yeet it back to whence it came.
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live and learn is my comment
I invite you to explore a selection of coins for sale at the link provided below.
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I'm sorry it wasn't what you thought. I too could tell it had been polished but it was a good example of a "California Proof". People do this all the time to sell them on Ebay or other sites for more than they are actually worth. Scammers are everywhere these days.
Dwayne F. Sessom
Ebay ID: V-Nickel-Coins
There's no reason to beat yourself up over it. People buy and inherit collections/groups of coins all the time. Fakes/counterfeit and altered coins show up here all the time. This stuff has been going on for years and years. I still have a dryer coin, a polished silver eagle and a counterfeit trade dollar that I have had for years to keep reminding me to always research what I want to buy. Don't get overwhelmed by a bunch of coins and take your time to look at them closely. It's not hard to get fooled by an altered coin if you're not knowledgeable of all the methods that deceptors can and have used. No harm in saving the bad ones along with the good ones. You could have used this Morgan to help educate another person down the road.
My Original Song Written to my late wife-"Plus other original music by me"
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Cull Morgans are $30 ea right now. Woulda kept it as a reminder for a year or two and then dumped it.
"It's like God, Family, Country, except Sticker, Plastic, Coin."
I learned something new from this.
On a lighter note:
Exactly which highway and mile marker did you toss this? Asking for a friend.
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Too bad about the coin... I know you initially really liked it. Well, now you have learned some good points in coin evaluation. You really should have kept the coin... Send some metal detecting friends to the field threw it into.. Cheers, RickO
I didn't think he really pitched his new pocket piece, but You know that happens.
I bought a half carat diamond Mavado ring from a guy that was going to run his motorcycle up to 100 and pitch it over his shoulder
He still owed $5500 on a Mavado credit card after a year and the relationship was over.
I paid him $1250 and shipping.
I think you need to study and look at lots and lots of coins (images too) before buying another one.
10-4,
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My registry sets
Been there done that more often then I care to admit lol...
If you paid low enough for it, it's still silver!
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If it were $40/$50 bucks I’d keep it (raw) just for fun.
Even though it's altered, it's still a pretty cool coin, in my opinion. If it was noted to be an altered piece, it might still bring a small premium over a cull.
Young Numismatist
@Watchtower - sorry this one didn't work out, but you can at least chalk it up to education, and know that other people, myself included, got free tuition here as well. I'm sorry the tuition was not free for you too, but those of us who've been in the hobby for a long time have all paid their dues in one way or another, over stuff like this.
Your attitude is good about it, I think. I'll predict you'll have a win, further down the road.