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2019 Guam P over S Re-punched?

Would the loss of silver through circulation cause the coin to appear as though it is brass or bronze in color? Also, if a normal Guam quarter weighs 5.7 grams and this one weighs 5.72, is it safe to assume that it was once silver, or do slightly heavier coins make it through on occasion too?














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    @291fifth I don’t care if you value it at more than 25 cents. I asked a question, and if you don’t have any information in the form of an answer to my question, then please refrain from offering your personal opinion. Is it so hard to understand that I care to know if it is unique based on the things that I point out rather than giving a crap if it’s worth more than it’s face value to you?

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    Jzyskowski1Jzyskowski1 Posts: 6,651 ✭✭✭✭✭

    🎶 shout shout, let it all out 🎶

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    MFeldMFeld Posts: 12,052 ✭✭✭✭✭

    In answer to your four questions: No, no, no and yes.

    Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.

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    rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @MFeld has provided the answers to your questions, and I agree. No numismatic oddities. Cheers, RickO

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    FrazFraz Posts: 1,854 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November 25, 2022 7:42AM

    .> @MFeld said:

    In answer to your four questions: No, no, no and yes.

    Thank you. This how to answer questions.
    I understand the poster’s ire.

    @DieHardWithVengence has zeal, persistence, and the gear. Give us time to learn, who does not waste time on folly?

    I busted on him at the end of his quarter thread; I see now that he is not afraid to put up with the stool to learn. OP is determined and discouragement will not curb his curiosity. When he gets tired of here, he goes across the street and absorbs the same apathetic treatment; It is worse there.

    If I had posted a year ago (I read the archived threads here and across the street for half a year) I would be asking the same questions. I do not expect folk to search before posting, that would be absurd; they don’t.

    When a n00b post asks a question about what causes something, not asking how much, nor how rare, nor what to do with it, he receives the forum cliches for replies.
    Until we n00bs have a valid number of posts, or infamy we put up with emotional replies, not objective answers.

    It is not your job to teach if you don’t care to correct, but ennui and jaded responses are discouraging.
    Ennui is an emotion.

    How about thinking what to post, when not prone to teach, when impulse control fails?

    When a poster attacks you, my mentors, and persists, I will peck and burn him—for raw entertainment.

    Get over the lolling, address the languor that prods disdain of the uninformed.
    If is harder to nurture someone than peck in order, then refuse, continue buggering.

    No, nurture only goes so far; alligator mommies eat slow babies.

    One of the elders here encourages me, and I would do anything in return for that kindness—Craig.

    Right away, I will start a discussion to continue my hijack elsewhere.

    @DieHardWithVengence—if you do not adjust to the constructive critique that you read, then, I am wrong to defend you.

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    silverpopsilverpop Posts: 6,599 ✭✭✭✭✭

    people tend not to like being told something different then what they think is correct just basic you are wrong i'm right route

    many new posters are here for one thing major $$$$$ that they think they can get by supposedly finding these types of coins

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    IkesTIkesT Posts: 2,580 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @DieHardWithVengence You are experiencing pareidolia - there is no S mint mark.

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    morgandollar1878morgandollar1878 Posts: 4,006 ✭✭✭✭✭

    The mintmark was added to the master design, and not added to the striking dies like they used to be. So, it is not possible for it to be a P over S mint mark. A silver coin from the mint is going to be a silver alloy which is mixed metal, the silver is not just going to rub off and expose another layer unless it was plated. A copper nickel clad quarter weighs 5.67 grams, and yours is within the weight tolerance for this type of quarter. If it was a silver proof silver quarter it would weigh 6.25 grams.
    So, what you have is just worth 25 cents

    Instagram: nomad_numismatics
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    Project NumismaticsProject Numismatics Posts: 1,335 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @DieHardWithVengence - I think you should spend a couple hours researching the minting process, what types of errors are possible and varieties that can can be found in circulation. That way your time spent searching will be far more productive.

    Unfortunately many of the questions you are asking are not good questions and can be easily eliminated with a basic understanding of the modern minting process.

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    delenda est WitterU

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    yspsalesyspsales Posts: 2,214 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November 25, 2022 10:33AM

    You would probably learn more with both volumes of the Cherrypickers Guide and looking at any of the 30 million coins listed.

    Secondly, buy mint rolls and search for high grade if moderns are your thing. I have scored top pop grades.

    Yes you are wasting your time without a plan.

    I have picked two nice varieties this week.

    One has little value beyond bragging rights.

    The other could be a $3k coin.

    You can earn while you learn if you take advice.

    We all fought that learning curve.

    The answers to your questions have been answered and advice given was honest.

    BST: KindaNewish (3/21/21), WQuarterFreddie (3/30/21), Meltdown (4/6/21), DBSTrader2 (5/5/21) AKA- unclemonkey on Blow Out

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    yspsalesyspsales Posts: 2,214 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Cliff notes version of what MorganDollar1878 and J2035 is that you are looking for coins that don’t exist.

    Primarily due to the modern minting process eliminating mistakes.

    There is the lack of collector interest as well.

    BST: KindaNewish (3/21/21), WQuarterFreddie (3/30/21), Meltdown (4/6/21), DBSTrader2 (5/5/21) AKA- unclemonkey on Blow Out

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    BStrauss3BStrauss3 Posts: 3,163 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @jonathanb said:

    • Modern die preparation makes prepunched mintmarks impossible now

    Repunched

    -----Burton
    ANA 50 year/Life Member (now "Emeritus")
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    Jzyskowski1Jzyskowski1 Posts: 6,651 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Well now
    I do have a nice set of punches and a stout leather strap for repunching and making some interesting errors. But as noted, been a long time since the mint did any fixing with the ole punch✌️

    🎶 shout shout, let it all out 🎶

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    FrazFraz Posts: 1,854 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Jzyskowski1 —There is no image of dead horses beating dead horses to choose.

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    Jzyskowski1Jzyskowski1 Posts: 6,651 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I believe your saying I should receive this?

    Well here’s my response 😽

    🎶 shout shout, let it all out 🎶

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    @Jzyskowski1, @yspsales, @BStrauss3, @morgandollar1878, @J2035, @EagleScout2017, @silverpop, @jonathanb, @MFeld, @ anyone else that replied to this post, refer to my most recent post and riddle me that ok? Pretty sure that doesn’t have any silver content either, but can you explain those previous dates? I’ve tried to be nice and cordial with everyone that deserves it, with everyone that has been respectful, but for a bunch so called “educated” people’s, y’all are pretty damn mean and disrespectful as F. I’ve been a collector of many things from bugs, coins, and rod iron works, to antique art, gold, silver, gems, trading cards, houses, cars, and antique firearms since about the age of 6. I’ve collected thousands and sold thousands of items in my short 33 year lifespan and I didn’t serve my country to be treated like a N00B by the likes of you people. Grow up, move on from your bullied pasts and be genuine and nice to others. The world today is full of negativity and division and y’all are just perpetuating the same problems here with your BS cause you can’t find happiness without tearing others down first. That says more about the kinds of people you are in your own lives than you can imagine. The reason people come here to ask questions is to find answers from the people who have done the research. So you must enjoy educating people, and that’s why you’ve done the necessary research to be able to give answers, and if you don’t, than it doesn’t make sense why you’re still here cause I’m pretty sure being snarky isn’t in the job description of being “highly” educated in any field of study.

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    TreashuntTreashunt Posts: 6,747 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Pareidolia

    Frank

    BHNC #203

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    Jzyskowski1Jzyskowski1 Posts: 6,651 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Diehard.
    You don’t say 😁

    🎶 shout shout, let it all out 🎶

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    yspsalesyspsales Posts: 2,214 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November 29, 2022 7:53AM

    What direction or opinion do you seek?

    I will try again... my opinion

    Do you hunt whitetails?

    No different than trophy hunting.

    Most are happy to set up anywhere and shoot the first deer they see.... pocket change, hunting rolls etc...

    The smart people buy a ticket to Saskatchewan. Let the others do all the work.... ie... lean on market making dealers and buy graded coins.

    The dedicated spend 12 months 24/7 chasing local legends.... search everything about a series and invest time and money into education.

    I am just trying to get you directly to Canada without buying the plane ticket. Cherry Pickers Guide gives you the easy targets.

    The answer you seek?

    Modern minting technology has evolved to the point where most errors are eliminated, and those you find are minor with little collector interest.

    What you are looking at doesn't exist or isn't apparent in the images you post.

    If you need 15X magnification, it isn't interesting to most collectors.

    There is less than a fraction of 0% chance that a Philly mint would have a San Francisco mint mark.

    Ghosting from a die clash? Grease on die? Much more likely and not worth the effort.

    If you do an overlay of the obverse and reverse die in photoshop you might get your answer on the die clash.

    BST: KindaNewish (3/21/21), WQuarterFreddie (3/30/21), Meltdown (4/6/21), DBSTrader2 (5/5/21) AKA- unclemonkey on Blow Out

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    BStrauss3BStrauss3 Posts: 3,163 ✭✭✭✭✭
    1. A scale reading of 5.7g is a rounded value and - best case - would mean the actual weight is between 5.65000...1 and 5.74999..

    2. The standard weight of a coin defines a weight and a tolerance. The standard clad quarter weighs 5.670g.

    I can't easily find an authoritative definition of the tolerance for weight (although ± 0.227 grams is commonly cited), but https://nnp.wustl.edu/library/dictionarydetail/515490 says the strip for the quarter is 0.0545-inch (1.384mm) thick and "must be manufactured within a permitted tolerance of .0015-inch (.038mm) thickness for clad strip of any denomination."

    For the quarter, that is a 2.7% tolerance. A rolled thick quarter could weigh up to 5.82g and still be in tolerance. Similarly, a rolled thin quarter could weigh as little as 5.51g.

    5.72g is within spec.

    Generally, with SPC (Statistical Process Control), only 95% (or 97.5% or 99% or 99.9% or ...) of a sample must be within specs to be considered acceptable. (Yes, I'm aware that for gold coins the law defines an absolute minimum)

    The applicable law (1982) just gives Sec Treasury the power to specify... https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/31/5113

    The standard silver quarter after 1873 is 6.25g of 0.900 fine silver. Thus there is no overlap between a in-spec low weight silver quarter and an in-spec high weight clad!

    1. Since 1989 or 1990 (various years for different coins), the mintmarks are now placed on the working hub. All dies prepared from that working hub have the same characteristics. For a D over S to exist it would appear on multiple, maybe ALL dies and be well known.

    2. High magnification and pixelation = pareidolia. It's a deep evolutionary bias - the downside of running away from an "imaginary" predator at the watering hole are low. The downside of NOT running away are pretty severe.

    Would the loss of silver through circulation cause the coin to appear as though it is brass or bronze in color?

    No, and this is not a silver coin

    Also, if a normal Guam quarter weighs 5.7 grams and this one weighs 5.72, is it safe to assume that it was once silver,

    No

    or do slightly heavier coins make it through on occasion too?

    Frequently

    -----Burton
    ANA 50 year/Life Member (now "Emeritus")

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