Well, I went back and re-read my OP which hasn't been changed and I can't see what has everyone so upset. What I said is fact and nothing else. If you don't like facts then carry on.
@Maywood said:
Well, I went back and re-read my OP which hasn't been changed and I can't see what has everyone so upset. What I said is fact and nothing else. If you don't like facts then carry on.
"Demise" is a fact? It's a (flawed) opinion. GC is tiny compared to ebay yet you claim GC has risen in the ages of ebay. If that's a "fact" then I'm a talking gooseberry.
@spyglassdesign said: @Maywood yeah... I'd bet some of them are listing coins for tax reasons so they can have a 'shop' with expenses and a loss. They don't really want to sell but they have to make it appear so.
This explanation makes no sense - google the IRS safe harbor rule.
I know people who do this sort of thing (not exactly in coins but same idea). So no, not absurd at all. Just because you don't know about it doesn't mean it doesn't happen.
When I started collecting in ~2012, there was about 5,000-5,500 German coins up for auction on ebay at any given time. I habitually check ebay on a daily basis (which I don't do for GC), so I've seen that number change over time. It's currently at ~3,500 for German coins with the same search criteria. That's a 30-40% reduction in auction listings over the past 10 years. And it's my perception that world coin collecting has only gotten more popular in that timeframe.
I went to my local BM. Thousands of coins with price stickers. Zero auctions.
OP is talking about eBay's demise as an auction site. Personally, if I'm looking for something for my collection, it matters not a bit to me whether I buy it in an auction or a fixed price sale but I'm open to the idea that some people only want to buy coins that are being auctioned.
@derryb said:
ebay is becoming a storefront for sellers who do not want the hassle of overhead and expenses. As such it deals with fixed prices. Many large established retailers are now selling on ebay as well as from their own websites.
David Lawrence has some awesome coins on eBay.
and some fairly high prices. Many large sellers likely use ebay to lure new buyers to their on-line site. Some of my favorite ebay bullion dealers do not offer much of a savings to buy directly from their website. Bullion exchanges is my favorite by boy do they like to stick to their 10% restock fee on ebay cancellations.
Repetition of ignorance is ignorance raised to the power two.
Look at those impressions and page views! Where else am I gonna get 50,000 pairs of eyes on my coins? That's what, 8-10 times the attendance of ANA WFOM?
But you are in the top percentile and as a former grader know exactly what you are doing.
A local shop has a bunch of better date coins with significant problems such as 1886 Liberty nickels, low grade with problems. Certification doesn't make a lot of sense for those, although Anacs has a $10/ coin summer special now. They can sell them raw, people can make offers, problem solved without grading, hard to do that on other platforms.
My guess is that were it not for the OP’s use of the “d(emise)” word in the thread title, this debate would have gone very differently. At best, it was a significant exaggeration, and more accurately, it was incorrect.
I believe that many of us - myself included - upon reading something that appears hyped, exaggerated, etc., tend to focus on addressing and correcting it. At the same time, we largely ignore much or most of the accompanying message. I think that’s what’s occurred here.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
It looks like ebay started reporting how many items a given seller has sold at the bottom of the page together with feedback numbers that are readily visible.
My guess is that really sharp buyers have dedicated programs to comb through new listings to find winning ones and image enhancements to zero in on them to detect hard to see surfaces. When selling they doubtless leave much to chance too.
Look at those impressions and page views! Where else am I gonna get 50,000 pairs of eyes on my coins? That's what, 8-10 times the attendance of ANA WFOM?
But you are in the top percentile and as a former grader know exactly what you are doing.
A local shop has a bunch of better date coins with significant problems such as 1886 Liberty nickels, low grade with problems. Certification doesn't make a lot of sense for those, although Anacs has a $10/ coin summer special now. They can sell them raw, people can make offers, problem solved without grading, hard to do that on other platforms.
For what it's worth, I've been offered jobs as a grader, but never worked as one.
I get where you are coming from though. I'm just showing what is possible with eBay. I'm not a big timer like some of these other eBayers, I'm small fry... yet I can get reach like a much bigger business leveraging eBay's platform.
"It's like God, Family, Country, except Sticker, Plastic, Coin."
We have never auctioned a coin. We probably will never auction a coin. That's not our Biz.
The cost of selling on GC is about the same as our E-bay cost of sales.
We sell through E-Bay, exclusively, since we change our prices regularly depending on the gold market. We cancel listings very often. This year, We put the store on vacation mode somewhat regularly.
Has GC taken some auction biz away from E-Bay? Somewhat. If I strictly wanted to auction an item, I would just as likely use GC. Given their overhead, I'm not sure E-Bay can do much about it. GC is a "lower cost" auction environment (lower sell fee than majors). That's their niche. With that said, if E-Bay truly wanted to improve their standing in the auction biz, they would have to set up an auction time / date so that 100's / 1000's of auctions could go off one after another. As it is, I won't hang around waiting for 1 coin to auction off.
I believe most of us interested in buying and selling watch the GC auction results as well as E-Bay's BIN listings on a regular basis. .
GC cut into E-Bay's auction biz? Sure? BIN biz? solid as ever. Thus, E-Bay's demise?? No.
@spyglassdesign said: @Maywood yeah... I'd bet some of them are listing coins for tax reasons so they can have a 'shop' with expenses and a loss. They don't really want to sell but they have to make it appear so.
This explanation makes no sense - google the IRS safe harbor rule.
I know people who do this sort of thing (not exactly in coins but same idea). So no, not absurd at all. Just because you don't know about it doesn't mean it doesn't happen.
“Not in coins”. Precisely. To classify as a business and not a hobby, the IRS requires you to show a profit in 3/5 trailing years. You can’t deduct business expenses unless you are a …. business. So generating intentional losses makes zero sense if your goal is to deduct expenses.
@neildrobertson said:
I have a single data point for you all:
When I started collecting in ~2012, there was about 5,000-5,500 German coins up for auction on ebay at any given time. I habitually check ebay on a daily basis (which I don't do for GC), so I've seen that number change over time. It's currently at ~3,500 for German coins with the same search criteria. That's a 30-40% reduction in auction listings over the past 10 years. And it's my perception that world coin collecting has only gotten more popular in that timeframe.
Maybe it's your search criteria that need adjusting. A lot of things have changed since 2012, including categories and the search algorithm. I see over 15,000 German coins on eBay right now.
I went to my local BM. Thousands of coins with price stickers. Zero auctions.
OP is talking about eBay's demise as an auction site. Personally, if I'm looking for something for my collection, it matters not a bit to me whether I buy it in an auction or a fixed price sale but I'm open to the idea that some people only want to buy coins that are being auctioned.
OP didn't say that, although we figured it out. But he's still blowing smoke out of his statistical smoke stack. eBay has far more AUCTIONS than GC. Just because the fixed price has been the growth area doesn't really mean anything. We need more data. For example, how MANY auctions was eBay running when GC was formed? It's quite possible that eBay's auction business has grown faster than GC's. The percentage of current auctions tells us nothing about the relative success of either model.
It is also a silly comparison. GC is basically a traditional auction house. eBay is an internet marketplace.
If the OP wants to say that 90% of eBay coin listings are BIN. Fine. But as soon as the comparison and judgment starts, the facts disappear.
If you want a coin AUCTION, eBay still has far more of them than GC.
If you do a search criteria for $20 gold at auction with over one bid, there seem to be fewer and fewer, sellers just don't want to take the risk, same is true with other gold coins, etc. where you take a risk of having items "stolen" if you don't have a reserve.
@MFeld said:
My guess is that were it not for the OP’s use of the “d(emise)” word in the thread title, this debate would have gone very differently. At best, it was a significant exaggeration, and more accurately, it was incorrect.
I believe that many of us - myself included - upon reading something that appears hyped, exaggerated, etc., tend to focus on addressing and correcting it. At the same time, we largely ignore much or most of the accompanying message. I think that’s what’s occurred here.
Demise was clearly click bait. But I would object to the comparison itself, with or without the final assessment. There's nothing in that ebay data that suggests anything about GC. I mean, if ebay were 100% auctions would that mean that ebay was healthier and GC was dead?
@MFeld said:
My guess is that were it not for the OP’s use of the “d(emise)” word in the thread title, this debate would have gone very differently. At best, it was a significant exaggeration, and more accurately, it was incorrect.
I believe that many of us - myself included - upon reading something that appears hyped, exaggerated, etc., tend to focus on addressing and correcting it. At the same time, we largely ignore much or most of the accompanying message. I think that’s what’s occurred here.
Demise was clearly click bait. But I would object to the comparison itself, with or without the final assessment. There's nothing in that ebay data that suggests anything about GC. I mean, if ebay were 100% auctions would that mean that ebay was healthier and GC was dead"l
It wasn’t clearly “click bait” to me. Sometimes people use words that could be improved upon/more accurate. But that doesn’t mean it was intentional.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
We started GC because of the wild west on eBay. We are dealing with yet another fake holder that a collector bought on eBay 6 months ago. It's shocking that eBay can say they are not responsible.
As fake holders get better, what can eBay do?
That is where we have an advantage - aside from inspecting every coin, we also stand behind everything we auction.
I feel it will be eBay’s demise when they are finally held accountable for all of the bogus listings and counterfeits being listed and sold every day. The amount of such listings is phenomenal, and it’s only getting worse.
@erscolo said:
As one who has no interests in auctions, Great Collections brings precious little to the table.
What do you mean by that? If a coin you are interested is listed at Great Collections, you won't bid on it no matter what? If it's worth X to you, why not bid X on the auction? If you win, you win. How does Great Collections bring precious little to the table? They give the buyer a consistent experience over eBay where you have to vet every seller. There's definitely added value there IMO.
@erscolo said:
As one who has no interests in auctions, Great Collections brings precious little to the table.
What do you mean by that? If a coin you are interested is listed at Great Collections, you won't bid on it no matter what? If it's worth X to you, why not bid X on the auction? If you win, you win. How does Great Collections bring precious little to the table? They give the buyer a consistent experience over eBay where you have to vet every seller. There's definitely added value there IMO.
Some people just like to go in and buy something. With an auction, you have to wait for the auction to end and you have no idea what the final price will be. Some people love auctions (the OP). Other people hate auctions. Why do you care if @erscolo prefers the fixed price experience?
@justmenutty72 said:
I feel it will be eBay’s demise when they are finally held accountable for all of the bogus listings and counterfeits being listed and sold every day. The amount of such listings is phenomenal, and it’s only getting worse.
eBay doesn't sell coins. They provide a marketplace for others to do so. That is part of the reason why the OP's comparison is silly on the face of it. If someone commits a crime, would you also arrest their landlord?
@ianrussell said:
We started GC because of the wild west on eBay. We are dealing with yet another fake holder that a collector bought on eBay 6 months ago. It's shocking that eBay can say they are not responsible.
As fake holders get better, what can eBay do?
That is where we have an advantage - aside from inspecting every coin, we also stand behind everything we auction.
Ian
Really? You're "shocked"?
If I use the proceeds of a GC consignment to buy guns and ammo to engage in a mass shooting, are you going to take responsibility?
eBay is not the seller of coins. They provide a marketplace. That marketplace has some protections for buyers and sellers, but there are limits. As you point out, you have the advantage of handling all the coins to make assessments. eBay does not and, therefore, has limited ability to ascertain authenticity.
If I defraud someone by a phone phishing scam, would you hold the cell company liable for the crime?
I would assume that even GC has limits to what they guarantee, do they not? If PCGS changes their mind on a coin that you sold 5 years ago, does GC make the buyer whole or do you expect PCGS to do it?
I like GC. I buy from GC. But GC is not eBay nor does it even occupy the same space. GC does not offer me what eBay offers me. And eBay does not offer me what GC does. And that is true from both the buyer and the seller end. The comparison borders on silly.
@MFeld said:
My guess is that were it not for the OP’s use of the “d(emise)” word in the thread title, this debate would have gone very differently. At best, it was a significant exaggeration, and more accurately, it was incorrect.
I believe that many of us - myself included - upon reading something that appears hyped, exaggerated, etc., tend to focus on addressing and correcting it. At the same time, we largely ignore much or most of the accompanying message. I think that’s what’s occurred here.
Demise was clearly click bait. But I would object to the comparison itself, with or without the final assessment. There's nothing in that ebay data that suggests anything about GC. I mean, if ebay were 100% auctions would that mean that ebay was healthier and GC was dead"l
It wasn’t clearly “click bait” to me. Sometimes people use words that could be improved upon/more accurate. But that doesn’t mean it was intentional.
I don't know. But I don't see the OP either back-tracking or correcting the statement. In fact, he seems to be doubling down on his original post.
@MFeld said:
My guess is that were it not for the OP’s use of the “d(emise)” word in the thread title, this debate would have gone very differently. At best, it was a significant exaggeration, and more accurately, it was incorrect.
I believe that many of us - myself included - upon reading something that appears hyped, exaggerated, etc., tend to focus on addressing and correcting it. At the same time, we largely ignore much or most of the accompanying message. I think that’s what’s occurred here.
Demise was clearly click bait. But I would object to the comparison itself, with or without the final assessment. There's nothing in that ebay data that suggests anything about GC. I mean, if ebay were 100% auctions would that mean that ebay was healthier and GC was dead"l
It wasn’t clearly “click bait” to me. Sometimes people use words that could be improved upon/more accurate. But that doesn’t mean it was intentional.
I don't know. But I don't see the OP either back-tracking or correcting the statement. In fact, he seems to be doubling down on his original post.
Not entirely - in one of his posts, he included "... Maybe I used the wrong word, demise,.."
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
@MFeld said:
My guess is that were it not for the OP’s use of the “d(emise)” word in the thread title, this debate would have gone very differently. At best, it was a significant exaggeration, and more accurately, it was incorrect.
I believe that many of us - myself included - upon reading something that appears hyped, exaggerated, etc., tend to focus on addressing and correcting it. At the same time, we largely ignore much or most of the accompanying message. I think that’s what’s occurred here.
Demise was clearly click bait. But I would object to the comparison itself, with or without the final assessment. There's nothing in that ebay data that suggests anything about GC. I mean, if ebay were 100% auctions would that mean that ebay was healthier and GC was dead"l
It wasn’t clearly “click bait” to me. Sometimes people use words that could be improved upon/more accurate. But that doesn’t mean it was intentional.
I don't know. But I don't see the OP either back-tracking or correcting the statement. In fact, he seems to be doubling down on his original post.
Not entirely - in one of his posts, he included "... Maybe I used the wrong word, demise,.."
None of us can read everything. Or at least we shouldn't.
And besides, you have a very good excuse, as you're no doubt, preoccupied with that 13 year-old eBay issue.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
@MFeld said:
None of us can read everything. Or at least we shouldn't.
And besides, you have a very good excuse, as you're no doubt, preoccupied with that 13 year-old eBay issue.
@MFeld said:
None of us can read everything. Or at least we shouldn't.
And besides, you have a very good excuse, as you're no doubt, preoccupied with that 13 year-old eBay issue.
LOL. I'm never going to live that down. But at the moment, I have too much eBay business to be pre-occupied with my 13-year-old issue. I can barely get my papers graded and my boxes packed over these last couple of weeks. I'm very curious as to what fall will look like. Summer is usually slower, but this summer has been insanely active. If Fall sees a further increase in activity...smh...it's going to get CRAZY out there!
@MFeld said:
None of us can read everything. Or at least we shouldn't.
And besides, you have a very good excuse, as you're no doubt, preoccupied with that 13 year-old eBay issue.
@MFeld said:
None of us can read everything. Or at least we shouldn't.
And besides, you have a very good excuse, as you're no doubt, preoccupied with that 13 year-old eBay issue.
LOL. I'm never going to live that down. But at the moment, I have too much eBay business to be pre-occupied with my 13-year-old issue. I can barely get my papers graded and my boxes packed over these last couple of weeks. I'm very curious as to what fall will look like. Summer is usually slower, but this summer has been insanely active. If Fall sees a further increase in activity...smh...it's going to get CRAZY out there!
And yet, you do have plenty of time to post frequently here! Just sayin.....
Seated Half Society member #38 "Got a flaming heart, can't get my fill"
@MFeld said:
None of us can read everything. Or at least we shouldn't.
And besides, you have a very good excuse, as you're no doubt, preoccupied with that 13 year-old eBay issue.
@MFeld said:
None of us can read everything. Or at least we shouldn't.
And besides, you have a very good excuse, as you're no doubt, preoccupied with that 13 year-old eBay issue.
LOL. I'm never going to live that down. But at the moment, I have too much eBay business to be pre-occupied with my 13-year-old issue. I can barely get my papers graded and my boxes packed over these last couple of weeks. I'm very curious as to what fall will look like. Summer is usually slower, but this summer has been insanely active. If Fall sees a further increase in activity...smh...it's going to get CRAZY out there!
And yet, you do have plenty of time to post frequently here! Just sayin.....
Lol. Oddly. Not as much as I used to. I'm just reading fewer threads.
@neildrobertson said:
I have a single data point for you all:
When I started collecting in ~2012, there was about 5,000-5,500 German coins up for auction on ebay at any given time. I habitually check ebay on a daily basis (which I don't do for GC), so I've seen that number change over time. It's currently at ~3,500 for German coins with the same search criteria. That's a 30-40% reduction in auction listings over the past 10 years. And it's my perception that world coin collecting has only gotten more popular in that timeframe.
Maybe it's your search criteria that need adjusting. A lot of things have changed since 2012, including categories and the search algorithm. I see over 15,000 German coins on eBay right now.
There are over 80,000 German coins on ebay right now. I was referring to auctions specifically. It's not very generous of you to assume that I have no idea what I'm talking about rather than actually try to understand what I'm saying.
I buy on great collections to fill blanks and upgrade my sets then turn around and most of the time flip the stuff I no longer want for a profit on ebay.
Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value. Zero. Voltaire. Ebay coinbowlllc
I now prefer BIN or BIN with an offer as I seem to get blown away on most true auctions since prices started increasing in 2020. The raw coin discount is shrinking at least in my ponds.
@ianrussell said:
We started GC because of the wild west on eBay. We are dealing with yet another fake holder that a collector bought on eBay 6 months ago. It's shocking that eBay can say they are not responsible.
As fake holders get better, what can eBay do?
That is where we have an advantage - aside from inspecting every coin, we also stand behind everything we auction.
Ian
Really? You're "shocked"?
If I use the proceeds of a GC consignment to buy guns and ammo to engage in a mass shooting, are you going to take responsibility?
eBay is not the seller of coins. They provide a marketplace. That marketplace has some protections for buyers and sellers, but there are limits. As you point out, you have the advantage of handling all the coins to make assessments. eBay does not and, therefore, has limited ability to ascertain authenticity.
If I defraud someone by a phone phishing scam, would you hold the cell company liable for the crime?
I would assume that even GC has limits to what they guarantee, do they not? If PCGS changes their mind on a coin that you sold 5 years ago, does GC make the buyer whole or do you expect PCGS to do it?
I like GC. I buy from GC. But GC is not eBay nor does it even occupy the same space. GC does not offer me what eBay offers me. And eBay does not offer me what GC does. And that is true from both the buyer and the seller end. The comparison borders on silly.
eBay offers better buyer protection than the BST does.
@ianrussell said:
We started GC because of the wild west on eBay. We are dealing with yet another fake holder that a collector bought on eBay 6 months ago. It's shocking that eBay can say they are not responsible.
As fake holders get better, what can eBay do?
That is where we have an advantage - aside from inspecting every coin, we also stand behind everything we auction.
Ian
Really? You're "shocked"?
If I use the proceeds of a GC consignment to buy guns and ammo to engage in a mass shooting, are you going to take responsibility?
eBay is not the seller of coins. They provide a marketplace. That marketplace has some protections for buyers and sellers, but there are limits. As you point out, you have the advantage of handling all the coins to make assessments. eBay does not and, therefore, has limited ability to ascertain authenticity.
If I defraud someone by a phone phishing scam, would you hold the cell company liable for the crime?
I would assume that even GC has limits to what they guarantee, do they not? If PCGS changes their mind on a coin that you sold 5 years ago, does GC make the buyer whole or do you expect PCGS to do it?
I like GC. I buy from GC. But GC is not eBay nor does it even occupy the same space. GC does not offer me what eBay offers me. And eBay does not offer me what GC does. And that is true from both the buyer and the seller end. The comparison borders on silly.
eBay offers better buyer protection than the BST does.
Just sayin'.
Absolutely. BST buyer protection is the honor system.
@ianrussell said:
We started GC because of the wild west on eBay. We are dealing with yet another fake holder that a collector bought on eBay 6 months ago. It's shocking that eBay can say they are not responsible.
As fake holders get better, what can eBay do?
That is where we have an advantage - aside from inspecting every coin, we also stand behind everything we auction.
Ian
Really? You're "shocked"?
Yes, I am shocked. Because if there was any other company that hid behind "we're just a marketplace, we're not responsible line", they would be shut down for selling fake coins and fake products.
Comments
101,818 total listings.
16.049 auctions.
about 16%.
what's your point?
I use to do auctions every week. no longer.
I have over 700 certified BIN listings.
Things change and you must adapt.
I view eBay a huge mega marketing advertisement for eyeballs that is the least expensive ad campaign on planet earth.
Well, I went back and re-read my OP which hasn't been changed and I can't see what has everyone so upset. What I said is fact and nothing else. If you don't like facts then carry on.
@ErrorsOnCoins said:what's your point?
I'm talking about eBay as an auction site, reread the OP and that should be clear.
That is a heck of a Jump from 11,000!!
WS
"Demise" is a fact? It's a (flawed) opinion. GC is tiny compared to ebay yet you claim GC has risen in the ages of ebay. If that's a "fact" then I'm a talking gooseberry.
I went to my local BM. Thousands of coins with price stickers. Zero auctions.
I know people who do this sort of thing (not exactly in coins but same idea). So no, not absurd at all. Just because you don't know about it doesn't mean it doesn't happen.
https://www.the4thcoin.com
https://www.ebay.com/str/thefourthcoin
I have a single data point for you all:
When I started collecting in ~2012, there was about 5,000-5,500 German coins up for auction on ebay at any given time. I habitually check ebay on a daily basis (which I don't do for GC), so I've seen that number change over time. It's currently at ~3,500 for German coins with the same search criteria. That's a 30-40% reduction in auction listings over the past 10 years. And it's my perception that world coin collecting has only gotten more popular in that timeframe.
IG: DeCourcyCoinsEbay: neilrobertson
"Numismatic categorizations, if left unconstrained, will increase spontaneously over time." -me
OP is talking about eBay's demise as an auction site. Personally, if I'm looking for something for my collection, it matters not a bit to me whether I buy it in an auction or a fixed price sale but I'm open to the idea that some people only want to buy coins that are being auctioned.
and some fairly high prices. Many large sellers likely use ebay to lure new buyers to their on-line site. Some of my favorite ebay bullion dealers do not offer much of a savings to buy directly from their website. Bullion exchanges is my favorite by boy do they like to stick to their 10% restock fee on ebay cancellations.
Repetition of ignorance is ignorance raised to the power two.
@derryb said: Many large sellers likely use ebay to lure new buyers to their on-line site.
Yeah, you might call that "click bait" or something similar.
I feel like we need closure on the 3 cent nickel saga before we can move on to other topics
But you are in the top percentile and as a former grader know exactly what you are doing.
A local shop has a bunch of better date coins with significant problems such as 1886 Liberty nickels, low grade with problems. Certification doesn't make a lot of sense for those, although Anacs has a $10/ coin summer special now. They can sell them raw, people can make offers, problem solved without grading, hard to do that on other platforms.
My guess is that were it not for the OP’s use of the “d(emise)” word in the thread title, this debate would have gone very differently. At best, it was a significant exaggeration, and more accurately, it was incorrect.
I believe that many of us - myself included - upon reading something that appears hyped, exaggerated, etc., tend to focus on addressing and correcting it. At the same time, we largely ignore much or most of the accompanying message. I think that’s what’s occurred here.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
actually, it is free advertising.
GC's success has nothing to do with the popularity of ebay.
Repetition of ignorance is ignorance raised to the power two.
i am selling things on e bay that i had listed for 18 months, glad i am not buying, sellers are getting pretty much what they want
It looks like ebay started reporting how many items a given seller has sold at the bottom of the page together with feedback numbers that are readily visible.
My guess is that really sharp buyers have dedicated programs to comb through new listings to find winning ones and image enhancements to zero in on them to detect hard to see surfaces. When selling they doubtless leave much to chance too.
I hardly do auctions on eBay. It’s a retail store for me. An exception might be something trades close to melt.
I do buy auc stuff off the bay to retail at shows / online.
For what it's worth, I've been offered jobs as a grader, but never worked as one.
I get where you are coming from though. I'm just showing what is possible with eBay. I'm not a big timer like some of these other eBayers, I'm small fry... yet I can get reach like a much bigger business leveraging eBay's platform.
"It's like God, Family, Country, except Sticker, Plastic, Coin."
We have a very small E_bay store.
We have never auctioned a coin. We probably will never auction a coin. That's not our Biz.
The cost of selling on GC is about the same as our E-bay cost of sales.
We sell through E-Bay, exclusively, since we change our prices regularly depending on the gold market. We cancel listings very often. This year, We put the store on vacation mode somewhat regularly.
Has GC taken some auction biz away from E-Bay? Somewhat. If I strictly wanted to auction an item, I would just as likely use GC. Given their overhead, I'm not sure E-Bay can do much about it. GC is a "lower cost" auction environment (lower sell fee than majors). That's their niche. With that said, if E-Bay truly wanted to improve their standing in the auction biz, they would have to set up an auction time / date so that 100's / 1000's of auctions could go off one after another. As it is, I won't hang around waiting for 1 coin to auction off.
I believe most of us interested in buying and selling watch the GC auction results as well as E-Bay's BIN listings on a regular basis. .
GC cut into E-Bay's auction biz? Sure? BIN biz? solid as ever. Thus, E-Bay's demise?? No.
As one who has no interests in auctions, Great Collections brings precious little to the table.
“Not in coins”. Precisely. To classify as a business and not a hobby, the IRS requires you to show a profit in 3/5 trailing years. You can’t deduct business expenses unless you are a …. business. So generating intentional losses makes zero sense if your goal is to deduct expenses.
You and me both.
Maybe it's your search criteria that need adjusting. A lot of things have changed since 2012, including categories and the search algorithm. I see over 15,000 German coins on eBay right now.
OP didn't say that, although we figured it out. But he's still blowing smoke out of his statistical smoke stack. eBay has far more AUCTIONS than GC. Just because the fixed price has been the growth area doesn't really mean anything. We need more data. For example, how MANY auctions was eBay running when GC was formed? It's quite possible that eBay's auction business has grown faster than GC's. The percentage of current auctions tells us nothing about the relative success of either model.
It is also a silly comparison. GC is basically a traditional auction house. eBay is an internet marketplace.
If the OP wants to say that 90% of eBay coin listings are BIN. Fine. But as soon as the comparison and judgment starts, the facts disappear.
If you want a coin AUCTION, eBay still has far more of them than GC.
If you do a search criteria for $20 gold at auction with over one bid, there seem to be fewer and fewer, sellers just don't want to take the risk, same is true with other gold coins, etc. where you take a risk of having items "stolen" if you don't have a reserve.
Demise was clearly click bait. But I would object to the comparison itself, with or without the final assessment. There's nothing in that ebay data that suggests anything about GC. I mean, if ebay were 100% auctions would that mean that ebay was healthier and GC was dead?
It wasn’t clearly “click bait” to me. Sometimes people use words that could be improved upon/more accurate. But that doesn’t mean it was intentional.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
We started GC because of the wild west on eBay. We are dealing with yet another fake holder that a collector bought on eBay 6 months ago. It's shocking that eBay can say they are not responsible.
As fake holders get better, what can eBay do?
That is where we have an advantage - aside from inspecting every coin, we also stand behind everything we auction.
Owner/Founder GreatCollections
GreatCollections Coin Auctions - Certified Coin Auctions Every Week - Rare Coins & Coin Values
I feel it will be eBay’s demise when they are finally held accountable for all of the bogus listings and counterfeits being listed and sold every day. The amount of such listings is phenomenal, and it’s only getting worse.
Do you not like the bidding process? Have you ever tried our auctions?
Owner/Founder GreatCollections
GreatCollections Coin Auctions - Certified Coin Auctions Every Week - Rare Coins & Coin Values
What do you mean by that? If a coin you are interested is listed at Great Collections, you won't bid on it no matter what? If it's worth X to you, why not bid X on the auction? If you win, you win. How does Great Collections bring precious little to the table? They give the buyer a consistent experience over eBay where you have to vet every seller. There's definitely added value there IMO.
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Some people just like to go in and buy something. With an auction, you have to wait for the auction to end and you have no idea what the final price will be. Some people love auctions (the OP). Other people hate auctions. Why do you care if @erscolo prefers the fixed price experience?
eBay doesn't sell coins. They provide a marketplace for others to do so. That is part of the reason why the OP's comparison is silly on the face of it. If someone commits a crime, would you also arrest their landlord?
Really? You're "shocked"?
If I use the proceeds of a GC consignment to buy guns and ammo to engage in a mass shooting, are you going to take responsibility?
eBay is not the seller of coins. They provide a marketplace. That marketplace has some protections for buyers and sellers, but there are limits. As you point out, you have the advantage of handling all the coins to make assessments. eBay does not and, therefore, has limited ability to ascertain authenticity.
If I defraud someone by a phone phishing scam, would you hold the cell company liable for the crime?
I would assume that even GC has limits to what they guarantee, do they not? If PCGS changes their mind on a coin that you sold 5 years ago, does GC make the buyer whole or do you expect PCGS to do it?
I like GC. I buy from GC. But GC is not eBay nor does it even occupy the same space. GC does not offer me what eBay offers me. And eBay does not offer me what GC does. And that is true from both the buyer and the seller end. The comparison borders on silly.
I don't know. But I don't see the OP either back-tracking or correcting the statement. In fact, he seems to be doubling down on his original post.
Not entirely - in one of his posts, he included "... Maybe I used the wrong word, demise,.."
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
I apologize if I missed that post.
None of us can read everything. Or at least we shouldn't.
And besides, you have a very good excuse, as you're no doubt, preoccupied with that 13 year-old eBay issue.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
LOL. I'm never going to live that down. But at the moment, I have too much eBay business to be pre-occupied with my 13-year-old issue. I can barely get my papers graded and my boxes packed over these last couple of weeks. I'm very curious as to what fall will look like. Summer is usually slower, but this summer has been insanely active. If Fall sees a further increase in activity...smh...it's going to get CRAZY out there!
…for those who elect to nitpick words ( I understand they matter) , I believe the OP meant well.
And when we read a coin is " white, lustrous" ..... you can bet it's been dipped, which isn't cleaning. It's conserving, for those liberal thinkers.
Demise is death. So what if it's greatly exaggerated. They sell panties by the bunch, on eBay. We get them in a bunch, here.
And yet, you do have plenty of time to post frequently here! Just sayin.....
"Got a flaming heart, can't get my fill"
Lol. Oddly. Not as much as I used to. I'm just reading fewer threads.
There are over 80,000 German coins on ebay right now. I was referring to auctions specifically. It's not very generous of you to assume that I have no idea what I'm talking about rather than actually try to understand what I'm saying.
IG: DeCourcyCoinsEbay: neilrobertson
"Numismatic categorizations, if left unconstrained, will increase spontaneously over time." -me
I buy on great collections to fill blanks and upgrade my sets then turn around and most of the time flip the stuff I no longer want for a profit on ebay.
Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value. Zero. Voltaire. Ebay coinbowlllc
I now prefer BIN or BIN with an offer as I seem to get blown away on most true auctions since prices started increasing in 2020. The raw coin discount is shrinking at least in my ponds.
eBay offers better buyer protection than the BST does.
Just sayin'.
Absolutely. BST buyer protection is the honor system.
Yes, I am shocked. Because if there was any other company that hid behind "we're just a marketplace, we're not responsible line", they would be shut down for selling fake coins and fake products.
Owner/Founder GreatCollections
GreatCollections Coin Auctions - Certified Coin Auctions Every Week - Rare Coins & Coin Values