NFL teams are desperate..........
Desert Moon
Posts: 5,791 ✭✭✭✭✭
in Sports Talk
for a QB.
https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/35800565/sources-geno-smith-finalizing-3-year-105m-deal-seahawks
Seriously? 1 good season at age 32 and you throw that kind of money at him? What happens next year if he reverts to being just an average starter? This is worse than the Saints paying Carr too much for being like Dalton.
If I were running an NFL team, I would be trying to get an elite qb or something really bad, not mediocre. Something really bad has a better chance of getting an elite qb when you get that high draft pick, if you know how to pick them...........
But Geno Smith and Derek Carr ain't worth that pay to keep their teams from being great down the line.
My online coin store - https://desertmoonnm.com/
1
Comments
If the reports are correct it appears that most of the money is for 1 year and the extra years were added to lower the AAV for salary cap where they can easily get out of it after a year if it doesnt work out
Wisconsin 2-6 against the SEC since 2007
Wow the fact that Geno Smith is still in the league is shocking enough, him being a legit starter was on a different level lol
Crazy money for Geno Smith. The Seahawks have an excellent tandem of receivers. They also had a breakout rookie RB that tore up the league. All of these factors hid Geno’s shortcomings. Not one other team in the league would have given him anywhere near that kind of money. I would have thought a smaller contract and saving that money to sign some help in other places. Now that the league has a year of film on him as a starter he will struggle to make that contract look good.
"I spent 50% of my money on alcohol, women, and gambling. The other half I wasted.
New York's football Giants have locked up their man, Daniel Jones, 4 years, $160 million.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/nypost.com/2023/03/07/daniel-jones-giants-agree-to-contract-before-tag-deadline/amp/
Little less that the "More than 45 million a year" it was reporting that he wanted
Aaron Rodgers, Lamar Jackson and Jimmy G are the other big questions
Ofcourse there is Baker Mayfield the side dish that nobody ordered as well 🤷♂️
Ravens put the non exclusive franchise tag on Jackson for $32.5M. If another team wants him they’ll have to match or beat and give up two #1’s.
Any takers?
"I spent 50% of my money on alcohol, women, and gambling. The other half I wasted.
Wow
I doubt it
The NFL teams are NOT desperate.....The management of teams are realists.....It's a business.....They know the score....Why do they pay those QBs so much money? It seems to be a mystery around here.....Simply put......There are not 32 high caliber players available to play the position.....People can think anything they want about Baker Mayfield and guys like him....Oh!....He's no good.... Etc, etc, etc., on and on......But the truth of the matter is this..... Guys like him are good...The drop off in talent between a so-so NFL starting QB and a back-up QB is ASTRONOMICAL!....Everyone can't be Tom Brady. They get the money they deserve..... For one simple reason...... They're in short supply....
Agree with all of this, but 1, there are still those few elite, 2, BM is 1% less in ability than the elite, that is all it takes to be the worst starter in the NFL. But if you don't have one of the top 5, then tank, and find that top 5 by doing your homework in the draft. Don't pay crazy money for average, that won't get you anywhere. Play the long game........................
This appears to be Houston's strategy for the last couple years. Don't improve your team moderately for the near term by getting a washed up ex-high quality qb for big money, but instead build up quality young talent via draft picks, and when you get a high draft pick (#2 this year) for tanking, go for the elite qb in the draft - well at least that is what they hope. If they get Stroud, they might have a good team in 3 or so years, maybe a contender. Otherwise, do what the Saints are doing, continue on your path to very good to average - how is that going to win a SB? Nope.
3 teams in need of a QB have already said they aren’t interested in looking at Jackson. Tells you exactly what the market for him is.
"I spent 50% of my money on alcohol, women, and gambling. The other half I wasted.
I mean why would anyone want to take on that situation, give up two first round picks and pay probably over 40 million for a season then deal with his contract demands which are probably in the 200+ million range?
No thank you
@Hydrant said: The drop off in talent between a so-so NFL starting QB and a back-up QB is ASTRONOMICAL.
I don't agree with this. Perhaps the drop-off from the few really elite QB's to everyone else is large but the talent required for the position isn't a mystery. Much of it has to do with the personnel around the QB and the Head Coach and other structure that supports them during a game and between games. To that end, I have always felt that a QB is just another moving part on a team, granted he might be the most important moving part and the one where everything starts, but the direction taken by NFL teams has risen to the absurd. In the end it is a TEAM that wins and loses.
Currently, it is a search for a marquise player at the expense of the rest of the team. Player Greed and Management foolishness has led us to where we are, to QB's making $40 million/year and taking teams to the end of the season and little more. Look at Josh Allen: is he worth that much money?? What if he sucked it up and only made $25 million and the rest of that money payed for a little more talent around him?? Place Mahomes, Allen, Burrow, Hurts and Herbert in a dark room and pick someone. Placed on any middle of the road team and you'd probably get close to the same result.
It's interesting to note that on average the lowest pay is to two areas that almost every NFL team needs help with:
--- Special Teams.
--- Running back.
On average, the Kicker makes less than everyone on a team, but they expect him to win a game as a matter of routine.
That's because the bulk of the money, on average, goes to four positions:
--- Quarterback.
--- Left Tackle.
--- Free Safety.
--- Strong Safety.
Give most of the money to the guy who throws the ball, give a little less to the guy protecting his blind side and pay a bunch to the guys trying to block what he throws.
It is 100% a passing league and it's reflected in how much RB's get paid, less than the guys blocking for him.
as currently constituted, the NFL is a QB-driven league. without a top-tier QB, you are not winning a SB.
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
Does a top-tier QB win the Super Bowl?? - or - Does winning a Super Bowl determine who is a top-tier QB??
More top tier QB's have Super Bowl rings than not so there is your answer
The reason I ask is because Russell Wilson won a Super Bowl and became top-tier, even Tom Brady became top-tier only after winning the Super Bowl. Now we have Allen, Burrow and Herbert along with Hurts who are in that group and yet none have won it yet. The NFL structure has changed our perception so that now you can be a top-tier QB without having ever won the biggest game.
I'm not sure I agree with that perception. We'll see in the coming years. I agree with the premise that a QB is the most important piece for a team simply because the position has so much responsibility, but I don't think even the best can win the Super Bowl without the right teammates and coaching staff.
Russell Wilson literally fell off a cliff but at the time he was a great QB
Burrow in his 3 years has brought Cincy close twice losing in the Super Bowl as you know, Allen is not as good as Burrow in my opinion but is still young
Herbert is not elite I don't think, but you could argue that he is and convince me with a little effort
Obviously we all agree it's a team sport and only 2 teams make it with 1 team coming out as a winner so it's a short field but the better the QB the higher the chances become
Nick Foles and Matt Stafford are "top tier"?
I have never thought much of Stafford and his Super Bowl ring hasn't changed that. He needed a lot of talent on both sides of the ball to get that ring and will probably retire soon with no more than the one. To me he is in the middle of the pack of NFL QB's, closer to the bottom than the top.
--- As a result of a single season of above average performance it seems Daniel Jones has placed himself into the supposed realm of eliteness if we judge on his salary. At least that's what the New York Giants think. And to think, $9 million a year, roughly 25% of that, has gotten the Cincinnati Bengals a Super Bowl shot and another AFC Championship Game!! In the scheme of things that doesn't bode well for the Bengals: they had better sign some talent this year and extend a few contracts because their available cash will be gone when it's time to re-sign Burrow to start the 2024 season.
In a weird sort of way, by the time his five year contract at $46 million/year comes to an end, Deshaun Watson will look like a bargain. When it comes time to renegotiate with him contracts from $50-60 million a year for a QB will be the norm.
there are exceptions to almost every rule. As a rule, a team needs a top tier QB to win a SB. Stafford will make it into the HOF.
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
Yes Stafford was an elite QB that played the majority of his career on horrendous teams
Foles got hot at the right time and was elite for that playoff run.
Wisconsin 2-6 against the SEC since 2007
Hoodie helped Foles by sitting Butler
I'm still annoyed at that
Yes Stafford was an elite QB
An opinion not really backed by the facts.
I agree, saying a HOF QB isnt elite is nothing more than someones opinion which stats disprove
Wisconsin 2-6 against the SEC since 2007
I dont think i will ever get over this one. should have 7 SB's
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
I’m going to let all of you in on a secret
🤫
The key to these QB contracts is the economics of it as much as the talent. Now, it’s not really fun to talk about and it’s got lots of subtle nuances and it definitely doesn’t fit the narrative but it is reality.
There are twenty four players (minimum, and it fact quite a few more) that impact the outcomes of a football team. Eleven, eleven and two kickers. They all play a role in every game and any glaring errors or big performances can sink or elevate a team.
Allocation of money is how you improve, win and then have sustained success more than anything in the modern NFL. It’s not about the quarterback as much as the quality and depth of your overall organizational personnel. While Tom Brady was consistent throughout the NE run, he wasn’t the only thing. There was the coach, the owner and also the idea that “no one was getting paid” which EVERYONE questioned every step of the way. There were dozens of excellent players sent packing (in a few cases, guys at or nearing their peak abilities) who were jettisoned once it was clear hey wanted something resembling a max money deal. It worked. Tremendously. It’s why even though they didn’t even draft particularly well, they always had the flexibility to sign or trade for solid football players every offseason. Not flashy guys (unless they did something bad and needed to play at a discount) but solid proven football players motivated by winning AND money. Some of this was basically proven in the Matt Cassell season. They were still an excellent team that season, essentially missing the playoffs on a technicality, and while no one could ever confuse Tom for Matt and people have tried to use that season to ‘knock Brady’, just look at that through this lens: So good was the rest of the roster that a drop off from the current best quarterback in the game to Matt freakin Cassell was absorbed incredible well because the team was so well constructed.
The two best quarterbacks in the league available this off-season were/are Aaron Rodgers and Lamar Jackson. They’re both former MVPs, both super talented and neither has a team that wants them*, including their own. Why? Money. Nothing else but.
If either guy came out right now and said, “I’m looking to sign a one year deal and make about $8 to 10 million in 2023 because all I want to do is win’ you’d have close to 25 teams running to their doorstep to sign them and cleaning out their current QBs locker to do it.
The moment you allocate that large a percentage of payroll into one (or two) players, you’re standing on a tightrope as a general manager where every mistake is magnified and every draft pick more important.
None of that even touches on the fact that all people change when you hand them tens or hundreds of millions of dollars, some considerable more than others and it can go in a positive or negative direction.
*The New York Jets never, ever get anything right. Them wanting Aaron Rodgers doesn’t count because they’ve wanted a QB since Joe Namath went to the Rams and the Jets couldn’t find the corner of a well lit room with their hand on the wall.
Curious about the rare, mysterious and beautiful 1951 Wheaties Premium Photos?
https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/987963/1951-wheaties-premium-photos-set-registry#latest
I don't know if Stafford is an "elite" QB or not. And I really don't care. He had his good days and bad days and so-so days with the Rams. I couldn't figure out what to think about him during the SB season. I still can't. But there are three things that I'm certain about..#1 The Rams were hopeless without him, and #2 The Rams will forever regret trading Goff for Stafford if he doesn't come back from the elbow injury. And...#3...Goff is a better QB that Stafford. He was when the Rams traded him and now he's even better.
That's not to say Goff is "elite"...... Just better than Stafford.....
No big deal...
Stafford is 11th all time in yards and 12ths all time in passing TDs and did so on some very bad Lions teams. He'll very likely be top 10 in both by the time he retires, hes about 5k yards behind Eli for yards with around 52k yards to Elis 57k and change.
Wisconsin 2-6 against the SEC since 2007
Yes, baseball21.....I'm aware of all the great statistics that he piled up while playing for very bad Lions teams.....
But,....He plays for the Los Angeles Rams now.....ipso facto.....he's not top tier anymore...... If at some point the Rams trade him to...Dallas?....or....New England?....or...
Philadelphia?....Then he can go back to being considered a good QB.....HOF material even....Until then.....NO!
Father time is undefended. Rodgers really isnt elite anymore either but could do worse. I dont think anyones arguing that hes still the best of the best, just that hes had an elite career and is still in the upper half of the league. You could certainly do a lot worse especially considering he was also dealing with his wife having brain cancer.
The Rams arent exactly very good anymore after the SB either now. NE could be a potential trade destination though I have doubt if Belicheck would be willing to bring in a veteran like that. For better or worse Dallas is going to win or lose with Dak after the contract they gave him
Wisconsin 2-6 against the SEC since 2007
Apparently only Mahomes can win Super Bowls with an average defense. Look at the Bills the last 5 years with an elite defense and Allen at QB, they can’t even get to the big game.
The Eagles had Hurts and an elite defense and the Chiefs hung 38 on them.
Right now Mahomes is a man apart from the rest of his contemporaries.
So to answer your question, Mahomes is the only QB who can go out and win SB’s, the rest of them need a lot more help from the defense.
That’s why the Chiefs will probably have to give him a raise in a couple years, because it will look foolish to have half the QB’s in the NFL making more money than him.
Okay that was hilarious perk. 😁
The Chiefs need a backup QB since
Heinne retired I wouldn’t mind Baker filling that role.
Well we will have to agree to disagree. I think Burrow potentially an equal to Allen and Herbert. Burrow has the luxury of a great team around him, Herbert has a pretty average line for example that comes into play for his performances, and I have seen his WRs drop easily catchable balls every game....... Allen is elite for sure and also has a strong team around him. We will see how Burrow does if the talent around him drops off. That is the thing about Brady in NE. He did it for a long time with changing rosters, that certifies his GOAT for now. We will see how these 3 younger likely elite qbs do over time..........
Meh,
BM will have ok games, a few stellar moments, and alot of bad games, this is why his QBR is #31 this year. And he thinks too highly of himself that affects how he plays. I would not get near him, even as a backup bc he will be whining that he is better than Mahomes and should be starting LOL................
Slightly off topic...You all (y'all) know that I would still take Brady over everyone. However, he is retired, and I do not want to see him in a Fins uniform.
Anyway, it looks like you guys are debating the order of the tiers of QBs. In my opinion, excluding Brady, Mahomes is the cream of the crop. Beyond him, I still would take Josh Allen number two. Despite how last year played out, I still feel strongly that he has the number two position to Mahomes locked up.
Looks like the Rams are trying to peddle Stafford.
"I spent 50% of my money on alcohol, women, and gambling. The other half I wasted.
Please!!! Get over it? Do you realize how lucky a team is to have just one? I feel so sorry for you. 😂😂
"I spent 50% of my money on alcohol, women, and gambling. The other half I wasted.
.....
I'm only going to be on mobile for the next week, so I can't hover and check who Lol'd at this comment.
Let me know. I'm curious.
I hate mobile phone accidental lols.
I did it on the coin forum, I was scrolling a thread and my finger inadvertently hit lol. The problem…. it was a thread devoted to our wonderful military veterans and I accidentally lol’d one of the posts.
Didn’t even know I did it until the author of the post pm’d me asking why. He was very nice about it and I did apologize.
So I really hate posting on my phone but my computer doesn’t work.
Showman…. not saying someone accidentally lol’d you but it can happen very easily.
Showman I do disagree I think Burrow has earned 2nd best young QB based on going to the super bowl last year and beating the Bills this year in the playoffs.
...
So it was you...🤔🤣
I only use my cellphone, I don't have a home PC and I'm not smart enough to.have a computer for work lol
It's fun to have the phone with its easy and anytime access but the spelling errors are horrific at times
..
With mobile, as far as I know, there is no way to know who gave you a like, etc. Is this correct or am I missing something?
It's absolutely true, I actually never knew you could even see who liked or agreed ect with your posts until someone told me you can when using a PC, on the cellphone you cannot
@thisistheshow said: With mobile, as far as I know, there is no way to know who gave you a like, etc. Is this correct or am I missing something??
Why would it matter and why would you care who "likes" what you post or "lol's" one of your comment?? If it matters than I suppose you might be influenced to post in a certain fashion.
....
I can see your point, but at the same time...just playing around, if someone laughs at my post, in a humorous way, I might double down on the joke, ....but maybe they give me the lol as a sign of disagreement, and I can use that information to further the conversation (in a civil way). Or.....if I wrote that Jim Rice doesn't suck, and @dallasactuary agrees, I know something is possibly afoot. 🤷🤣