Home U.S. Coin Forum
Options

Ouch

keyman64keyman64 Posts: 15,456 ✭✭✭✭✭

I have no affiliation with this coin. I just happened to watch it both times.
I was an underbidder the first time but not a significant underbidder.
I decided not to bid the second time.

July 31, 2022 $2,694.38
https://www.greatcollections.com/Coin/1177632/1938-D-Mercury-Dime-PCGS-MS-67-FB-Toned

December 4, 2022 $388.12
https://www.greatcollections.com/Coin/1270400/1938-D-Mercury-Dime-PCGS-MS-67-FB-Toned

"If it's not fun, it's not worth it." - KeyMan64
Looking for Top Pop Mercury Dime Varieties & High Grade Mercury Dime Toners. :smile:

Comments

  • Options
    DeplorableDanDeplorableDan Posts: 2,562 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Ooooof, my sinerest condolences to the consignor

  • Options
    DCWDCW Posts: 6,977 ✭✭✭✭✭

    A market that is decided in such a way that when one person refrains from bidding the results are as you've shown is a scary game to play.
    I know, because I swim in that pool all the time. 😆
    But, this is probably only an outlier considering the popularity of most U.S. coins.
    I would hate to be the consignor right now.

    Dead Cat Waltz Exonumia
    "Coin collecting for outcasts..."

  • Options
    yspsalesyspsales Posts: 2,231 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I did something similar with some error coins.

    Wasn't near the haircut, but it was humbling.

    BST: KindaNewish (3/21/21), WQuarterFreddie (3/30/21), Meltdown (4/6/21), DBSTrader2 (5/5/21) AKA- unclemonkey on Blow Out

  • Options
    RLSnapperRLSnapper Posts: 524 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I feel much better about my $180 coin that realized $38. Flipping coins on GC is a game I won't play again!

  • Options
    CatbertCatbert Posts: 6,605 ✭✭✭✭✭

    That TV pic you posted doesn't look anything like the GC photos. :s

    "Got a flaming heart, can't get my fill"
  • Options
    davewesendavewesen Posts: 5,859 ✭✭✭✭✭

    and don't forget how much they are taking out from the buyer and seller for each time the coin goes through the sale

  • Options
    MasonGMasonG Posts: 6,268 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Catbert said:
    That TV pic you posted doesn't look anything like the GC photos. :s

    If you're trusting TVs to be accurate (except in the most advantageous lighting and viewing angle), you're eventually going to get burned.

  • Options
    CatbertCatbert Posts: 6,605 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Not me Mason. I'm not a fan of their inconsistent photos.

    "Got a flaming heart, can't get my fill"
  • Options
    TomBTomB Posts: 20,737 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Catbert said:
    That TV pic you posted doesn't look anything like the GC photos. :s

    You're not kidding!

    Thomas Bush Numismatics & Numismatic Photography

    In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson

    image
  • Options
    goldengolden Posts: 9,069 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Wow!

  • Options
    yspsalesyspsales Posts: 2,231 ✭✭✭✭✭

    On occasion, I hunt for old friends on ebay that I have flipped.

    It was a common proof but gorgeous color.

    Saw something similar happening, and PM'd the owner to download the TV since his pics were killing his chance of selling the coin.

    It is one of the first things I do when listing a coin. Check for a TV

    BST: KindaNewish (3/21/21), WQuarterFreddie (3/30/21), Meltdown (4/6/21), DBSTrader2 (5/5/21) AKA- unclemonkey on Blow Out

  • Options
    MasonGMasonG Posts: 6,268 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Catbert said:
    Not me Mason. I'm not a fan of their inconsistent photos.

    Disaster narrowly averted. ;)

  • Options
    MasonGMasonG Posts: 6,268 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @davewesen said:
    and don't forget how much they are taking out from the buyer and seller for each time the coin goes through the sale

    They're not taking anything from the buyer unless he's silly enough to not account for fees.

  • Options
    MidLifeCrisisMidLifeCrisis Posts: 10,521 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Wow. Scary.

  • Options
    TimNHTimNH Posts: 128 ✭✭✭

    Can someone help me out understanding that first bid, PCGS pricing has $450-800 for MS67FB, what caused this one to get bid to $2700 the first time? Did someone (well, 2+ people) just really like the toning?

  • Options
    DeplorableDanDeplorableDan Posts: 2,562 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 4, 2022 7:37PM

    @davewesen said:
    and don't forget how much they are taking out from the buyer and seller for each time the coin goes through the sale

    Well GC is fairly modest with the buyers premiums (10%) and the listing fees are from 3-10$. It is mind boggling when you consider that the seller of the coin only netted a little bit more than the original buyers premium he paid

  • Options
    hfjacintohfjacinto Posts: 766 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I wouldn’t have paid either amount. But good luck to those that play in those amounts.

  • Options
    MasonGMasonG Posts: 6,268 ✭✭✭✭✭

    There are times I'm happy my collecting focus is on world coins, mostly raw ones. This is one of those times.

  • Options
    LanceNewmanOCCLanceNewmanOCC Posts: 19,999 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @TomB said:

    @Catbert said:
    That TV pic you posted doesn't look anything like the GC photos. :s

    You're not kidding!

    i WAS going to pic on GC's images but they sure didn't stop it from selling for $3k+ the other time.

    i do recall some official commentary from Ian (on this forum) about the great debate of pcgs TV's and customer responses over time and GC chose to listen to the bulk of the customers.

    there should be a lot more of these results in the coming 6-24 months (if consignors don't protect their downside). it all goes up, it all goes down, back up again and down it comes. real estate, coins, stocks, inflation, interest rates, bullion, crime, etc.

    $300+ seems low no matter what though as that is a pretty merc in a pre-40 date FB high-grade. not much more one can ask for there, except a sticker?

    the first time it started at $150, the second $1. makes ya wonder if the original purchaser was actually the one to consign it.

    just scanned the barcode and it sold for less than guide. aside from the toning, there are hundreds in this grade and coming up on 100 more higher.

    <--- look what's behind the mask! - cool link 1/NO ~ 2/NNP ~ 3/NNC ~ 4/CF ~ 5/PG ~ 6/Cert ~ 7/NGC 7a/NGC pop~ 8/NGCF ~ 9/HA archives ~ 10/PM ~ 11/NM ~ 12/ANACS cert ~ 13/ANACS pop - report fakes 1/ACEF ~ report fakes/thefts 1/NCIS - Numi-Classes SS ~ Bass ~ Transcribed Docs NNP - clashed coins - error training - V V mm styles -

  • Options
    BryceMBryceM Posts: 11,735 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Well, the second result is a bit too low but the first sale was a gift to the first consignor. Lack of a sticker can be the kiss of death when big toning premiums are expected.

  • Options
    jesbrokenjesbroken Posts: 9,318 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 4, 2022 7:55PM

    Looks like an rpm-001 D/D from the pics. Shame to see the end result for the consignor. It shows what can happen(at least in the first auction) when their are multiple bidders who really want the coin. Especially since their were so many already graded by PCGS in that grade. It happens to great coins as well as average coins in an auction. keyman, you must have been just enough of an underbidder to drive these bidders into a frenzy. lol
    Jim


    When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln

    Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.....Mark Twain
  • Options
    robecrobec Posts: 6,606 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @keyman64 said:

    I decided not to bid the second time.

    Yikes!!
    You picked the wrong time nor to bid. 😀

  • Options
    U1chicagoU1chicago Posts: 5,619 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 4, 2022 8:31PM

    We also don't know if the first sale was actually completed. The high bidder might not have paid or returned the coin (I've seen a few people on Instagram comment that they return coins from GC when "overpaying").

    Still it is a huge difference; both the top bidder and underbidder look to have sat out the auction this time around (top bidder was at 2,395; 2nd bidder was at 2,345; 3rd was at 2,200 and then a big drop off with the 4th at $420).

  • Options
    davewesendavewesen Posts: 5,859 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I wonder if the first buyer ran it through PCGS looking for a 68?

  • Options
    spacehaydukespacehayduke Posts: 5,476 ✭✭✭✭✭

    GC allows returns for auction wins see below. I bet irrational exuberance occurred first time at auction, buyer returned, and it was put up again, so 1rst buyer did not lose out as a consignor 2nd time....................

    "12. Return Policy. On all non-bullion items, GreatCollections offers a generous return policy (unless otherwise marked on the item information page) as a courtesy to Buyers, providing the item is paid for within seven days of the auction date (or in the case of a Buy Now item, when you confirmed to purchase the item) and no request to delay shipment is made by Buyer. Certified coins/banknotes must be in the original sealed grading service holders. To return an item, the Buyer must notify GreatCollections within 24 hours of receipt and receive a return confirmation number. Please mail the coin or banknote via Insured Mail to GreatCollections within 72 hours of receipt of coin. Original and return shipping costs are not refunded. Returns will not be accepted without the return confirmation number. Registered bidders are allowed one free return each month. For more than one return in a calendar month, a 5% fee will apply, based on the total purchase price of the item. Clients found to be abusing our return policy will be notified in writing that they will no longer have any return policy privileges whatsoever. If you viewed the item prior to winning the auction or offered the coin for sale to any dealer, collector and/or marketplace, there is no return privilege. "

    Best, SH


    Successful transactions with-Boosibri,lkeigwin,TomB,Broadstruck,coinsarefun,Type2,jom,ProfLiz, UltraHighRelief,Barndog,EXOJUNKIE,ldhair,fivecents,paesan,Crusty...
  • Options
    DollarAfterDollarDollarAfterDollar Posts: 3,214 ✭✭✭✭✭

    The pictures HAVE to be accurate. If they were not the consignor should scream at GC.

    If you do what you always did, you get what you always got.
  • Options
    bagofnickelsbagofnickels Posts: 349 ✭✭✭✭

    I had this one in my watch list and was going to bid but I ended up buying another coin earlier in the week so I decided to pass. I really like the color on it at least as pictured. Never had issue with GC pictures myself. Very pretty dime, congrats to whoever won it.

  • Options
    COCollectorCOCollector Posts: 1,295 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 4, 2022 11:07PM

    The first sale's Bid History is interesting...

    Successful BST transactions with forum members thebigeng, SPalladino, Zoidmeister, coin22lover, coinsarefun, jwitten, CommemKing.

  • Options
    fathomfathom Posts: 1,513 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Hmm, could be more to this situation than meets the eye.

  • Options
    ZoinsZoins Posts: 33,910 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 5, 2022 8:51AM

    @LanceNewmanOCC said:

    @TomB said:

    @Catbert said:
    That TV pic you posted doesn't look anything like the GC photos. :s

    You're not kidding!

    i WAS going to pic on GC's images but they sure didn't stop it from selling for $3k+ the other time.

    Every auction house has their strengths and weaknesses.

    I'm not super surprised by the result. The first auction may have happened due to a confluence of bidders that didn't happen the second time around. This is a common occurrence in auctions generally, however, two things could have helped replicate the first auction the second time around:

    1. Close up, color-friendly photos. While there were 3 bidders above $430 the last time, that is a small number and obviously there were fewer this time, either 1 or 0. More photos could have enticed other bidders.
    2. References to prior sales. Some auction houses will highlight prior realized prices but GC doesn't and GC also doesn't list realized prices on PCGS Cert Verification.

    These are business decisions which are fine. People just need to know what they are getting when they consign.

  • Options
    yspsalesyspsales Posts: 2,231 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 5, 2022 4:49AM

    @fathom said:
    Hmm, could be more to this situation than meets the eye.

    It's a beautiful coin.

    Not a monster toner, but subtle...

    I think the $2K price might have created a stigma.

    BST: KindaNewish (3/21/21), WQuarterFreddie (3/30/21), Meltdown (4/6/21), DBSTrader2 (5/5/21) AKA- unclemonkey on Blow Out

  • Options
    rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Wow.... If the seller of the second auction, was the winner of the first auction, that is disastrous.... Cheers, RickO

  • Options
    jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 31,997 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Zoins said:

    TBut if thhat TV pic you posted doesn't look anything like the GC photos. :s

    You're not kidding!

    i WAS going to pic on GC's images but they sure didn't stop it from selling for $3k+ the other time.

    Every auction house has their strengths and weaknesses.

    I'm not super surprised by the result. The first auction may have happened due to a confluence of bidders that didn't happen the second time around. This is a common occurrence in auctions generally, however, two things could have helped replicate the first auction the second time around:

    1. Close up, color-friendly photos. While there were 3 bidders above $430 the last time, that is a small number and obviously there were fewer time, either 1 or 0. More photos could have enticed other bidders.
    2. References to prior sales. Some auction houses will highlight prior realized prices but GC doesn't and GC also doesn't list on PCGS Cert Verification.

    These are business decisions which is fine. People just need to know that they are getting when they consign.

    But if they were to highight prior sales of the general type, the results would all be significantly LOWER than the $2000+. And if they highlighted the $2000+ exact coin, bidders are going to wonder why it is back up for auction so quickly.

  • Options
    ZoinsZoins Posts: 33,910 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 5, 2022 6:05AM

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @Zoins said:

    TBut if thhat TV pic you posted doesn't look anything like the GC photos. :s

    You're not kidding!

    i WAS going to pic on GC's images but they sure didn't stop it from selling for $3k+ the other time.

    Every auction house has their strengths and weaknesses.

    I'm not super surprised by the result. The first auction may have happened due to a confluence of bidders that didn't happen the second time around. This is a common occurrence in auctions generally, however, two things could have helped replicate the first auction the second time around:

    1. Close up, color-friendly photos. While there were 3 bidders above $430 the last time, that is a small number and obviously there were fewer time, either 1 or 0. More photos could have enticed other bidders.
    2. References to prior sales. Some auction houses will highlight prior realized prices but GC doesn't and GC also doesn't list on PCGS Cert Verification.

    These are business decisions which is fine. People just need to know that they are getting when they consign.

    But if they were to highight prior sales of the general type, the results would all be significantly LOWER than the $2000+. And if they highlighted the $2000+ exact coin, bidders are going to wonder why it is back up for auction so quickly.

    Regarding showing past prices for the actual coin, there’s been a recent discussion on such a piece here, sold for strong prices 5 times in the past 3 years.

    Glamour shots may get people over the recentness of the sales.

  • Options
    DelawareDoonsDelawareDoons Posts: 3,254 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 5, 2022 6:05AM

    I am not pointing fingers or naming names, but given my dealings with dealers over the years, and things I've been told/overheard, there are definitely some auction results that are uh... preordained unless another bidder shows up. Let's just say that.

    Professional Numismatist. "It's like God, Family, Country, except Sticker, Plastic, Coin."

  • Options
    LanceNewmanOCCLanceNewmanOCC Posts: 19,999 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @COCollector said:
    The first sale's Bid History is interesting...

    .
    i've seen a LOT of that on ebay, where a big bidder comes along out of nowhere and takes the hammer. took me a couple missed items in situations like that before i adjusted my bidding a bit for items i really wanted.

    <--- look what's behind the mask! - cool link 1/NO ~ 2/NNP ~ 3/NNC ~ 4/CF ~ 5/PG ~ 6/Cert ~ 7/NGC 7a/NGC pop~ 8/NGCF ~ 9/HA archives ~ 10/PM ~ 11/NM ~ 12/ANACS cert ~ 13/ANACS pop - report fakes 1/ACEF ~ report fakes/thefts 1/NCIS - Numi-Classes SS ~ Bass ~ Transcribed Docs NNP - clashed coins - error training - V V mm styles -

  • Options
    WilliamFWilliamF Posts: 832 ✭✭✭✭✭

    :o:o:'(

    ."It's a dangerous business... going out your door. You step onto the road, and if you don't keep your feet, there's no knowing where you might be swept off to" -JRR Tolkien_________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________Outstanding BST transactions as a seller, buyer and trader with: ----- mustanggt, Kliao, claudewill87, MWallace, paesan, mpbuck82, moursund, basetsb, lordmarcovan, JWP, Coin hunter 4, COINS MAKE CENTS, PerryHall, Aspie_Rocco, Braddick, DBSTrader2, SanctionII, Histman, The_Dinosaur_Man, jesbroken, CentSearcher ------ANA Member #3214817

  • Options
    TPRCTPRC Posts: 3,740 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I also am not a fan of GC's photography and feel that it underrepresents a coin's appearance at times. However, in this instance, the photographs were identical.

    Tom

  • Options
    ZoinsZoins Posts: 33,910 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 5, 2022 9:50AM

    @TPRC said:
    I also am not a fan of GC's photography and feel that it underrepresents a coin's appearance at times. However, in this instance, the photographs were identical.

    Agree the photos are the same but the participants in the auction are different. Just because the photos were able to get a critical mass of buyers one time doesn’t mean better photos wouldn’t help another time.

  • Options
    DollarAfterDollarDollarAfterDollar Posts: 3,214 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 5, 2022 9:40AM

    Well, now I'm confused. The photo Jon posted shows color in much greater detail than that of Great Collections photo's. Which is accurate to the naked eye?

    If you do what you always did, you get what you always got.
  • Options
    TomBTomB Posts: 20,737 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @DollarAfterDollar said:
    Well, now I'm confused. The photo Jon posted shows color in much greater detail than that of Great Collections photo's. Which is accurate to the naked eye?

    Depending upon the type of lighting used, they may both be accurate to the naked eye.

    Thomas Bush Numismatics & Numismatic Photography

    In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson

    image
  • Options
    telephoto1telephoto1 Posts: 4,751 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 5, 2022 11:41AM

    Weird deal. I hope it was the owner who bought it back at least.
    All it takes is a couple or three toning fanatics to run things up. Anyone remember the $69,000 Oregon Trail toner?
    Edit to add- It's weird that it went back on the market so quickly. Maybe auction fever the first time and then couldn't afford to keep it...?


    RIP Mom- 1932-2012
  • Options
    oldabeintxoldabeintx Posts: 1,638 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Very nice coin in all photos. Looks well worth the second result based on like auction history. Last year GC sold a very nice generic 66 buff for me at 8X list. Had a green sticker in a rattler holder. I didn't even bother to look at the result until the next day. I was shocked, pleasantly so. It was very nice, handpicked raw by me many yeas ago, but no clue what the bidders saw.

  • Options
    airplanenutairplanenut Posts: 21,910 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Is there any chance the first sale never went through? The GC photos in the two listings are identical (as in, the same photo, not just they look really similar). At least when I'm handling a consignment, if I get a coin consigned a second time, it gets a new photo, even if just because it's easier to process that way than to go dig up the old file. Maybe the sale didn't go through, the coin went to CAC, and then it was relisted... that could explain the delay between relisting.

    ...or the second consignor lost big.

    JK Coin Photography - eBay Consignments | High Quality Photos | LOW Prices | 20% of Consignment Proceeds Go to Pancreatic Cancer Research
  • Options

    I'm going to go out on a limb and say we won't be seeing this in the relentless GC "Look how much more than what it's worth we sold this for" propaganda!

  • Options
    BarberianBarberian Posts: 3,056 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @TomB said:

    @DollarAfterDollar said:
    Well, now I'm confused. The photo Jon posted shows color in much greater detail than that of Great Collections photo's. Which is accurate to the naked eye?

    Depending upon the type of lighting used, they may both be accurate to the naked eye.

    True, and that may be particularly so for GC photos. It's often not true for Trueviews where the color, contrast, and light levels may be deliberately enhanced by editing software. In some cases, the Trueviews are so juiced that I could never use them as seller's photos without substantial editing.


    3 rim nicks away from Good

Leave a Comment

BoldItalicStrikethroughOrdered listUnordered list
Emoji
Image
Align leftAlign centerAlign rightToggle HTML viewToggle full pageToggle lights
Drop image/file