Home Sports Talk

Now that Mahomes is at "two" will GOAT talks start in earnest??

MaywoodMaywood Posts: 1,884 ✭✭✭✭✭

At six years into their careers Brady leads Mahomes in Super Bowl victories at 3-2. If you look at the statistics, where's @dallasactuary at, the comparison isn't really close in any of the meaningful categories. I just did that and frankly I was sort of shocked. Mahomes dominates. If he continues on this present trajectory and wherever he plays maintains the overall team talent level it will only be a matter of time till Mahomes overtakes Tom Brady.

Maywood.

Comments

  • DarinDarin Posts: 6,278 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 13, 2023 6:25PM

    Right now I think it’s more fun comparing mahomes to his contemporaries like Allen, burrow, Herbert, etc. because he’s dominating them. Burrow blew his one chance at a super bowl and I hope he doesn’t get there again. He’s really cocky, saying his whole career is his super bowl window.🙄
    I would like to see these totals in the future……
    Super bowl wins….

    Mahomes 5
    Allen 3
    Herbert 1
    Lawrence 1
    Hurts 1
    Burrow 0
    Any raider qb 0
    Purdy 1 but just because of Kittle, how can you not like that guy.

    DISCLAIMER FOR BASEBAL21
    In the course of every human endeavor since the dawn of time the risk of human error has always been a factor. Including but not limited to field goals, 4th down attempts, or multiple paragraph ramblings on a sports forum authored by someone who shall remain anonymous.
  • PillarDollarCollectorPillarDollarCollector Posts: 4,716 ✭✭✭✭✭

    No way to early for GOAT talk. Anything can happen even just next season who knows. Maybe once he has 5 rings and time left if he gets 5.

  • pdoidoipdoidoi Posts: 482 ✭✭✭

    People have been talking that BS well before he won number 2.

  • MaywoodMaywood Posts: 1,884 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Check the career stats through six years and you'll probably be as surprised as I was, they aren't even close and Mahomes is just now entering what should be his prime years.

  • erikthredderikthredd Posts: 8,179 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Nope. For me,Its not even a debate until Mahomes reaches all of these milestones...
    5 rings
    200+ regular season wins
    75,000 passing yards
    600 passing touchdowns

  • thisistheshowthisistheshow Posts: 9,386 ✭✭✭✭✭

    As I predicted, not that it wasn't obvious, this Chiefs win has sparked all of this Mahomes vs Brady talk.

    Was Brady actually even better than the SB wins total makes him out to be? There was that decade long drought. Have we already forgotten how good of a QB he was during his heyday?

    Here is why I ask this...I was listening to sports radio earlier tonight locally in Tx. I heard one host say that they would take Mahomes over peak Brady in the 'have to win just one game' scenario.

  • MaywoodMaywood Posts: 1,884 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Length of time accepted, both players have shown a gritty, clutch ability that is needed to win.

    The only reason I'm posting about this comparison stuff is because I got curious and was surprised how much Mahomes had done. To me, it makes a difference that what Brady did in his first six years was 20 years ago, the game was a little different and not quite the pass heavy style it's become. If Mahomes is playing in 10 years things may have changed even more.

  • perkdogperkdog Posts: 29,456 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 14, 2023 4:19AM

    It can be talked about as much as anyone wants but it's not true regardless.

    Like it's stupid to even consider it right now.

    Talking about the possibilities is fine but that's it for right now

  • craig44craig44 Posts: 10,493 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Silly to even discuss it at this point. He isnt even to Montana level yet. Elway level? Unitas level? Graham?

    recency bias is strong. comparing stats to past greats is disingenuous. the game was so different. even 15 years ago it was a very different game.

    I would be confident saying that Steve Young, Elway, Montana, Marino, Unitas would be doing just as well as Mahomes if they played under todays rules.

    This always happens when a young player starts out strong and wins a title or 2. I remember all the talk about Aaron Rodgers and Roethlisberger years ago.

    George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.

  • MaywoodMaywood Posts: 1,884 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @craig44 said:This always happens when a young player starts out strong and wins a title or 2. I remember all the talk about Aaron Rodgers and Roethlisberger years ago.

    Remember the talk of Russell Wilson and the Seattle dynasty?? :p That sure crashed fast but it happened much quicker. The "elite" QB comparisons started after years 2-3 with Wilson and look where he's at now.

  • DarinDarin Posts: 6,278 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @craig44 said:
    Silly to even discuss it at this point. He isnt even to Montana level yet. Elway level? Unitas level? Graham?

    recency bias is strong. comparing stats to past greats is disingenuous. the game was so different. even 15 years ago it was a very different game.

    I would be confident saying that Steve Young, Elway, Montana, Marino, Unitas would be doing just as well as Mahomes if they played under todays rules.

    This always happens when a young player starts out strong and wins a title or 2. I remember all the talk about Aaron Rodgers and Roethlisberger years ago.

    Craig I remember you saying a couple years ago that mahomes window for winning Super Bowls would be very short because of the huge contract he signed. What up with that? Looks like all he needs is average receivers. If he had Justin Jefferson he would win 7 of the next 10 Super Bowls. So you were wrong about the short window huh?
    Now the pressure is on the bengals, eagles, chargers etc getting their super star qb’s signed

    DISCLAIMER FOR BASEBAL21
    In the course of every human endeavor since the dawn of time the risk of human error has always been a factor. Including but not limited to field goals, 4th down attempts, or multiple paragraph ramblings on a sports forum authored by someone who shall remain anonymous.
  • thisistheshowthisistheshow Posts: 9,386 ✭✭✭✭✭

    A> @Darin said:

    @craig44 said:
    Silly to even discuss it at this point. He isnt even to Montana level yet. Elway level? Unitas level? Graham?

    recency bias is strong. comparing stats to past greats is disingenuous. the game was so different. even 15 years ago it was a very different game.

    I would be confident saying that Steve Young, Elway, Montana, Marino, Unitas would be doing just as well as Mahomes if they played under todays rules.

    This always happens when a young player starts out strong and wins a title or 2. I remember all the talk about Aaron Rodgers and Roethlisberger years ago.

    Craig I remember you saying a couple years ago that mahomes window for winning Super Bowls would be very short because of the huge contract he signed. What up with that? Looks like all he needs is average receivers. If he had Justin Jefferson he would win 7 of the next 10 Super Bowls. So you were wrong about the short window huh?
    Now the pressure is on the bengals, eagles, chargers etc getting their super star qb’s signed

    .....
    Thank you @darin for bringing up this point about the contract. I am now going to bump my own thread from a few years ago. This is the second time I'm doing it. It's become tradition. Anyway, Mahomes has now done something that has been very hard to do, as discussed in this thread. 🤣 https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1065509/in-the-salary-cap-era-only-nine-sbs-have-been-won-with-a-starting-qb-playing-on-his-second-contract#latest

  • @Darin said:

    @craig44 said:
    Silly to even discuss it at this point. He isnt even to Montana level yet. Elway level? Unitas level? Graham?

    recency bias is strong. comparing stats to past greats is disingenuous. the game was so different. even 15 years ago it was a very different game.

    I would be confident saying that Steve Young, Elway, Montana, Marino, Unitas would be doing just as well as Mahomes if they played under todays rules.

    This always happens when a young player starts out strong and wins a title or 2. I remember all the talk about Aaron Rodgers and Roethlisberger years ago.

    Craig I remember you saying a couple years ago that mahomes window for winning Super Bowls would be very short because of the huge contract he signed. What up with that? Looks like all he needs is average receivers. If he had Justin Jefferson he would win 7 of the next 10 Super Bowls. So you were wrong about the short window huh?
    Now the pressure is on the bengals, eagles, chargers etc getting their super star qb’s signed

    Mahomes is currently the fifth highest paid QB in average annual salary. I'm going to guess that he will drop lower in that ranking over the next four or five years as salaries rise and caps rise. He may be a huge bargain in four years. At fifth highest he already is a bargain.

  • countdouglascountdouglas Posts: 2,273 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Darin said:

    @craig44 said:
    Silly to even discuss it at this point. He isnt even to Montana level yet. Elway level? Unitas level? Graham?

    recency bias is strong. comparing stats to past greats is disingenuous. the game was so different. even 15 years ago it was a very different game.

    I would be confident saying that Steve Young, Elway, Montana, Marino, Unitas would be doing just as well as Mahomes if they played under todays rules.

    This always happens when a young player starts out strong and wins a title or 2. I remember all the talk about Aaron Rodgers and Roethlisberger years ago.

    Craig I remember you saying a couple years ago that mahomes window for winning Super Bowls would be very short because of the huge contract he signed. What up with that? Looks like all he needs is average receivers. If he had Justin Jefferson he would win 7 of the next 10 Super Bowls. So you were wrong about the short window huh?
    Now the pressure is on the bengals, eagles, chargers etc getting their super star qb’s signed

    If someone wants to go find that old thread, with the talk of "Mahomes window is closing", they'll see that I provided a link to an article breaking down just what a massive advantage the Mahomes contract was going to provide the Chiefs over the rest of the NFL rosters over the next decade plus. It really is ridiculous to think about how long the Chiefs could/should be able to sustain their excellence, barring a catastrophic injury to Mahomes or inept management if/once Reid and Veach move on.

  • tommyrusty7tommyrusty7 Posts: 1,777 ✭✭✭✭

    He runs the ball too much to not get hurt and lose seasons. It is what it is and he has a long way to go to achieve what Brady has done. Good luck to him.

  • MaywoodMaywood Posts: 1,884 ✭✭✭✭✭

    After the 2004 Super Bowl win, Brady and the Patriots had a 10 year run of no victories in that game. The 2032 season could be the next big comparison point which means Mahomes would be around year 15 in the NFL. What will his Super Bowl record be and how will the two players compare statistically??

  • spacehaydukespacehayduke Posts: 5,468 ✭✭✭✭✭

    i just noticed this thread. I already started a thread on this topic 3 days before this one which was going fine. Why the redundancy, this has happened several times now to me by the particular individuals who who post dozens of threads each week. You know who you are. I see this over and over again here on these sports boards. Folks trying to make a redundant thread over someone else. Why? What is the point? Do folks need to see their name up on the topics that badly? Come on folks, let's be courteous to those who get a topic going first and keep those treads going as long as there is interest in the topic, no point to try to write over them....................................

    Us 'minor league' players here start to feel as if the 'major league' players on these sports boards don't want us around, sheesh.


    Successful transactions with-Boosibri,lkeigwin,TomB,Broadstruck,coinsarefun,Type2,jom,ProfLiz, UltraHighRelief,Barndog,EXOJUNKIE,ldhair,fivecents,paesan,Crusty...
  • perkdogperkdog Posts: 29,456 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @spacehayduke said:
    i just noticed this thread. I already started a thread on this topic 3 days before this one which was going fine. Why the redundancy, this has happened several times now to me by the particular individuals who who post dozens of threads each week. You know who you are. I see this over and over again here on these sports boards. Folks trying to make a redundant thread over someone else. Why? What is the point? Do folks need to see their name up on the topics that badly? Come on folks, let's be courteous to those who get a topic going first and keep those treads going as long as there is interest in the topic, no point to try to write over them....................................

    Us 'minor league' players here start to feel as if the 'major league' players on these sports boards don't want us around, sheesh.

    Dude, dont sell yourself short,you been around since 2004! You got seniority bud!

  • thisistheshowthisistheshow Posts: 9,386 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @spacehayduke

    A few things...

    I joined here in 2018 because I am a coin guy. I had no idea that there was a sports sub-forum, because I didn't think about the fact that the same company grading the coins grade cards. I lurked in the us coin forum for a bit before I joined here. I lurked at others as well, both coin and non-coin. Forums are incredibly useful, even as a non-member. Some let you search without an account. And sometimes all it takes to get a good answer in Google is tostart your question with the term 'forum'. My point is that forums are amazing but they all have some learning curve and limitations. T

    he Us Coin forum and the Sports Talk forum operate quite differently.

    I have on occasion here felt as though we would be better served by having multiple discussions that are all similar grouped together by a mod into a megathread. It happens all of the time on other sites. I would't want it happening all of the time, but sometimes it would be helpful. But because this is not that kind of site, posters here are not necessarily cognizant of looking for similar threads before starting one. Some guys start more threads than others. Some guys never start threads. There is nothing nefarious happening, imo.

  • MCMLVToppsMCMLVTopps Posts: 4,600 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @spacehayduke said:
    i just noticed this thread. I already started a thread on this topic 3 days before this one which was going fine. Why the redundancy, this has happened several times now to me by the particular individuals who who post dozens of threads each week. You know who you are. I see this over and over again here on these sports boards. Folks trying to make a redundant thread over someone else. Why? What is the point? Do folks need to see their name up on the topics that badly? Come on folks, let's be courteous to those who get a topic going first and keep those treads going as long as there is interest in the topic, no point to try to write over them....................................

    Us 'minor league' players here start to feel as if the 'major league' players on these sports boards don't want us around, sheesh.

    I couldn't agree with you more!!

    I have seen untold times when an interesting thread goes totally off the rails, or a dupe thread is begun somewhere a bit downstream of the OP. Apparently some posters just kinda jump in willy nilly, maybe unintentionally, maybe not, but a quick general scan of already posted topics would eliminate this. I do my best to make sure I don't dupe an existing thread, I'm 99% sure I've never made a dupe topic post in 20 years.

    A lot of threads began with a legitimate topic, only to get derailed by some nonsense follow up post and the thread then goes off on some crazy tangent. While I may have been interested in the original topic, my interest disappears when I see the nonsense get going. THIS is the prime reason why I posted a few weeks ago that I was gonna take a hiatus on posting for a while. Not that I'm the most interesting poster, but it is irritating when follow up posts have little or no respect for the intent of the OP. I don't think it's anything nefarious, just unintentional noise that can and is irritatiing.

    I've been around for about 20 years, I've seen them come and go, get banned, etc, etc. Somehow things are a bit different now, it all began with the banning of Perkdog's Perkie pic. :) Just kidding, it was a cool pic, especially if you were a Florida State fan.

    Let's just try and be respectful of each others postings. Take a glance down stream of the existing threads and act accordingly. If you have something of interest, start a new thread, or just add, or not to existing threads. Some people like to post their daily quiz of the day stuff...I'm not into research to just come up with an answer, so I don't respond. The king of posting, DD, comes up with some really clever stuff and I do jump in from time to time. His posts have kept this board alive, thriving and interesting. Had it not been for his clever wit and attachments, this forum may well have slowly faded. So, props to DD.

    And yes, there was a thread or two when we get on the silly side, like the Reese's Pieces thing that went on for a while, or some crazy pic we've managed to tweak out of Google or DuckDuckGO. All in fun.

    As for Mahomes, totally irrational exuberance, he has a long, long, long way to go to even get close to Brady. Let's not forget that Hurts coughed up a golden egg...what could have been the outcome without that and perhaps a bit better performance by the Eagles? If the GOAT of the NFL is measured in SB wins, then Mahomes has a serious mountain to climb to top Brady. Can he win 6 more SBs to claim the title? Not likely, the odds are heavily against him. 17 games per season, let's say he wins 15 of each season's games to win his division. He then has to face the playoffs, one loss there and done. IF he made the SB each of the next 6 years, and again assuming he gets through the playoff games, that's like 90+ games in the next 6 years he'd have to win to top Brady. He is now of course 6 years older. You know he can't win 6 SBs in a row. So many games to play, maybe 100s, and Mahomes will be well into his late 30s or early 40s.

  • coinkatcoinkat Posts: 22,762 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 23, 2023 2:52PM

    Seems the forum would be better served by discussing what should matter- preserving the history associated with Professional sports. These GOAT discussions are pointless as well as meaningless. Drama seems to have greater attraction than encouraging a discussion of players that truly had an impact which over time has been reduced to a footnote. I suspect there are reasons for this that were briefly outlined in another reply to a different thread with the same subject matter

    Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.

  • thisistheshowthisistheshow Posts: 9,386 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @coinkat said:
    Seems the forum would be better served by discussing what should matter- preserving the history associated with Professional sports. These GOAT discussions are pointless as well as meaningless. Drama seems to have greater attraction than encouraging a discussion of players that truly had an impact which over time has been reduced to a footnote. I suspect there are reasons for this that were briefly outlined in another reply to a different thread with the same subject matter

    ....
    I appreciate your sentiment, but I do not agree that GOAT discussions are pointless or impossible. I do, however, agree that discussions about the history of the sports, including a wide variety of the players, are very beneficial and often cast aside in favor of more streamlined discussions which turn argumentative.

  • perkdogperkdog Posts: 29,456 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Personally whether it's a GOAT discussion or Double D making a comical post about a player it's all Sports Talk and it's good for the forum

  • HydrantHydrant Posts: 7,773 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 23, 2023 9:17PM


  • thisistheshowthisistheshow Posts: 9,386 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Hydrant said:

    ......
    What seems to be the trouble? I know that you like to communicate by images with captions, but sometimes it's more effective to verbalize your thoughts and concerns.

  • fergie23fergie23 Posts: 2,081 ✭✭✭✭

    So weird, Mahomes is definitely on the right trajectory and his QB play has had a bigger impact his first 6 years on the Chiefs and their success than Brady's QB played did on the Pats and their success through Brady's first 6 years. Brady was mostly considered a game manager early in his career and the Pats won due to a stout defense and very timely playmaking from Brady. Once Brady got some real receivers, he took off as a QB though it took almost a decade for him to win another SB.

    Where Mahomes will most likely fall off is longevity. I just don't see the drive to compete into his 40s at an elite level for most QBs. Look what one extra year cost Brady in terms of his family? Most players aren't going to want to make that sort of sacrifice once they have it all.

    Robb

Sign In or Register to comment.