Red Sox or Yankees all time starting line up. Which is better ?
Goldenage
Posts: 3,278 ✭✭✭✭✭
Which is better ?
No pitchers.
Ruth can be on both teams.
0
Goldenage
Posts: 3,278 ✭✭✭✭✭
Comments
Yankees. Are these trick questions?
http://www.unisquare.com/store/brick/
Ralph
Funny Brick.
I would have said the Red Sox and Twins.
I think all three proposals are very close.
🙂
I hate the Yankees but I'm not sure how I could piece together a better all time lineup with the Sox over them
I think the Sox have it.
It doesn't really matter. I'm from NY. I don't start watching baseball till October! 😂 🤣
Disclaimer: I'm not a dealer, trader, grader, investor or professional numismatist. I'm just a hobbyist. (To protect me but mostly you! 🤣 )
Come to New York man! You would make a great Yankee fan!! 😉
Disclaimer: I'm not a dealer, trader, grader, investor or professional numismatist. I'm just a hobbyist. (To protect me but mostly you! 🤣 )
Yeah, the pressures on you guys to get it done this year
I'm looking forward to them going out in the divisional round 😄😄😄
You must be kidding, right? The Yankees have had so many great teams, and the Red Sox have had a few very good teams with mostly scrub teams in the middle.
In the 1920s, after Harry Frazee sold all the good players, the Red Sox were terrible. They were so bad, they could afford to have the left field stands burn up and leave them unrepaired because they couldn't sell the seats if they had fixed them.
I'll throw this out there, which will get the Yankee lovers panties in a wad. Ted Williams was a better hitter than anyone the Yankees ever had including Ruth and DiMaggio. His home run totals would have been much higher if he had not lost four years to military service when he was in his prime. Drafting him to fight in Korea after he had served in World War II really sucked. He also played half of his games in Fenway Park which is not friendly to left handed home run hitters.
Ruth played with the "short porch" in Yankee Stadium which added to his home run totals. He also had a season or two in the Polo Grounds which had right field stands that were "just in back of first base." I think he hit 54 and then 59 home runs when he was playing in that band box.
You take the Yankees all time best players at each position and match them against same for Red Sox and it’s VERY close.
Where's the dislike tab!?!? Oh, there it is! 😂 🤣
Disclaimer: I'm not a dealer, trader, grader, investor or professional numismatist. I'm just a hobbyist. (To protect me but mostly you! 🤣 )
I'm actually hoping for a subway series. All the sponsors and networks are as well. 😉
Disclaimer: I'm not a dealer, trader, grader, investor or professional numismatist. I'm just a hobbyist. (To protect me but mostly you! 🤣 )
Make that case cuz I'm not seeing it.
If the Red Sox had so many great players and were that close to the Yankees, why did “the curse of the Bambino” last for so long? Great teams take care of business.
Don’t get me wrong. I am a long time Yankee hater. The trouble is you can’t have one team win all of those championships, and the other one go through years of frustration. Yes, the Red Sox have done well in the 2000s, but it’s nothing like what the Yankees did from Ruth to Judge.
If both teams can have ruth, and you go position by position, it is very close. I am a homer, give me the sox.
Keep in mind, yankees cant have both dimaggio and mantle, has to be one or the other. ruth would be in right for both teams. williams in left is better than any yankees LFer. Tris Speaker in CF. I would take Boggs at 3rd. Nomar at SS, Doerr at 2b, either ortiz or Yaz at 1b and Fisk at C.
I would take my chances with that team vs the all time Yanks lineup
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
as far as the all time rotation, give me the sox all day. the top 3 of Pedro, Clemens and Cy Young would be unmatched by nearly any team.
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
Ruth was mostly a pitcher when he was with the Red Sox. If you exclude pitchers, he can’t be on the Red Sox all time team. He hit 29 homers during he best year with the Red Sox.
thread starters rules state ruth can be on both teams
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
Given that Dimaggio and Mantle played together, they can obviously both be on the Yankees team. This is just me but, if I'm doing all-time lineups, I'll put a CF in LF any day. If you can play CF, you can play LF.
If Ruth is on both teams, so is Boggs - unless you decide that ARod was better. Ortiz is a DH and Gehrig was better than him or Yaz anyway.
If we're just going to make up positions for people to play, and they don't actually have to have played that position, then have Ruth play 2B for the Sox; he was way better than Doerr. Which is to say, Ruth never set foot in RF for Boston (the Red Sox, anyway); if you do this with any connection to reality then you have to choose between Ruth and Williams in LF, and once the Sox don't get both of them they get routed by the Yankee lineup (they would lose anyway).
The Yankees would have an OF of Ruth in LF, Mantle in CF, Reggie in RF, A-Rod at 3B, Jeter at SS, Lazzeri or Gordon at 2B, Gehrig at 1B, and Berra at C. That's HOFers in every single spot, and arguable GOAT candidates at most of them.
I think the Yankees second team could beat quite a few first teams (not the Red Sox):
Meusel-DiMaggio-Winfield
Nettles-Rizzuto-Lazzeri or Gordon-Mattingly
Dickey
Still six HOFers, and two not very far outside of it.
I’ll start here.
Jimmie Foxx had a better lifetime OBP and OPS than Mickey Mantle.
Same amount of HRs too.
Ted Williams in the line up is simply too much to overcome when the rest of each lineup is similar.
Xander and Jeter have the same OPS as do most of the rest.
Ramirez is close enough to Gehrig in OBP and OPS to make way for Ted Williams.
The OBP and power of Ted Williams is the difference maker for me. It’s too much to overcome.
Remember I said it’s very close.
Even though Arod and Ortiz have the exact same OBP and OPS, Ortiz was a Yankee killer and Arod was nothing like him against the Red Sox.
I feel the Red Sox have a huge advantage and win with Ted Williams making the key difference.
A Subway series would be fun to watch, they need to bring the Dodgers back to Brooklyn!
If we did include pitching, but we’re not, then the Red Sox have a big advantage with Lefty Grove, Cy Young, and Pedro. Clemens is a wash.
I feel the Red Sox have the greatest all time lineup and starting four in the history of baseball.
Feel free to disagree.
how in the world did I forget about Foxx!?!?!?! of course he will play 1b for boston.
add lefty grove into the rotation and i will take boston.
ruth played more games in rf, so he would slot there instead of LF.
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
If we play with a DH, it would be Ortiz. not sure who greatest Yankee DH would be, but I believe Ortiz to be the best all time. most put martinez, molitor and thomas as the other top DHs.
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
Ruth is RF. played more there than LF. so you will have to choose between him and Reggie.
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
It’s because of Williams power, a guy who would have hit close to 700 home runs, that the Red Sox beat the Yankees 6 out of 10. Throw in the pitching and it’s an easy 6 out of 10, even though I may sit Pedro and start Schilling 😎
We do use a D.H., and you can slot any outfielders in any position.
then I will take williams, Yaz and Ruth. although Manny was a beast for us in the 00s
boggs, nomar, Doerr, Foxx, Fisk and Ortiz at DH.
Sox Rotation all day:
Pedro
Clemens
Grove
Young
Tiant? Hurst?
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
can you imagine Williams HR numbers had he played in the Stadium? he certainly would have hit 714 there and with the 4 1/2 extra years from the war.
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
I agree...it is much closer than when the question first pops in your head.
Red Sox pitching is ridiculous as craig44 listed above.
But....if we aren't going by what they actually did for the team and as long as they just played on the team at some point then:
The Yankees get Clemens too.....and also get Randy Johnson.
Yes, Clemens is a wash but Grove beats Johnson.
In Pre War time ALL left handed Power/pull hitters had an advantage over their RH league mates. The stadiums were built with more smaller RIght Field porches, and some of the LF were cavernous.
Yes if your measurement is measuring him against inferior leaguemates drawn from a very small talent pool during the pre-war time. That is a completely other topic...and being discussed already.
It is more convincing to be the best among 70 million competitors like Unit was, than it is to be among the best of the 9 million competitors Grove had.
If looking two pitchers and one pitcher throws harder, is seven inches taller, has better command, has the requisite breaking pitch, and proven he can master the art of pitching at the highest level....and was the best pitcher six times in his league in a more competitive talent pool of humans, then there is zero reason to take the lesser Grove.
Johnson has the vastly superior physical tools and the matching results in testing them by being the absolute best in one of the most competitive times in history of baseball That is an unbeatable combo.
Yes, barely, but this just points out the absurdity of allowing the Red Sox to pick Ruth.
Ruth is a Yankee. played more there than Boston. so you will have to choose someone besides Ruth.
And while we're at it, Tris Speaker is an Indian. played more there than Boston.
Picking Ruth to play RF for Boston, something he never did, just squares the absurdity. Willie Mays played one game at 3B; it makes more sense to pick him at 3B for the Giants than it does to pick Ruth as RF for the Red Sox.
If this game is played with anything approaching logic and common sense, the Yankees win in a cake walk.
You earned your LOL. Too bad there isn’t a 10x LOL for that statement.
Babe Ruth played RF in an All Star game. 1933.
https://www.baseball-reference.com/allstar/1933-allstar-game.shtml
1933 All Star game.
What kind of cake would you like on your walk today ?
If you want to go there than Manny is better than Gehrig with his vastly superior tools too. You can’t have it both ways, so I’m not going there.
Ok guys. I’m done here. Very close for sure. I take Sox. You take Yankees. All good. Enjoy your weekend. 😎
Can anyone identify what it is that Goldenage is laughing at, and how the 1933 All Star game is relevant to it? I am truly stumped.
it was just the opposite for williams playing in fenway. teeny tiny left field and very deep right
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
Come on, guys, don't leave me hanging here. Does anyone have a theory, even if it sounds silly, to explain what made Goldenage laugh and what the 1933 All Star game has to do with it? This is driving me crazy!
Not relevant to the discussion but a buddy sent it and figured I'd post-it
ted was a beast
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
If your rules will allow you to use Cobb as your CF on your A's team, then I accept that the Red Sox are competitive. Otherwise no.
So if this is to be meaningful, we need to use players for what they did for the Red Sox and Yankees. I have a couple of caveats. First, I have no idea what to do with Yastrzemski. I just don't have enough "position by position" data for his offense to know if he's good enough to qualify at DH or 1B. Certainly not in LF. So I've left him out. Second, I don't know how to assess the DH position for the Yankees. It appears they've never used a full-time DH and it's hard to weigh the rest of the DHs for the same reason as it's hard to weigh Yastrzemski.
So, based on offense only, I offer lineups with DH first and then positions 2-9. My Yankee 2B is slightly different from that of @dallasactuary because I consider it basically a toss-up with Lazerri over the whole Yankee career and Lazerri played several games away from 2B. So, I see it:
Ortiz
Fisk
Foxx
Doerr
Boggs
Garciaparra
Williams
Speaker
Evans
vs.
Tartabull
Dickey
Gehrig
Cano
Jeter
Rodriguez
Keller
Mantle
Ruth
Considering you only get Foxx from 28-34 and Speaker from 19-27, it's not a contest.
LOL! Obviously you are not considering the 1933 All Star Game!!!