Ike cherry-picking gone bad.

SPalladino

Before the story, tell me what you see in the roll of 1971-S Ike proofs that I purchased on eBay?

(edit: copies of dealer photos)

PipestonePete

Not sure what to look for....Peg Leg variety, perhaps? The clad layering appears to be more defined in the side-view photo of the roll compared to the single coin featured in one of the sellers other photo (which is somewhat disturbing, itself)

Goldminers

Don't feel bad, when I go cherry-picking in my garden, there are always a few with worms. Not every cloud has a silver lining.

FlyingAl

That’s a type one reverse Ike for a 1971. I’d guess it turned out to be a 1973-S?

johnny9434

Psst, put some gloves on to, t.y. 🤫

coinkat

I suspect you ended up with some of the copper-nickel proofs instead of 40% silver? That was my first thought and it seems to pass the straight face test. I hope I am wrong

AlanSki

Everything looks bent or it could be the booze.

jmlanzaf

Oooo....a mystery thread.

I think they are chocolate!!!

SPalladino

@FlyingAl said:
That’s a type one reverse Ike for a 1971.

I saw the same thing - a 1971-S Type 1 Reverse in the photos.

I’d guess it turned out to be a 1973-S?

Good guess, and something I considered as "risk" in bidding to win the auction. IOW, I knew that I could be wrong.

SPalladino

@jmlanzaf said:
Oooo....a mystery thread.

I think they are chocolate!!!

I might have been happy if they were chocolate.

SPalladino

@Goldminers said:
Don't feel bad, when I go cherry-picking in my garden, there are always a few with worms. Not every cloud has a silver lining.

Agree. I have had some nice successes in my eBay cherry-picking over the years, and certainly some failures. There is always the risk of failure in eBay cherry-picking.

AUandAG

Silver on the ends and copper in the middle. Just like being screwed with Morgan rolls that have CC ends.
bob

SPalladino

@johnny9434 said:
Psst, put some gloves on to, t.y. 🤫

The photo added by @PipestonePete was from the eBay listing - not my fingers. And, BTW, may have influenced my decision to try to cherry-pick this listing, figuring that if someone was an idiot enough to hold a proof coin like that, that they also are ignorant enough to not recognize a 1971-S proof w Type 1 Reverse.

alaura22

Just return them and leave negative feedback!

SPalladino

Ok, here is the story.
.
I bid on the roll and won. I was hoping to cherry-pick a 1971-S proof Type 1 Reverse. I was aware of that I was taking a risk, as in any eBay cherry-picking attempt.....the photo may have been stock....I may be mis-reading the reverse depicted and it was instead a 73S, 77S, or 78S Type 3 reverse. But, I figured a worse case scenario was that I got a roll of 1971-S proofs, none with a Type 1 Reverse, but still searchable for other varieties.
.
Instead, the dealer took 12 days to even drop the package at the post-office. And on arrival, the package contained only a 1976 clad proof set. No replies to multiple messages. Now in eBay return and refund assistance. Oh well. Shit happens.

SPalladino

@alaura22 said:
Just return them and leave negative feedback!

Exactly what I did.

SPalladino

My holy grail search for a 1971-S proof Type 1 Reverse continues...

alaura22

How about a link to the dealer on Ebay, I'd like to know to stay away from them

SPalladino

@alaura22 said:
How about a link to the dealer on Ebay, I'd like to know to stay away from them

https://www.ebay.com/usr/sb-shopping-usa-1970

daltex

I'm pretty amused by the winner of the 1969 mint set who left negative feedback because there was no "S mint set".

ricko

Too bad... but was worth a shot. As a result, we know a dealer that 'appears' to be worth avoiding. Cheers, RickO

Connecticoin

Several recent negative feedbacks. This appears to be the classic ebay seller closing shop and screwing the last few customers with non-delivery of high value items.

Type2

I thought cherry picking was when you see what someone else doesn’t see and you know for sure it is what it is. This is what I consider cherry picking I go in to a coin shop ask to see let’s say Kennedy half’s then as I go through them I find all the cherrys like DDO/ DDR or no FG or Accent hair and so on. What would we call this? Maybe fishing.

LanceNewmanOCC

@Type2 said:
I thought cherry picking was when you see what someone else doesn’t see and you know for sure it is what it is. This is what I consider cherry picking I go in to a coin shop ask to see let’s say Kennedy half’s then as I go through them I find all the cherrys like DDO/ DDR or no FG or Accent hair and so on. What would we call this? Maybe fishing.

you know, some may call it a bit harsh but i appreciate the delineation and i agree, not just in this instance but whenever we go looking for a nice score.

for whatever it is worth though, i appreciate the OP sharing. always something to be learned in our threads.

FlyingAl

@Type2 said:
I thought cherry picking was when you see what someone else doesn’t see and you know for sure it is what it is. This is what I consider cherry picking I go in to a coin shop ask to see let’s say Kennedy half’s then as I go through them I find all the cherrys like DDO/ DDR or no FG or Accent hair and so on. What would we call this? Maybe fishing.

There's always an element of uncertainty regarding any cherrypick. In this case, if the seller had shipped the pictured item, then we would have had a $4,000 Ike on our hands. Unfortunately, this didn't happen.

Type2

Ya Lance it looks that way but wasn’t meant to be that way sorry if the OP took it that way or others. I was just pointing it out as a Bait and switch other then a pick dam eBay well send it back good luck on the next one.

LanceNewmanOCC

@Type2 said:
Ya Lance it looks that way but wasn’t meant to be that way sorry if the OP took it that way or others. I was just pointing it out as a Bait and switch other then a pick dam eBay well send it back good luck on the next one.

.
ya, for sure. being BNS is surely not the buyer's fault. nothing wrong with taking some chances. i know i for sure enjoy when people post their experiences despite how it may work out.

i wonder how much easier/more difficult it is to do SNADs as such with ebay managed vs paypal.

davewesen

I dislike sellers that sell with stock photos and do not mention it.

My only 2 returns in last 5 years have been with a seller selling 1981-S proof type 2 coins. Their description and pictures show it, but their delivery does not deliver it. I am not sure if they are purposely committing fraud, or if some of their workers just do not seem to know.

Jzyskowski1

I’m an eBay fan and traveler. I too, enjoy a good cherry pick.
In this case, the picture of the fingers carelessly holding a proof coin, would have been automatic no way for me.
There’s no telling how the others were handled. Hard pass 😁

SPalladino

@Jzyskowski1 said:
I’m an eBay fan and traveler. I too, enjoy a good cherry pick.
In this case, the picture of the fingers carelessly holding a proof coin, would have been automatic no way for me.
There’s no telling how the others were handled. Hard pass 😁

As I mentioned above, the photo of the fingers holding a coin....

may have influenced my decision to try to cherry-pick this listing, figuring that if someone was an idiot enough to hold a proof coin like that, that they also are ignorant enough to not recognize a 1971-S proof w Type 1 Reverse.

.
And, even if held by fingers as such, I would have been happy to cherry-pick a fingerprinted 1971-S Type 1 Reverse, given that there are only 8 of these in PCGS holders, and it is the only registry set Ike not in my registry set. If fingerprinted, I might have considered requesting our hosts to take a restoration stab at it.

SPalladino

@Type2 said:
I thought cherry picking was when you see what someone else doesn’t see and you know for sure it is what it is. This is what I consider cherry picking I go in to a coin shop ask to see let’s say Kennedy half’s then as I go through them I find all the cherrys like DDO/ DDR or no FG or Accent hair and so on. What would we call this? Maybe fishing.

"when you see what someone else doesn’t see and you know for sure it is what it is"...check....at least as well as one can be "for sure" from eBay photos.
"What would we call this?...we would call this "cherry-picking gone bad"

coinkat

I did not want to speculate on the 1971-s type I Proof... the thought did cross my mind but images left some doubt as to clarity... the breast feathers and wings are the key. Further, this seems to be an ongoing issue whereby a mistake likely was made in terms of the wrong lot being sent to the wrong winner. I thought it best to let this run its own course without any further involvement.

I seriously doubt posters to this thread have an appreciation for the true rarity of this coin. And we can write about ignorance but at some point, the 1971-s type I proof needs to be recognized for what it is... perhaps one of the great US proof rarities of the second half of the 20th century. Sadly no one has a vested interest in seeing this coin get the recognition it deserves which is the problem. Those in the know knew this coin existed 15 plus years ago and it has remained one of the numismatic stories that has failed to gain traction or interest because most collectors simply have no idea it even exists. The story surrounding this coin likely is the greatest US numismatic mystery of the 20th century. And if it were a coin within a popularly collected series, it would have been shrined as a must have 20th century rarity... but it so happens to be an Ike Dollar and today there is minimal interest manifested out of ignorance.
And that is perhaps the worst part of the story.

FlyingAl

@coinkat said:
I did not want to speculate on the 1971-s type I Proof... the thought did cross my mind but images left some doubt as to clarity... the breast feathers and wings are the key. Further, this seems to be an ongoing issue whereby a mistake likely was made in terms of the wrong lot being sent to the wrong winner. I thought it best to let this run its own course without any further involvement.

I seriously doubt posters to this thread have an appreciation for the true rarity of this coin. And we can write about ignorance but at some point, the 1971-s type I proof needs to be recognized for what it is... perhaps one of the great US proof rarities of the second half of the 20th century. Sadly no one has a vested interest in seeing this coin get the recognition it deserves which is the problem. Those in the know knew this coin existed 15 plus years ago and it has remained one of the numismatic stories that has failed to gain traction or interest because most collectors simply have no idea it even exists. The story surrounding this coin likely is the greatest US numismatic mystery of the 20th century. And if it were a coin within a popularly collected series, it would have been shrined as a must have 20th century rarity... but it so happens to be an Ike Dollar and today there is minimal interest manifested out of ignorance.
And that is perhaps the worst part of the story.

There were three options for that imaged coin - a 1973-S or 1974-S, a Type 2 1971-S or 1972-S, or a Type 1 1971-S. Given the context, the most likely option is the Type 1 1971-S.

Personally, I think the T1 coins are patterns. We now know another of these coins exists, now the hunt is on .

SPalladino

@FlyingAl said:
There were three options for that imaged coin - a 1973-S or 1974-S, a Type 2 1971-S or 1972-S, or a Type 1 1971-S. Given the context, the most likely option is the Type 1 1971-S.

Personally, I think the T1 coins are patterns. We now know another of these coins exists, now the hunt is on .

.
With respect, there is absolutely no chance that the imaged proof coin was a Type 2 Reverse (either 1971-S or 1972-S proof). That said, there is a possibility that the depicted coin is a non-1971 proof with a Type 3 reverse. I'll know for sure.
.
Wishing you the best on your own hunt for one!

FlyingAl

@SPalladino said:

@FlyingAl said:
There were three options for that imaged coin - a 1973-S or 1974-S, a Type 2 1971-S or 1972-S, or a Type 1 1971-S. Given the context, the most likely option is the Type 1 1971-S.

Personally, I think the T1 coins are patterns. We now know another of these coins exists, now the hunt is on .

.
With respect, there is absolutely no chance that the imaged proof coin was a Type 2 Reverse (either 1971-S or 1972-S proof). That said, there is a possibility that the depicted coin is a non-1971 proof with a Type 3 reverse. I'll know for sure.
.
Wishing you the best on your own hunt for one!

Of course, I agree with you on this. Others may not so I had to acknowledge that T2 coins for the date exist.