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Ebay mistake

derrybderryb Posts: 36,189 ✭✭✭✭✭
edited December 15, 2022 5:07PM in U.S. Coin Forum

sold a raw peace dollar on ebay as part of a lot of five coins that sold for $150. Turns out the peace should have been listed as a morgan as that is what I actually had and what I shipped. Seller calls me seeking restitution. I explained that he paid $30 each for the raw peace and morgans and that I would refund his $30 upon return of the one coin. He argued that he should be refunded $100 for the coin because that was the value of the coin I mistakenly identified as a peace dollar. I explained refunds are based on cost not on value. I asked him if he returned a TV to Walmart should he be refunded what he paid or the new lower value because the box had been opened. He finally agreed to keep the common date morgan and accept a $10 refund on the $30 he paid for it. I explained that I was doing what was fair but I could tell he still thought he should get a $100 refund. I apologized for the error, thanked him for communicating with me before filing a claim, and processed his $10 refund.

Should a seller refund the value of an item or simply what the buyer paid for it?

Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar

Comments

  • jesbrokenjesbroken Posts: 9,254 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I agree. You would have been better off to refunded the whole auction upon return. Either way this customer is most likely lost, but you would have protection against a complaint filed regardless of your gift of $10 for the error. If after offering a refund, the seller refused and complained to ebay you would have the proof that you offered what ebay expects and no marks against you. JMO
    Jim


    When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln

    Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.....Mark Twain
  • derrybderryb Posts: 36,189 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 15, 2022 8:18PM

    By intentionally avoiding a return I avoided paying shipping for a return and even more shipping when I relisted and sold again. ;)

    Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar

  • vplite99vplite99 Posts: 1,180 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I would have offered a full refund, but apparently you came out OK. Just as long as no bad feedback is left.

    And in general, aren't Morgans worth more than Peace?

    Vplite99
  • jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 31,845 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @vplite99 said:
    I would have offered a full refund, but apparently you came out OK. Just as long as no bad feedback is left.

    And in general, aren't Morgans worth more than Peace?

    Not a 1921

  • daltexdaltex Posts: 3,486 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @derryb said:
    sold a raw peace dollar on ebay as part of a lot of five coins that sold for $150. Turns out the peace should have been listed as a morgan as that is what I actually had and what I shipped. Seller calls me seeking restitution. I explained that he paid $30 each for the raw peace and morgans and that I would refund his $30 upon return of the one coin. He argued that he should be refunded $100 for the coin because that was the value of the coin I mistakenly identified as a peace dollar. I explained refunds are based on cost not on value. I asked him if he returned a TV to Walmart should he be refunded what he paid or the new lower value because the box had been opened. He finally agreed to keep the common date morgan and accept a $10 refund on the $30 he paid for it. I explained that I was doing what was fair but I could tell he still thought he should get a $100 refund. I apologized for the error, thanked him for communicating with me before filing a claim, and processed his $10 refund.

    Should a seller refund the value of an item or simply what the buyer paid for it?

    Obviously the latter, but if you buy a group of five coins for $150 it is very unlikely you wish to have paid precisely $30 for each one. If your customer valued the Peace at $100 and the other four at $20 each so that $180 is a fair price (to him) for the lot and you offered him another $20 coin for the $100 coin, plus $10 cash he would have paid $150 for something worth $110. He may not even have bought if he wouldn't have gotten the (perceived) 20% discount.

    If you buy a TV and three packs of gum from WalMart for $800 and return the TV you'd expect a heck of a lot more than $200.

  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Upon hearing his misguided opinion and request, I would have asked for the entire lot to be returned. Just not worth the hassle IMO. Yes, @derryb... shipping costs, but problem over and block the buyer. JMO Cheers, RickO

  • jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 31,845 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @vplite99 said:
    I would have offered a full refund, but apparently you came out OK. Just as long as no bad feedback is left.

    And in general, aren't Morgans worth more than Peace?

    Not a 1921> @daltex said:

    @derryb said:
    sold a raw peace dollar on ebay as part of a lot of five coins that sold for $150. Turns out the peace should have been listed as a morgan as that is what I actually had and what I shipped. Seller calls me seeking restitution. I explained that he paid $30 each for the raw peace and morgans and that I would refund his $30 upon return of the one coin. He argued that he should be refunded $100 for the coin because that was the value of the coin I mistakenly identified as a peace dollar. I explained refunds are based on cost not on value. I asked him if he returned a TV to Walmart should he be refunded what he paid or the new lower value because the box had been opened. He finally agreed to keep the common date morgan and accept a $10 refund on the $30 he paid for it. I explained that I was doing what was fair but I could tell he still thought he should get a $100 refund. I apologized for the error, thanked him for communicating with me before filing a claim, and processed his $10 refund.

    Should a seller refund the value of an item or simply what the buyer paid for it?

    Obviously the latter, but if you buy a group of five coins for $150 it is very unlikely you wish to have paid precisely $30 for each one. If your customer valued the Peace at $100 and the other four at $20 each so that $180 is a fair price (to him) for the lot and you offered him another $20 coin for the $100 coin, plus $10 cash he would have paid $150 for something worth $110. He may not even have bought if he wouldn't have gotten the (perceived) 20% discount.

    If you buy a TV and three packs of gum from WalMart for $800 and return the TV you'd expect a heck of a lot more than $200.

    This is a valid consideration, although apparent the $10 appeased him.

    I would be willing to return the 3 packs of gum for $600.

  • JBKJBK Posts: 14,734 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @daltex said:

    If you buy a TV and three packs of gum from WalMart for $800 and return the TV you'd expect a heck of a lot more than $200.

    Interesting comparison, except that at Walmart everything has an individual price on it.

    If the buyer of the group of coins isn't happy with a partial refund on the one item at issue, then he can return the whole lot for a full refund.

    He can then buy his gum elsewhere. :p

  • telephoto1telephoto1 Posts: 4,740 ✭✭✭✭✭

    If there was a legit error in the listing, that's on me. I would gladly accept a return of the whole lot for a full refund of what was paid...but the buyer can't pick and choose what he returns from the lot. All or none.


    RIP Mom- 1932-2012
  • 291fifth291fifth Posts: 23,936 ✭✭✭✭✭

    It is your error and your problem to correct it.

    All glory is fleeting.
  • DeplorableDanDeplorableDan Posts: 2,532 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @291fifth said:
    It is your error and your problem to correct it.

    Correct, but I don’t think that OP was ever questioning that it was his error, he was asking for opinions regarding the fairest solution for all parties.

  • logger7logger7 Posts: 8,069 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Negotiators often start out shooting for the moon then accepting reasonable concessions. In this case the phone call was the route toward an amicable solution. It's that time of year after all, time to drop the adversarial stance and try to come to a conciliatory solution especially since you made the listing error. I had a similar situation recently, a Seated dime described as a "VF" but somehow I had run the wrong pictures of a Seated quarter. I sent the dime in the original dealer 2x2 which showed I had paid $12 for the coin I sold for $15 with free shipping. Fortunately the buyer did not call me on my error.

  • derrybderryb Posts: 36,189 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 16, 2022 3:24PM

    @daltex said:

    Should a seller refund the value of an item or simply what the buyer paid for it?

    Obviously the latter, but if you buy a group of five coins for $150 it is very unlikely you wish to have paid precisely $30 for each one. If your customer valued the Peace at $100 and the other four at $20 each so that $180 is a fair price (to him) for the lot and you offered him another $20 coin for the $100 coin, plus $10 cash he would have paid $150 for something worth $110. He may not even have bought if he wouldn't have gotten the (perceived) 20% discount.

    If you buy a TV and three packs of gum from WalMart for $800 and return the TV you'd expect a heck of a lot more than $200.

    Buyer received four common date Morgans and one common date peace. All the same flavor of gum with the same silver content.

    Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar

  • rte592rte592 Posts: 1,447 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 16, 2022 5:17PM

    The buyer wanted that 21 peace dollar at a 21 Morgan price.
    You could always add see pictures ask questions to your listing.
    Maybe this buyer would have asked questions.
    Probably NOT, sounds like he was look for a deal on a 21 peace hoping you had one.

  • derrybderryb Posts: 36,189 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @rte592 said:

    You could always add see pictures ask questions to your listing.

    listing had large obverse and reverse pics of the four Peace dollars and the one Morgan. Error was in the title where I identified them all as Peace dollars.

    Yes, buyer jumped right on the purchase without looking at the pics. Still, my mistake.

    Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar

  • jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 31,845 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @JBK said:

    @daltex said:

    If you buy a TV and three packs of gum from WalMart for $800 and return the TV you'd expect a heck of a lot more than $200.

    Interesting comparison, except that at Walmart everything has an individual price on it.

    If the buyer of the group of coins isn't happy with a partial refund on the one item at issue, then he can return the whole lot for a full refund.

    He can then buy his gum elsewhere. :p

    To be fair, the 5 coins did not have individual values assigned to them. So it could well have been one TV and 4 sticks of gum. > @derryb said:

    @daltex said:

    Should a seller refund the value of an item or simply what the buyer paid for it?

    Obviously the latter, but if you buy a group of five coins for $150 it is very unlikely you wish to have paid precisely $30 for each one. If your customer valued the Peace at $100 and the other four at $20 each so that $180 is a fair price (to him) for the lot and you offered him another $20 coin for the $100 coin, plus $10 cash he would have paid $150 for something worth $110. He may not even have bought if he wouldn't have gotten the (perceived) 20% discount.

    If you buy a TV and three packs of gum from WalMart for $800 and return the TV you'd expect a heck of a lot more than $200.

    Buyer received four common date Morgans and one common date peace. All the same flavor of gum with the same silver content.

    People don't only buy them for silver content.

  • derrybderryb Posts: 36,189 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 16, 2022 6:32PM

    @jmlanzaf said:

    People don't only buy them for silver content.

    Yet many do. They were priced for what they were - silver. Doesn't matter to me if the buyer wants to play checkers with them.

    Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar

  • MasonGMasonG Posts: 6,268 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @derryb said:
    Yes, buyer jumped right on the purchase without looking at the pics.

    I had a buyer recently who jumped on the purchase without looking at the title, description or pics- only the BIN price after my listing came up in his search.

    Of course, I ended up cancelling the transaction for him once he got around to actually looking at what he bought.

  • rte592rte592 Posts: 1,447 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 16, 2022 7:11PM

    @MasonG said:

    @derryb said:
    Yes, buyer jumped right on the purchase without looking at the pics.

    I had a buyer recently who jumped on the purchase without looking at the title, description or pics- only the BIN price after my listing came up in his search.

    Of course, I ended up cancelling the transaction for him once he got around to actually looking at what he bought.

    I had just the opposite.
    I stumbled on a seller with some gold coins at a good price relatively.
    All BIN priced, I picked one and did some research/price checking to make sure I was right that his prices were good/low.
    I went back to the item in a minute and the item was gone (poof)
    I picked another one and did the same, went back to the item in 30 seconds and it too was gone (POOF)
    Everything was flying off the shelf and I spotted a 1943 Mexican 50 Peso So I jumped on it...hit the BIN and then went to read what it said about the listing.
    When I got done with my purchase most everything else was long gone...the seller didn't have a whole lot of feedback but no negatives.
    The coin came in and looks better than pictured.

  • MasonGMasonG Posts: 6,268 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @rte592 said:
    I had just the opposite.

    The current value of the coin my "buyer" was looking for was 10x my price. He hit the BIN button without even looking at my listing or description.

  • jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 31,845 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @derryb said:

    @jmlanzaf said:

    People don't only buy them for silver content.

    Yet many do. They were priced for what they were - silver. Doesn't matter to me if the buyer wants to play checkers with them.

    They were priced right for dollar coins. The silver content is under $20. And while dime people do buy them for silver, as I acknowledged, not everyone does. I'm not saying you should have given him $100. That request was silly . But he may not have valued them all equally even if you do.

  • jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 31,845 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @MasonG said:

    @derryb said:
    Yes, buyer jumped right on the purchase without looking at the pics.

    I had a buyer recently who jumped on the purchase without looking at the title, description or pics- only the BIN price after my listing came up in his search.

    Of course, I ended up cancelling the transaction for him once he got around to actually looking at what he bought.

    I had a buyer but a Barber quarter when he wanted a Barber Half. Lol. They don't have the same semi-keys.

    My favorite this week was a customer who messaged me about the Joe Satriana "miniature replica guitar". The picture even had a ruler in it, showing it to be 10 inches long. He wanted to know if it had an Amp jack and whether it could be played. Lol. I wanted to ask him how small his hands were.

  • MasonGMasonG Posts: 6,268 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @MasonG said:

    @derryb said:
    Yes, buyer jumped right on the purchase without looking at the pics.

    I had a buyer recently who jumped on the purchase without looking at the title, description or pics- only the BIN price after my listing came up in his search.

    Of course, I ended up cancelling the transaction for him once he got around to actually looking at what he bought.

    I had a buyer but a Barber quarter when he wanted a Barber Half. Lol. They don't have the same semi-keys.

    Pretty much the same thing here. It was a Mexican 10 centavos, buyer somehow imagined (not from my title, picture or description however) it was a 20 centavos.

  • blitzdudeblitzdude Posts: 5,437 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @vplite99 said:
    I would have offered a full refund, but apparently you came out OK. Just as long as no bad feedback is left.

    And in general, aren't Morgans worth more than Peace?

    Not a 1921

    Exactly and my guess is the op listed as a 1921 Peace and the buyer received a 1921 Morgan. I'd be looking for a full refund too. RGDS!

    The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.

  • BStrauss3BStrauss3 Posts: 3,158 ✭✭✭✭✭

    If the buyer doesn't like what they received, it would be a clear SNAD and thus a refund. Of the TOTAL lot. They get a refund, you get the coins back and you can relist them. That's the remedy.

    -----Burton
    ANA 50 year/Life Member (now "Emeritus")
  • DollarAfterDollarDollarAfterDollar Posts: 3,214 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Agree with BStrauss3.

    If you do what you always did, you get what you always got.
  • jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 31,845 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @BStrauss3 said:
    If the buyer doesn't like what they received, it would be a clear SNAD and thus a refund. Of the TOTAL lot. They get a refund, you get the coins back and you can relist them. That's the remedy.

    That really isn't the only option. You could SNAD, but you don't have to SNAD. The OPs solution is a better solution for both parties

  • logger7logger7 Posts: 8,069 ✭✭✭✭✭

    A phone call if an option is a great remedy; a local seller does that often on problem transactions.

  • daltexdaltex Posts: 3,486 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @BStrauss3 said:
    If the buyer doesn't like what they received, it would be a clear SNAD and thus a refund. Of the TOTAL lot. They get a refund, you get the coins back and you can relist them. That's the remedy.

    That really isn't the only option. You could SNAD, but you don't have to SNAD. The OPs solution is a better solution for both parties

    Depends how the buyer valued the coins. OP said they should have been considered at silver value, so what difference does it make? But, of course, silver value is somewhere around $90. Now everyone here values non-cull Morgan and Peace dollars above melt, but there is no guarantee that an eBay bidder would. So he may have purchased four $18 coins and one $100 coin for $150 which would make him happy, but paying $140 for five $18 coins wouldn't be a good solution.

  • jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 31,845 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @daltex said:

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @BStrauss3 said:
    If the buyer doesn't like what they received, it would be a clear SNAD and thus a refund. Of the TOTAL lot. They get a refund, you get the coins back and you can relist them. That's the remedy.

    That really isn't the only option. You could SNAD, but you don't have to SNAD. The OPs solution is a better solution for both parties

    Depends how the buyer valued the coins. OP said they should have been considered at silver value, so what difference does it make? But, of course, silver value is somewhere around $90. Now everyone here values non-cull Morgan and Peace dollars above melt, but there is no guarantee that an eBay bidder would. So he may have purchased four $18 coins and one $100 coin for $150 which would make him happy, but paying $140 for five $18 coins wouldn't be a good solution.

    The buyer accepted the solution. Period. It is better for everyone. The OP could not have forced his solution in the buyer. But offering such a remedy is far better than forcing the buyer to SNAD. If the buyer had only wanted the one coin, he could have requested a full return. He did not.

    People seem to be cherry picking pieces of the story. OBVIOUSLY the buyer did not consider them five $18 coins.

  • MasonGMasonG Posts: 6,268 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @jmlanzaf said:
    OBVIOUSLY the buyer did not consider them five $18 coins.

    The buyer wanted $100 and settled for $10. I'm not sure anyone here can reliably predict what the buyer is thinking. ;)

  • JimTylerJimTyler Posts: 3,051 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I just had eBay seller send my coin to someone else and I got his coin. Seller is covering overnight shipping and sending me my coin along with 50 bucks.

  • jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 31,845 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @MasonG said:

    @jmlanzaf said:
    OBVIOUSLY the buyer did not consider them five $18 coins.

    The buyer wanted $100 and settled for $10. I'm not sure anyone here can reliably predict what the buyer is thinking. ;)

    He wouldn't have accepted the offer if he thought otherwise. He could have filed a SNAD. He didn't.

  • MasonGMasonG Posts: 6,268 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @jmlanzaf said:
    He wouldn't have accepted the offer if he thought otherwise.

    Agreed.

    @jmlanzaf said:
    He could have filed a SNAD.

    Yes, he could have.

    @jmlanzaf said:
    He didn't.

    No, he didn't.

    I still maintain that you can't reliably predict what someone who asks for $100 and settles for $10 is going to do.

  • jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 31,845 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @MasonG said:

    @jmlanzaf said:
    He wouldn't have accepted the offer if he thought otherwise.

    Agreed.

    @jmlanzaf said:
    He could have filed a SNAD.

    Yes, he could have.

    @jmlanzaf said:
    He didn't.

    No, he didn't.

    I still maintain that you can't reliably predict what someone who asks for $100 and settles for $10 is going to do.

    I don't have to know exactly what he's thinking to know what he wasn't thinking. If he thought he had $90 worth of coins, he would not have settled for $140.

  • blitzdudeblitzdude Posts: 5,437 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 18, 2022 5:11PM

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @MasonG said:

    @jmlanzaf said:
    He wouldn't have accepted the offer if he thought otherwise.

    Agreed.

    @jmlanzaf said:
    He could have filed a SNAD.

    Yes, he could have.

    @jmlanzaf said:
    He didn't.

    No, he didn't.

    I still maintain that you can't reliably predict what someone who asks for $100 and settles for $10 is going to do.

    I don't have to know exactly what he's thinking to know what he wasn't thinking. If he thought he had $90 worth of coins, he would not have settled for $140.

    Op tricked the buyer into thinking they were getting a '21 Peace instead of a '21 Morgan. Hopefully Op finally learned their lesson. Lets take a deep breath and move on. THKS!

    The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.

  • The user and all related content has been deleted.
  • MFeldMFeld Posts: 12,020 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @blitzdude said:

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @MasonG said:

    @jmlanzaf said:
    He wouldn't have accepted the offer if he thought otherwise.

    Agreed.

    @jmlanzaf said:
    He could have filed a SNAD.

    Yes, he could have.

    @jmlanzaf said:
    He didn't.

    No, he didn't.

    I still maintain that you can't reliably predict what someone who asks for $100 and settles for $10 is going to do.

    I don't have to know exactly what he's thinking to know what he wasn't thinking. If he thought he had $90 worth of coins, he would not have settled for $140.

    Op tricked the buyer into thinking they were getting a '21 Peace instead of a '21 Morgan. Hopefully Op finally learned their lesson. Lets take a deep breath and move on. THKS!

    Before moving on... I take the OP at his word that he made an honest mistake. And if that was the case, the buyer wasn’t “tricked”. Perhaps you should take a deep breath.😉

    Trick: “ 1. a cunning or skillful act or scheme intended to deceive or outwit someone.”

    Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.

  • derrybderryb Posts: 36,189 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 18, 2022 7:58PM

    @MFeld said:

    @blitzdude said:

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @MasonG said:

    @jmlanzaf said:
    He wouldn't have accepted the offer if he thought otherwise.

    Agreed.

    @jmlanzaf said:
    He could have filed a SNAD.

    Yes, he could have.

    @jmlanzaf said:
    He didn't.

    No, he didn't.

    I still maintain that you can't reliably predict what someone who asks for $100 and settles for $10 is going to do.

    I don't have to know exactly what he's thinking to know what he wasn't thinking. If he thought he had $90 worth of coins, he would not have settled for $140.

    Op tricked the buyer into thinking they were getting a '21 Peace instead of a '21 Morgan. Hopefully Op finally learned their lesson. Lets take a deep breath and move on. THKS!

    Before moving on... I take the OP at his word that he made an honest mistake. And if that was the case, the buyer wasn’t “tricked”. Perhaps you should take a deep breath.😉

    Trick: “ 1. a cunning or skillful act or scheme intended to deceive or outwit someone.”

    mark, this troll follows me round the forum. I believe he is an alt that got banned over a prior discussion with me and holds me responsible for his own stupidity. Comes with the territory.

    Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar

  • TRTR Posts: 50 ✭✭✭

    I accidentally sold the same coin twice. The second buyer complained so I sent him a common slabbed ms64 Franklin gratis and he was happy. My error to fix.

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