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FrIdAY meTaL PoRN!!! GO BIG OR GO HOME!

WeissWeiss Posts: 9,922 ✭✭✭✭✭

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We are like children who look at print and see a serpent in the last letter but one, and a sword in the last.
--Severian the Lame

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  • WeissWeiss Posts: 9,922 ✭✭✭✭✭

    :)

    Someone brought in a run of Mexican gold. You know the thing: 50 peso, 20 peso, 10, 5, and 2. But also this.
    It's a Maximilian token--a very tiny gold token. Part of a Mexican tradition, where seven (or 13) of these were given by the groom to the bride's family. I'm guessing big gold coins were given by those able, but these roughly 1/2 gram gold pieces were used by those without lots of money.
    They're common in jewelry (earrings, pinkie rings). And the newer ones can be gold plated. The "B" maker's mark on the reverse bottom indicates this is probably an early one--meaning 1930s to 1950s, and is likely at least 90% pure gold.

    We are like children who look at print and see a serpent in the last letter but one, and a sword in the last.
    --Severian the Lame
  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Weiss... Thanks for the back story... I was wondering what it was when viewing the OP... One question... the numbers seven or thirteen as dowry gifts... and significance to the two numbers? Cheers, RickO

  • WeissWeiss Posts: 9,922 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @ricko said:
    @Weiss... Thanks for the back story... I was wondering what it was when viewing the OP... One question... the numbers seven or thirteen as dowry gifts... and significance to the two numbers? Cheers, RickO

    Quite a history and apparently some people like the deep dive. This is from ATS in 2007, a poster named Roman:

    Mexico Gold Token Overview
    Mexican gold tokens began being produced in 1949 and continues to this day. They range from 8k to 22k gold, and a few varieties were also struck in silver. By in large, Mexican gold tokens are mostly related to Maximilian who ruled Mexico from 1864-1867. In addition, there are tokens bearing both Maximilian and his wife Carlota; tokens bearing Cuauhtemoc, the last emperor of the Aztecs; and tokens bearing Augustin I Iturbide who ruled Mexico from 1822-1823. I list each of these categories separately and also have separate listings for miscellaneous tokens that don't fit within those types, and listings for small-sized gold copies of Mexican gold coins. These tokens are commonly referred to as Mexico Gold Fantasy tokens, but have also been misrepresented on Ebay and elsewhere as the original coins, or gold 1 Peso coins. They were made for collectors, jewelry use, tourists visiting Mexico, and as marriage tokens. Although a number of these were used as marriage tokens, none are marked as such. Non-gold marriage tokens such as these were made specifically for that purpose. (See Forrest Stevens website for excellent information and variety listings of Marriage/Arras tokens.)

    Varieties
    As this project has progressed, I am continually amazed at how many different varieties are being found. We've come a long way from the Krause world coin catalog mention of "5 varieties". Distinguishing between a die variety and simply varying die states is problematic when it's difficult to tell whether you're dealing with multiple dies made off one master or simply repolishing and re-engraving of a die when a die develops problems. For now, I'm just listing everything I find in the most organized way I can. I have knowingly listed die states separately in the case of Maximilian Unknown Maker 1(UM1) #4f, 4g and 4h since I found that progression most interesting. At any rate, I'll continue to list everything I can while constantly revising how the list is presented. PricingBeing as modern as they are, no particular varieties command huge prices. Most tokens can be had in the $10-20 range. The most recent Italian-made tokens are readily available on Ebay. The English-made tokens, so far as I have seen, are always found in jewelry - usually 9k rings so they will cost more to obtain. On average, Max tokens where his profile is facing left will cost more than those where his bust is facing right. Other token types such as Maximilian & Carlota, Agustinus, & Cuauhtemoc usually are found in the $20 price range.

    Weights and Measurements
    Weights and measurements can be a tricky area. They will often differ from one person to another. In the case of diameter, it is not unusual to find differences of ±.03mm. Similarly, thickness can vary easily depending on how lightly or firmly a caliper is pressed against the coin. It's not unusual to find differences of ±.01mm in the thickness. Given the size of these coins, such slight differences make accurate deductions as to the gold content difficult. However, once you handled these coins for awhile you get a feel for whether they are real gold or not and can sometimes approximate the karat. With regard to weight, differences are usually seen coin to coin. Makers of these aren't held to the quality control standards of a major Mint. Weights can vary, as do planchet sizes.

    We are like children who look at print and see a serpent in the last letter but one, and a sword in the last.
    --Severian the Lame
  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Weiss ... Thanks for the further information. Looked around a bit, still have not found information on dowry quantity. Might be just commensurate with family wealth. Cheers, RickO

  • ashelandasheland Posts: 22,561 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I got this earlier this week:
    1/2 gram

  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Weiss ..... Reference your 'balanced coins' picture.... Much spare time??? :D Cheers, RickO

  • ashelandasheland Posts: 22,561 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Cladiator said:
    Here's my Perth Mint poured set, old logo. The 20 is my favorite but the 5 is the rarest.

    I really like those! I have the 10, but nothing else. I believe the 5 is rarest and the 20 is probably not far off. Awesome set! 👍

  • CladiatorCladiator Posts: 17,917 ✭✭✭✭✭

    One of these days I hope to complete the set with the 100oz'er. Probably a pipe dream though...

  • LukeMarshallLukeMarshall Posts: 1,881 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Cladiator said:
    One of these days I hope to complete the set with the 100oz'er. Probably a pipe dream though...

    I want one of these 250oz Perth’s…

    (Crappy internet photo)

    It's all about what the people want...

  • CladiatorCladiator Posts: 17,917 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Good Lord! I didn't know those existed LOL

  • LukeMarshallLukeMarshall Posts: 1,881 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Cladiator , and now you have something to look forward to after the 100ozer !

    It's all about what the people want...

  • StaircoinsStaircoins Posts: 2,564 ✭✭✭
    edited September 12, 2022 5:18AM

    @ricko said:
    @Weiss ... Thanks for the further information. Looked around a bit, still have not found information on dowry quantity. Might be just commensurate with family wealth. Cheers, RickO

    RickO - see here for an explanation of the 13 coin quantity. (I was curious about that myself!) https://www.brides.com/wedding-coins-5077506

    I found other sources saying the 13 coin quantity represents Christ and the 12 apostles. I couldn't find a source for any 7-coin dowry. Possibly it represents money on each day of the week?

    Interesting to learn about these traditions.

  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Staircoins... Thank you for that informative link. Makes the tradition clear and the reasoning behind the thirteen coins - as well as stating the traditional metals. Cheers, RickO

  • WeissWeiss Posts: 9,922 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Great article, @Staircoins !

    We are like children who look at print and see a serpent in the last letter but one, and a sword in the last.
    --Severian the Lame
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