@WCC said:
Most coins are in collections, not in some dealer's inventory. I infer you know this. This is the primary reason there should be limited to no expectation of finding even semi-scarce coins (especially of moderate to low value like this one) at a coin show.
The true gems don't generally show up in a dealer's inventory or at a show after they buy a collection. Established dealers tend to know who the buyer/collectors are in their specialty and those gems go directly into one of those collections without ever being made publicly available.
I agree, but the difference is that with actually really scarce or rare coins, the practice you describe means that there is proportionately a lot less or virtually nothing to buy. With a somewhat scarce series like this one that I don't believe is that scarce, the diligent collector should be able to find it even in the higher/highest TPG grades.
With the series I primarily collect, some of the coins in the best known collections might be in TPG holders but not many, to my knowledge. My assumption is that it trades privately as you state, either passing through a dealer or directly between collectors. These sales occurred in 1988, 1991, and 1996, so some of the coins might be owned by the collector who bought it at the auction. I doubt it is most though.
The same seems to be true of the highest preference South African coinage. For these, most are probably owned by local collectors, but it doesn't hardly ever appear in international auctions (when I actively checked) and doesn't seem to be offered publicly by local dealers either. In a country with a rather small collector base, my inference is that the more affluent collectors (as opposed to speculators) know each other and deal direct.
A lot of my top pop coins are top pop only by virtue of the fact that I've been the only fool who's silly enough to submit one.
LOL
I've done it a couple of times. Take my PCGS MS63 1972 Tanzania FAO 5-shiling, for example. Top pop. Sole certified example. A cool looking coin, too, despite being only MS63 with some noticeable marks on it.
But essentially, it's a $3-ish coin in a $45-ish holder.
Why would I put something like that in an expensive slab? Sentimental reasons. Because I lived in Tanzania in 1972, and one of these coins was the first allowance my parents ever gave me. I got one of these per week, if I was well-behaved. Brings back fond memories.
My collection is all in slabs, and I wanted to add one of these to my collection (I never saved any of the ones I got from my childhood allowance in Tanzania- those went towards buying model airplane kits.) Decades later, I found this one in a bulk lot, and it had the correct date. I figure it cost me about a quarter before the slab fees.
The point being, top pop doesn't mean much on something like this, which not many people would bother to submit. But it's still kind of fun. I'd say that goes for more esoteric stuff, too. I've got some medals and jetons (even US ones) that are top pop (1/0) pieces. But that's again because they're off the beaten path, and thus not something anybody else submitted one of.
I do have a few other top pop/sole-certified pieces which are older and/or actually worth something. I just thought I'd bring up the fact that I've also got several that aren't.
This Conder token is the second highest graded by PCGS, and the sixth highest across PCGS and NGC. Which makes it the worst D&H Lancashire 1 in the world
Did the grade make any difference when I bought it? Of course not.
Comments
I agree, but the difference is that with actually really scarce or rare coins, the practice you describe means that there is proportionately a lot less or virtually nothing to buy. With a somewhat scarce series like this one that I don't believe is that scarce, the diligent collector should be able to find it even in the higher/highest TPG grades.
With the series I primarily collect, some of the coins in the best known collections might be in TPG holders but not many, to my knowledge. My assumption is that it trades privately as you state, either passing through a dealer or directly between collectors. These sales occurred in 1988, 1991, and 1996, so some of the coins might be owned by the collector who bought it at the auction. I doubt it is most though.
The same seems to be true of the highest preference South African coinage. For these, most are probably owned by local collectors, but it doesn't hardly ever appear in international auctions (when I actively checked) and doesn't seem to be offered publicly by local dealers either. In a country with a rather small collector base, my inference is that the more affluent collectors (as opposed to speculators) know each other and deal direct.
A lot of my top pop coins are top pop only by virtue of the fact that I've been the only fool who's silly enough to submit one.
LOL
I've done it a couple of times. Take my PCGS MS63 1972 Tanzania FAO 5-shiling, for example. Top pop. Sole certified example. A cool looking coin, too, despite being only MS63 with some noticeable marks on it.
But essentially, it's a $3-ish coin in a $45-ish holder.
Why would I put something like that in an expensive slab? Sentimental reasons. Because I lived in Tanzania in 1972, and one of these coins was the first allowance my parents ever gave me. I got one of these per week, if I was well-behaved. Brings back fond memories.
My collection is all in slabs, and I wanted to add one of these to my collection (I never saved any of the ones I got from my childhood allowance in Tanzania- those went towards buying model airplane kits.) Decades later, I found this one in a bulk lot, and it had the correct date. I figure it cost me about a quarter before the slab fees.
The point being, top pop doesn't mean much on something like this, which not many people would bother to submit. But it's still kind of fun. I'd say that goes for more esoteric stuff, too. I've got some medals and jetons (even US ones) that are top pop (1/0) pieces. But that's again because they're off the beaten path, and thus not something anybody else submitted one of.
I do have a few other top pop/sole-certified pieces which are older and/or actually worth something. I just thought I'd bring up the fact that I've also got several that aren't.
This Conder token is the second highest graded by PCGS, and the sixth highest across PCGS and NGC. Which makes it the worst D&H Lancashire 1 in the world
Did the grade make any difference when I bought it? Of course not.