MS64+ Eisenhower Dollars
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Posts: 413 ✭✭✭✭
I have collected Ike's for several years and got burned pretty bad on a few of the Proof DCAM 70's when they first made their entrance into the graded realm. I bought into the hype and hoopla and was excited to have a premium certified IKE DCAM 70 with a population of 3. Fast forward a few years and the same coin now has a population close to 100 Proof 70 DCAMs.....and the price has fallen off the cliff due to the plentiful number of coins now available. So my question is this: why there are so few high end graded MS Ike specimens for sale (MS 66 +)? Sure as the sun comes up if I buy one of those high end coins in a few years they will be plentiful in that grade..........but for the last few years it seems the numbers just aren't moving.....and haven't except for maybe 1 or 2. Are people just not submitting them? I look at my UNC mint sets and compare the high points with high end graded Ikes and they appear just as good if maybe not better. I have become a bit gun shy of submitting coins because even the 2021 Morgan's/Peace dollars I submitted didn't fare well with most coming back as MS-69's. :-( I just don't want to take a chance and spend $75 to get a coin graded that will be worth $5 when it comes back. Sadly I'm not an expert in grading or it might make sense to send a few in. Anyone care to comment? Thanks.........and since I saw my FIRST Christmas commercial a few days ago I'll just wish everyone a Merry Christmas and happy holidays now. ;-)
Comments
All Ikes are elusive in MS-65. The most common is probably the '78-D and almost 2% of mint sets contained one. Some dates also appear as Gems in rolls but the '78-D might not be one of them. Some are quite scarce in MS-66. If your sets are better then I'd guess you're grading them too high.
There is never going to be a "glut" of MS-66 Ikes because they just don't exist and never did. This being said there are a few raw coins out there as well as lots of MS-65 coins that can upgrade if market grading dictates which is likely to happen if demand grows strongly enough. In any case I wouldn't worry too much about precipitous price drops in BU Ikes. Proofs come nice and very high grade coins abound. If the market could absorb them there would be even more. But high grade MS Ikes are scarce. I doubt even MS-65's could come out of the woodwork. Sure people are figuring that 2% of two million mintage is 40,000 coins but time has been cruel to these coins because they were very unloved. Many were just tossed in coin registers or hauled off to the bank. Many of the sets have tarnished and the coins spent. Others have been burned in fires or bulldozed into piles of rubbish after a flood. Nearly 40,000 were made (of the most common date in MS65) but most are lost or degraded now.
I believe nice gemmy MS-64 and better Ikes is the sweet spot for collecting right now. Most are available for a little shoe leather and a few dollars and you should find a Gem or two in your searches. MS-65's are cheap enough but pops might soar (for a few dates). MS-66 and 67 are probably safe from manipulation but are pricey.
I collected mint sets for years searching for Gem quarters and didn't see my first MS-65 Ike until 1979 when I found a '77 (second most common Gem). I started looking closer and found a few including every date in mint sets.
Hmmm, interesting topic. Happens to me all the time, price falls by 80% a month after I buy it. Doesn't matter what it is.....silver, gold, etc.
Once in a great while I make a good decision and sell before the drop. But, later find out it continued rising and I should have held on.
Oh, the pitfalls of coins!
bob
With Ikes, that would be my guess.
You can still get some nice S mintmark 40% silver MS ones in high grade, but I think the clad ones are like bag mark magnets and very few are mark free. But that’s just my limited observations from looking for some recently where I ended up getting this one.
Mr_Spud
The obverse does have a ridiculous amount of open field to showcase bags marks and other kisses.
So I'm going to step back and make this a more general response, but a couple of things: Do you have a dealer you can trust who, likely, sees far more coins than you do and might have a better idea of grades? He might be able to give you an idea what might be worth submitting.
Second, if your coin budget is as low as $50 per month it might be worth saving up for a short time for tuition. It might be worth picking three or four of your coins (Ikes) and submitting them. When you get them back, try to figure out why they got the grades they got. Ask around if you can't figure it out. Ask around anyway to see if people agree with you. Seriously, I'm suggesting you consider spending a few hundred dollars in tuition. If your budget is lower than $50 per month than a) you'll probably tie up too much of your coin budget in tuition and b) the coins you're likely buying wouldn't benefit from a trip to PCGS. What I'm saying isn't to be dismissive of the small collector, but rather if you saved up for six months to purchase 2 2021 Morgans, you won't get value or enjoyment putting your collecting on hold for a further 3-5 months just to change their plastic.
Ike dollars seem to be treated casually and often ignored. I have several, some in the mint package still. I picked them up along the way in a couple of multi-buys. Never considered grading them.... Unlikely they are 'special' (grade wise), but will look the next time I pull out that drawer in the coin cabinet. Cheers, RickO
Thanks for the comments everyone..........certainly giving me something to think about. Guess I'd better look really closely to them. I have a couple of coin dealers next to me but they are like car dealers. The cars are spectacular when you buy them, but when you take the car in a week later to trade it in (hypothetically of course) it has somehow lost 75% of it's value and just isn't worth that much on a trade in............... ;-)
Right now the wholesale price on MS-63 Ikes ranges from as low as $3.50 to a high of $4.20
At these prices nice MS-62's and very nice fully lustrous MS-61's are sufficient. A lot of Ikes are charitably called MS-60 even when they are fully lustrous because of bad strikes or excessive marking and often both. Ms-64's rarely bring much premium as do unattractive MS-65's. These are the coins trading as chBU. But attractive Gems and near gem coins are much more elusive. Yes, sometimes you can open an original roll and find all or nearly all MS-64+ but this is the exception and there aren't many of these rolls left anyway. In full Gem (solid MS-65) and better Ikes simply aren't available in any kind of quantity. There are lots of high end proofs and if they are too expensive a PR-69 is very nearly as nice. But there are not a lot of high end MS coins and there never were. There are not a lot of attractive Ikes in any grade at all. Even XF's tend to have problems but attractive mint state coins don't start until MS-64 and only 25% of MS-64's are attractive.
Everyone has his own standards but I personally like coins that are positively better than average in every parameter of grading. This means it has a solid strike by dies that are not yet overly worn and the planchet marking was mostly obliterated. Then the real killer; minimal marking. Of course I also like well centered coins in pristine condition. This only applies to about 3% of mint set coins now days and there aren't many of these left.
I would absolutely not pay huge premiums for most MS-64's or even typical 65's but market price on nice 65's and 66's seems reasonable compared to the supply. 67's are pretty high and pretty scarce. A buyer should study these before considering a purchase. The nice things about 64+ is you can actually get very attractive coins for little or no premium to wholesale. It's just a matter of finding them. Up until a few years ago I'd suggest mint sets but the premium on mint sets is going through the roof. In order to cover the premium you have to be able to actually find winners and this can be tough since they are hiding under layers of tarnish that might or might not come off.